Lessons from a Field Mouse

Status
Not open for further replies.
Police drill

I don't know why the police were coming in for a drill? They are a reactionary force and show up after every thing has happened. I'm not putting them down, but it's a fact, that everything is over with, most of the time.

The drill should be conducted by the class to fight back; oh sorry I forgot, if a kid gets in a fist fight today, he's a criminal. School teaches not to fight back. Be a sheep, maybe they won't kill you. Liberal way.
 
The embedded link in the OP didn't work when I tried it, I think it'll work now. That said, here's the story from the link. The bolding in the story text is mine-

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,333069,00.html

Mock Gunman Drill Terrifies Students, Faculty at North Carolina University
Wednesday, February 27, 2008

ELIZABETH CITY, N.C. — Elizabeth City State University is offering counseling to faculty and students after some became unknowing participants in an emergency response drill.

The News & Observer of Raleigh reported in Wednesday's editions that an armed man burst into a classroom Friday, threatening to kill students. The drill came eight days after a gunman killed five people and himself in a classroom at Northern Illinois University.

Anthony Brown, vice chancellor of student affairs, said ECSU was testing its response to such shootings. E-mail and text messages were sent five days before the drill, notifying students, staff and faculty, he said.

"The intent was not to frighten them but to test our system and also to test the response of the security that was on campus and the people that were notified," Brown said.

But not everyone got the word, including assistant professor Jingbin Wang, whose American foreign policy class was held hostage.

"I was prepared to die at that moment," Wang said Tuesday of the moment the gunman entered the room.

At 1:31 p.m. Friday, e-mail and text messages were sent, saying: "This is a test. ECSU is holding a test drill where an armed intruder will enter a room in Moore Hall and be detained by campus police."


The campus police officer who played the role of the intruder carried a red plastic model gun, the school said in a news release.

In a telephone interview Tuesday, Wang said the man came to the door and said he wanted to talk. "Suddenly the man pointed the gun at me," he said, adding that he didn't have time to consider whether the gun was real.

The seven students were lined up against the wall, and the intruder threatened to kill the one with the lowest grade point average. Wang said the man told them that he had been kicked out of school and that he needed a lung transplant.

After about 10 minutes, campus police ended the drill by subduing the man.

In April, 32 students at Virginia Tech were killed by student gunman Seung-Hui Cho. That shooting has led schools to examine their emergency plans and conduct safety drills.

For example, UNC-Greensboro held an active shooter exercise in January that was attended by law enforcement and university officials from around the state. But students were not on campus when the drill was held during winter break.
============

The original newspaper story I saw regarding this incident pointed out several items of interest. First, there were NO DETAILS given in the early announcements about exactly what was going to happen. Second, though the messages were sent out by text messaging, a significant percentage of the student body does not subsribe to the service and therefore did not receive the messages. The administration aparently wanted to test the ability of the student body to spread messages by 'word of mouth.'

If I can find the original story I'll post it. I can assure you all that the incident has received serious review on other campuses within the UNC system as an example of what NOT to do.

lpl/nc

ETA- See the related thread on THR at http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=343335

Here's the original story I saw on the event. Again, bolding in the text is mine. You get to decide whether later stories are more accurate reporting or just spin to make the campus administration look better.
==========================================================

http://www.wtkr.com/global/story.asp?s=7923804

Local College Causes Stir With Gunman Drill
Posted: Feb 25, 2008 07:26 PM

Some Elizabeth State University students are upset after being almost scared to death by a recent safety drill on campus.

On Friday, an undercover campus officer barged into a history class in the Moore building and held the class hostage. According to students, he even held a gun to the professor's head! It was all part of an emergency alert system drill that the school was planning for months. Problem is...not everyone knew it was a drill.

Four days earlier, the school did begin sending out emails to students saying there would be some sort of emergency drill on Friday. It did not specify where or exactly what time the drill would occur. It also did not mention the nature of the drill.

Then, on Friday, a few minutes before it all went down, the school sent out an alert saying there would be an armed intruder in Moore building who would be detained by campus police. Again, it did not specify which classroom. However, only about half the campus has voluntarily signed up for the instant text alerts to their phones, so most people in that particular classroom, including the professor in that class, had no idea it was a drill.

By phone on Monday morning, Professor Jingbin Wang said he was shocked and did not know it was a drill. "Everyone was scared," he said. He said some students were prepared to jump out the window. Another colleague told him that her students were using tables and chairs to block the door of their classroom. "Her heart was racing," he said about his fellow teacher.

"I cannot believe a university would subject their own students to such a horrific event," one family member of a student in that classroom wrote us. " They were terrified! It is extremely poor judgement on the part of the administration at ECSU."

Effective training for students in the wake of the Virginia Tech and Northern Illinois University shootings? Or a safety drill taken one step too far?

Vice Chancellor of Student Affairs Anthony Brown took our questions Monday afternoon.

"If there are people who have concerns and they were surprised, it was not our intention to surprise or shock anybody and if that occurs we are there for them," said Brown. "I really offer our sincere apology, because that was not the intent of this."

Then we asked him point blank, "Don't you think a normal person would be shocked if the person coming at their professor with a gun was a campus officer?

"Well, we did send out emails five days in advance and continued it through with alerts," said Brown.

We then pointed out that those initial alerts did not mention a gunman!

"No," he said. "That alert occurred on the day, on the day of the event."

So then we pressed further, that isn't it true that the school was absolutely aware that not all students would get that alert because not all students are signed up for the alert.

"That's absolutely true," he said. "That's where we have to test out the system and our communication among each other. Because if your neighbor knows something and you don't that tests something, that tests the communication. We should look out for each other, so that's something we learned. Paper and text and emails are one thing, but word of mouth is perhaps most important."

Again, word of mouth obviously did not spread around in time for the students in this classroom to get the warning this was a drill.

One student we talked to requested a private meeting with administration regarding her terrifying experience during the drill.

For now, the school is standing by the drill, saying that the administration, campus police and students learned from the experience. More drills are planned.

If you would like to sign up for the school's alerts to come instantly to your cell or your email, head to http://www.ecsc.edu and look for the sparkly icon at the very top of the homepage called PIER Emergency Communications System.
==============================================================
 
I'm wondering .... If they'd staged the clust... er... drill in an Underwater Basketweaving 101 class, and Junior Bumpus, the star linebacker is in there, and hasn't read (because, well, he can't...) his campus e-mail for a few days, would Junior get penalized for damaging the "shooter?"

I'd LOVE to see one of those stories...
 
Whatsup

OK Meef tell me what's really bothering you? :what: I know hunting season is mostly over, and I'm bored too. I do like this site, and I get some information and really enjoy the reading and comments.

I'm fixin to go and do a little Bass fishin with my grandson this Saturday. Little Dave is 7 and my other is 12.
The 12 year old just got a Hawg last weekend. It was his first one and He was ecstatic as well as his Daddy and little brother. I wasn't there, but I wished I was for that one. I got the phone call from my son and could hear the boys yelling and all excited, in the background. It was a one shot instant kill that he made with a 243. :D
 
I don't know why the police were coming in for a drill? They are a reactionary force and show up after every thing has happened. I'm not putting them down, but it's a fact, that everything is over with, most of the time.

The drill should be conducted by the class to fight back; oh sorry I forgot, if a kid gets in a fist fight today, he's a criminal. School teaches not to fight back. Be a sheep, maybe they won't kill you. Liberal way.

+1 to make it realilistic for the police everyone in that room would have to be dead.
 
Hmm. I've had more than one professor go over what to do in this sort of event, and I bring it up to the other professors at the start of the year, and none have objected to going over it.

If someone bursts into the classroom with a gun, everyone is to simply throw everything they have at the gunmen. Heavy books, water bottles, desks, chairs, anything to can get in the air. Fighting back seems like common sense, but some people need to be told that they are allowed to fight back. If a gunman is looking for easy targets, he can find them elsewhere.

It seems silly to have to have this discussion with the class, but if we spend the first 15 minutes of every first day going over what to do for a fire or tornado, we might as well go over what to do in the event of an attack.
 
I had my own experience with mouse self defense when I was 3-4. My cat was worrying a mouse trapped up against the side of the house. I felt sorry for the poor mouse, so I scooped it up in my teeny hand and scolded the cat. Then I felt something strange in my hand. I looked, and that ungrateful mouse had its teeth sunk into my index finger.

I screamed, tossed the mouse, and ran in to momma. Had to go to the doctor, and get a tetanus booster.

Learned several lessons that day.

But yes, a mouse will defend itself.
 
Haven't we all learned this lesson a thousand times over. There are people in life who will sit and pray for help in a bad situation. There are people who will act and pray that their actions are successful in a badd situation, or give thanks afterwards that their actiosn were successful. We here on this board and other boards train hoping that is those situations occur to us, we will be one of those who act, not one of those who sit and pray for spiritual intervention
 
It is now known that the actual response isn't just "fight or flight" it's "fight, flight, or freeze."
 
Actually (and I'm speaking from about 3-4 college psych classes and some extracurricular reading, nothing more)...

No one ever stated that "fight or flight" response will occur every time people are exposed to danger. It's actually a real hormonal and physical state, though. In other words, the ideal response to danger is to go into "fight or flight" mode.

It's obvious that for a large majority of the population, this ability and the advantages that come with it are compromised. What's ironic, to me, is that lots of people's stress response is so messed up, they get the "fight or flight" response in traffic, or when someone disagrees with them in a conversation, rather than when it would really come in handy.

The fight or flight mechanism is basically an endocrine response to stress, with epinephrine and adrenaline release. It potentiates the nervous system, sometimes allowing mothers to lift cars that are on top of their babies, people to outrun bears, etc.

But, the misuse by modern people of this hormonal fallback system is also sometimes attributed to consistently increased cortisol levels and other bad stuff that in the long term that may result in inflammatory diseases like Alzheimer's and heart problems.

So...no one is considering renaming it to "fight, flight or freeze"; more like people are just that ass-back'erds these days. No revelation really. But don't get the "fight or flight response" confused with the spectrum of options that are available to people in a bad situation. Hope this was clear.
 
In other words, the ideal response to danger is to go into "fight or flight" mode.

Yes, but the point being made by NeverAVictimAgain was that "fight or flight mode" is a misleading name whereby "freeze" is a common response that is part of the fight or flight mode.

The freeze response is one whereby the potential prey animal (including people) remains still. This serves to keep from having attention draw to it. Since movement often draws attention, remaining still can be very beneficial. The trick is to understand when you need to remain still and when you need to flee or fight.
 
The professor in that particular classroom didn't read campus announcements for five days, so he didn't know that it was a drill. That gave the Fox News reporters an idiot to interview.

The guy's a dummy and it's his own fault if he got the bejeezus scared out of him. Every time we have a fire drill we always have some stupid teacher who refuses to leave his or her room saying that the drill is a waste of precious class time. Yeah, and when a real fire breaks out, I'm sure your decision will help your precious kids.

These drills DO need to be done.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
If any of you have attended a major university in the last 5 years you would know that providing your cell phone number to the administration isn't required. Most in the classroom probably never received the text message. If they sent it via official school email even fewer probably received it.

just because they sent out a warning didnt mean the ysent it via a viable means.
 
The educators feel the need to drill submission and submissive behavior into our children from kindergarten on. It is your god given right and duty as a parent to teach them self defense and when to use it.They told my kids if they were a victim of an attack at school, that they would face the same punishment as the attacker if they fought back.I believe I have done my part to make sure they know what to do and when.Las time my son was suspended for fighting back, I took him for a boat ride and a nice lunch.
 
The pencil won't go in far enough, I've tried it on my brother (he had it coming). You're actually much better off with a heavy object like part of a desk or even better a GLASS like a pilsner cup or a Coke bottle. I've seen what those can do to someone, and it looks like a bear has been at them. Very easy to kill with one.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top