A buddy and I went out to some private land to do some shooting today and while we were warming up with our pistols his XD had a light primer strike. He immediately ejected the round and loaded it back into the mag. I told him that when he has a light primer strike he needs to use the "20 second rule" by keeping the muzzle pointed down range in a safe direction for 20 seconds before handling the round. He looked at me pretty puzzled which made me wonder if the twenty second rule is actually a rule or if its just one those things you hear that doesn't really hold any water. I had a light primer strike last week and used the 20 second rule before ejecting the round but even then I was nervous because in my mind if the primer is unstable I don't want anything to do with it. After having negligent discharge some time ago (with the barrel pointed in a safe direction) I have been obsessed with safety and I'm wondering if that is the best way to deal with light primer strikes. Any thoughts, experiences, or feedback?
Light primer strike safety question
- Thread starter ryno31
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toivo
Member
Definitely wait a good long time -- 20 seconds sounds about right. If it hasn't gone off by then, chances are it isn't going to, and you can eject it and dispose of it.
If this happens while you are using your handgun to defend your life, of course, then disregard the above advice. Eject that sucker as fast as you can, and get back to shooting.
If this happens while you are using your handgun to defend your life, of course, then disregard the above advice. Eject that sucker as fast as you can, and get back to shooting.
Ehtereon11B
internet infantryman
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I don't get light primer strikes often but when I do, it all depends on how I am shooting when it happens. If I am doing a high stress shooting drill I will eject the round immediately. If I am just punching holes in paper to verify sights, going for accuracy, breaking in a new pistol etc I will wait to see if the round cooks off.
Centurian22
Member
With the vast expanse of cumulative experience on here I'm curious to know has ANYONE ever had a hangfire? If so how long what type of ammo (factory, hand load ect.)?
I'm not saying it can't happen, I'm not saying its worth the risk. I'm just curious. I myself tend to wait at least 5-10 seconds and preferably a little longer, especially with centerfire cartridges. I'll admit I get complacent (ONLY about waiting on misfires nothing else) with .22's, especially my older ammo that I know has problems.
I'm not saying it can't happen, I'm not saying its worth the risk. I'm just curious. I myself tend to wait at least 5-10 seconds and preferably a little longer, especially with centerfire cartridges. I'll admit I get complacent (ONLY about waiting on misfires nothing else) with .22's, especially my older ammo that I know has problems.
Patrick Gookin
Member
I was shooting some surplus 8mm Mauser ammo out of a K98 a couple years ago and I had to have chosen the worst batch of 8mm surplus ammo ever. Every other round was a hang fire. The firing pin would strike and the primer would ignite 5 seconds later. I stopped shooting a handfull of rounds in. The rifle fired new ammo perfectly. Now I'm pretty weary whenever I get a hangfire and usually wait a good minute or two.
Even though my original question was about how to safely deal with light primer strikes the possibility of a hangfire has got me wondering? Do modern weapons/ammunition pose a hangfire risk or is it that more of problem when dealing with older ammo? Please forgive my ignorance on the subject as I grew up shooting guns but these issues were never really addressed other than adhering to the "20 second rule" when the gun goes click instead of bang and you know there is a round chambered.
I'm my 53 years of shooting, I've had very few light strikes/misfires but I've never had a delayed fire. My experience is they either go boom immediately or not at all. But that is not to say it doesn't happen, just hasn't for me.
Patrick Gookin
Member
If I'm not mistaken, I believe old primers were made with mercury. I think the primers became unstable if improperly stored for a long time, which is probably what happened with the surplus ammo I had. From what I've read, newer primers are composed of much more stable components, but that shouldn't stop you from keeping the muzzle down range in case of a "click".
Ehtereon11B
internet infantryman
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I had a hangfire with a kel-tec (now sold) using Winchester White Box. I wasn't completely sure it was a hangfire until I watched the video, since I record most range sessions. The trigger was pulled and released, but the bullet fired almost a full second later.
So maybe it should be a 2-second rule
But yes, that is kind of crazy....although if it happened so fast you had to look at the video replay to know for sure, I do think 20 seconds is probably a bit extreme, with modern ammo. I wonder if the "rule" also is an antiquated rule of thumb from blackpowder days.I've had my share of click-no-bang's, but only one with a centerfire cartridge, and never had a hangfire. I do agree it is a bit nerve-racking when you eject that round. Even a .22 exploding in your face would be unpleasant.
Maybe someone should make a poll....
1SOW
Member
Never had a hang-fire: 9mm, .22 and some 45ACP. Have had three 9mm primers fail to fire with multiple strikes. WIN and two (one recently) FED SPPs.
At the range I wait a few seconds. In a match, it's ejected fast and press on. I later found it and tried it again--no bang.
At the range I wait a few seconds. In a match, it's ejected fast and press on. I later found it and tried it again--no bang.
Centurian22
Member
I didn't do a poll (mostly because I'm not sure how or if it can be done from mobile) but I did create a separate thread asking about hangfires.
Like Patrick, I have had hang fires with surplus ammo that had some indications of poor storage. Some of it was 7.62x59 with purple primer but can't remember the country it came from, some .303 Brit that was very old with cordite powder. The delay was only 2 or 3 seconds, enough so you picked up my head, taking my eyes off the sites when it went off.
I've had tons of 1940's era surplus British .303 ammo that had a 2-3 second delay in something like half the rounds I fired.
I'd get a click, then a few seconds later when I was expecting it to be a dud it would go off. I became extra careful when shooting that type of ammo after that, I have no doubt that it would be BAD if one of those bad boys went off after ejecting the casing.
I'd get a click, then a few seconds later when I was expecting it to be a dud it would go off. I became extra careful when shooting that type of ammo after that, I have no doubt that it would be BAD if one of those bad boys went off after ejecting the casing.
1KPerDay
Member
Only hangfire I've had with modern centerfire ammo was Winchester "universal" 12 gauge from wal-mart. less than half a second, but theoretically I could have opened the breech to clear it and been hurt. Crap ammo.
ny32182
Member
I eject them immediately. Usually I will reload them into the mag a few minutes later and they almost always fire on the second strike. This is with hard Tula primers in my M&P and in that gun they do like to light strike occassionally.
The only place I've ever even heard about hangfires is the internet. Just my experience.
If it is fully out of the chamber and pops it is not likely to be a big deal at all unless it is actually cupped in your hand; I do have one buddy who had to get some small metal shards pulled from his palm in this scenario with a very rare "ejector fire" while clearing a live round and cupping his hand over the ejection port.
The real worst case scenario with a hangfire would be if it popped while still mostly in the chamber/slightly out of battery right at the beginning of the mechanical motion to eject it. Then you'd be looking at a strong chance of a wrecked gun and possible injury. However the chances of a hangfire with the ammo I shoot, coupled with the precise timing that would have to occur to generate this situation, is so remote my concern level for that ever happening is zero.
The only place I've ever even heard about hangfires is the internet. Just my experience.
If it is fully out of the chamber and pops it is not likely to be a big deal at all unless it is actually cupped in your hand; I do have one buddy who had to get some small metal shards pulled from his palm in this scenario with a very rare "ejector fire" while clearing a live round and cupping his hand over the ejection port.
The real worst case scenario with a hangfire would be if it popped while still mostly in the chamber/slightly out of battery right at the beginning of the mechanical motion to eject it. Then you'd be looking at a strong chance of a wrecked gun and possible injury. However the chances of a hangfire with the ammo I shoot, coupled with the precise timing that would have to occur to generate this situation, is so remote my concern level for that ever happening is zero.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
Train like you fight.
If you practice waiting 20 seconds after a light strike?
Thats what you will do when someone is shooting at you.
Light-strike or mis-fire = Immediate action drill (Tap-Rack-Bang ) and pick up the dud round when you get done shooting.
I have only had a very few true hang-fires in nearly 60 years of shooting.
In every case, it was with very old mil-sup rifle ammo of foreign manufacture.
I have had a few "cook-offs' too.
But in every one of those, it was with a smoking hot full-auto M14 or M16 rifle.
You can't get a handgun barrel hot enough to have a cook-off.
rc
If you practice waiting 20 seconds after a light strike?
Thats what you will do when someone is shooting at you.
Light-strike or mis-fire = Immediate action drill (Tap-Rack-Bang ) and pick up the dud round when you get done shooting.
I have only had a very few true hang-fires in nearly 60 years of shooting.
In every case, it was with very old mil-sup rifle ammo of foreign manufacture.
I have had a few "cook-offs' too.
But in every one of those, it was with a smoking hot full-auto M14 or M16 rifle.
You can't get a handgun barrel hot enough to have a cook-off.
rc
Same here.
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