load to hot but why

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bruce1

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load some 308 using 180 gr hornady sp flat base with cannular used win 748 45 grains win primers set them to the depth the book said. used mixed used brass and crimped them with a lee factory crimp. well it blew one primer right out of the case an flattened 2 others and the bolt was hard to get open after each shot asked a local guy i know that loads and he says there is no way that happened with that load so i tore a couple apart an it is as i said.they said to make sure it wasn't touching the lands? i guess thats what ya call them co checked that it's good. shooting a savage model 11. ??????????????????????
 
That's right at the top end for that powder and bullet, and obviously too hot for your particular rifle - you should be starting at about 41gr and working up a grain at a time to find the max for your individual rifle. Could be your scale is off a little, or thick brass, or short throat in your rifle but the solution is the same. Lucky if you didn't blow out your extractor and ejector, my buddy's Savage did that on his first blown primer.
 
Also, just to dot your I's and cross your T's... Did you buy the Win 748 yourself or pick it up second hand? Also do you own any other powders that look like 748?

Most likely your scale is off though.
 
Start low, go high.

Not start high, go low.

Walkies pretty much nailed that one..........

FWIW you dont need to crimp them, and its entirely possible that you crimped them extremely too hard- but thats a tough call without a pic. Extreme crimp + heavy load + too short seating + low volume brass = problem.

Take all of the variables out.

Start back at the base of your charge table.

During load development, sort your brass by headstamp at the minimum- by weight if you'd prefer more accurate results.

Dont crimp....
 
Not that it would have anythng to do with what happened, but don't bother using a crimp for a bolt action application.

Then I would double check to make sure you haven't made a possible mistake with powder identification. It wouldn't be the first time someone has made that error.

How long have you been reloading, and how long have you been reloading for this cartridge?

In truth, I think powder charge is the most likely culprit though, be it an improperly zeroed scale, or an improperly functioning scale.

GS
 
So in addition to the above do also check your COL and see if you are pushing the bullet into the lands.

I have loaded 180's in my 308 and the COL is much shorter than with a pointy bullet. The ogive on a 180 is way out there by comparison. So a hot load stuffed into the lands will spike your pressure right up there.

Take one of the loaded rounds, paint the bullet with a magic marker. Chamber it and see if there are any marks up around the nose.

One of the first early lessons I learned in reloading is that you must know your chamber dimensions. All rifles are different and not necessarily SAMMI spec. I found out that my Ruger #1 had a fairly short chamber after I was stuffing fairly hot rounds into the lands. It ruined the brass by expanding the primer pockets. Hate to think what it would have done to a lesser rifle!
 
Just one comment, when I buy a new pound of powder I always go to the cashier and during the checkout process I remove the cap from the container to make sure the seal hasn't been broken. I have found containers without the seal intact.
 
been reloading about 2 months. took a class b4 i started. as far as poweder i only have 748. was told it would make a good all around powder for what i want. don't have money to try alot of different things.checked the scale by weighing the bullets they all weigh around 180. pulled the rounds apart the powder looks like 748.weighed all the charges there all right at 45. marked one with a marker no markes on it when place in the weapon. don't have a clue. guess i need to be more careful and start lower b4 i blow myself up.
 
Are you reloading brass that was fired in the same rifle or range pickup?
If it was your own brass did neck size or full length size?
If you full length sized do you have a case gauge to ensure that your full length die is set up properly?
Was the brass trimmed to be within spec?
You were already asked if the bullets were touching the rifling.

I know that my Savage has a pretty tight chamber so I always start 10% below maximum and work my way up.
 
Yes it does, and case length as well. Too long and it could be pinching the bullet. If you answer the questions asked by posters they can be more likely to help you figure it out.
 
FWIW, max charge for the 180 gr as he lists per hodgdon is 46.5, with a 2.8 COL.

In my speer book, it runs 41 to 45 grs, and specifies a magnum primer.

In my Hornady book, it does not list 748 for 180 gr bullets. Given that they are Hornady bullets, mebbe that tells you something. In reality, I doubt it- but ya never know. You can call them (Hornady) for load data- they will find it if they have it. I've called them before on what I thought was simple stuff- and they don't have it, so thats a mixed bag.

The cannelure length for loading on that bullet is 2.740... If you are using load data for 2.800, and seating the bullet to 2.740, you are increasing pressure there too, as I noted may be possible.

Now, for my advice- which is free, and worth exactly that :

Please, start over.

Get a load manual, follow recipes exactly - component, powder, primer, even brass if you can at first.

It sounds like you've mixed a few pieces of the recipe up on your first time out of the gate- part of it from here, part of it from there, unknown components.... I'm glad you are OK, but you are in some dangerous turf right there.

Stop.

Grab all your tools.
Sort all of your components.
Verify every part of your recipe.
Then load - from the bottom up.

Before you charge a case- make 5 dummy rounds using fully prepped brass, and seat the bullet to the length you want them at.

Measure them. Length, width at three points on the case, neck diameter.

Chamber the rounds. One at a time. Look for marks- extractor on case, case on chamber, rifling on bullet, anything untoward whatsoever.

If you find marks, find out what they are, and how they are getting on your piece...

We can certainly help you- but as everyone has noted, we need to know exactly what you have, what you've done, and what you haven't.

What manual are you using ? What rifle ? What brands/headstamps of brass ? Is it cold where you are at ? Is it hot ?


Reloading is a lot of finding out what you like and are comfortable with, and what your rifle likes and are comfortable with. Its a process, and there is a lot to learn. Like a fine lady, they all have tells. Unfortunately, you just jammed to third base on her doorstep. Didn't work out that well, eh ?

S'ok- many have done it. Get 'er some flowers ( Clean the gun and all mechanisms. Look for points of undue wear and tear- and allow yourself extra time for chamber inspection, and internal surface cleaning) , and lets smooth out the wrinkles, shall we ?
 
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SP vs BTSP

180 gr hornady sp flat base

Also, remember that loads for a flat base (SP) will be higher pressure than for a boat tail bullet (BTSP).

If the load was/is for a BTSP, it's going to be higher pressure when using a flat base.

Also, if these are military cases (7.62) the case volume IS less than a 308 commercial case. That will cause higher pressure too.
 
FWIW, max charge for the 180 gr as he lists per hodgdon is 46.5, with a 2.8 COL.

That load data is with a Winchester case with a large case capacity.

Also, remember that loads for a flat base (SP) will be higher pressure than for a boat tail bullet (BTSP).

If the load was/is for a BTSP, it's going to be higher pressure when using a flat base.

Also, if these are military cases (7.62) the case volume IS less than a 308 commercial case. That will cause higher pressure too.

Thank you, fuzzy, that's exactly where I was trying to go with this.

Don
 
So why did you continue to fire more after you blew a primer, flattened two others and constantly had a hard bolt to open? at the first sign of problems shut things down. be safe and good luck in figuring things out.
 
I think Don is going down the path that components make a huge difference and so does the rifle you use.

And he is 100% right.

When developing loads start at the low end of the recommended values and work your way up.

Funnies can happen just changing bullets. I was shooting a 1000 yard match with my 308 Win. Used 190 SMK's and was on target for the first match. Second match I used 190 Hornady Match with the same powder charge, case and primer. I was running out of SMK's and figured, it will be close. It was not. The Hornady bullets were hitting the berm, about 12 feet low. When I got on target they were keyholing.

Little component changes make big differences with maximum loads.
 
well i guess ya all figured out im a rookie but tried everything finally got the pressure problemes under controll with the 180's with 748 had to get down to 39 grains but accurcy sucked.so i borrowed a little varget from a friend used several different loads but got 38.5 to do the job 1 little ragged hole with 3 shots at 80 yards just sitting on the ground . don't have no fancy long place to shoot. i was hopeing for 1 powder to do all my rifles but just didn't work out. i load 223 and 35rem with 748 and it does great just wouldn't work for my 308 savage model 11
 
Varget is a classic powder for a .308 for anything longer than a 22 inch barrel. I have found it to be a bit slow for a 20 inch barrel.

Varget also works great in .223!
 
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