Long range tactical matches

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warth0g

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I would like to compete in such a match. What is out there. Im traveling from Europe. I dont now how I will fare against you americans, but thats what I would like to find out! My setup is a 308 bolt rifle with a PMII 10 X scope. I also compete in IPSC rifle and pistol(with an L1A1 and a G17), but long range comp is definetly most interesting. Unfortunately matches are very few over here. Any suggestions?

thanks,

Warthog
 
Yes, okay which match would you recomend then?

If I could recomend one over here it would be the "finn-sniper" match which are held in guess where , FInnland. It was the Lapua sniper match before. Will (probably) be an article about last years match in "combat arms annual" this year. David Fortier was there writing an article. Suposedly a couple of americans teams should be there but they never showed. Anyway that was a great match in my opinion, and my team went up from 13. the year before to 6. last year.

warthog
 
I am working on making it to the match you mention.

As far as comps here, we seem to be lacking field-style "hike and shoot" matches, but there are quite a number of more stationary practical rifle exercise matches: TACPRO, Rifles Only, Tiger Valley.

Last year my organization (Colorado Multigun) ran a 2-man team event of the hike-n-shoot style, but we're doing something different this year (got a better venue).

I have heard god things about the Allegheny Sniper Challenge, but have never made it out that way yet.

There is the ITRC up in Gillette WY.

There is also the Steel Safari at the Blue Steel Ranch in Logan NM.

We are running monthly "hike" matches down in Raton NM, but they are just half-day local matches.

I don't keep up on all the stuff going on in other parts of the country-- you should check out SH and see what is going on in the areas you want to be.

hope this helps
Zak
 
Excellent, that gives me something to start with.

Finn-sniper match will be interesting this year, they have good stages but fairly low round count. They do have some new ideas this year. No laser range-finders though, gives it an extra edge!


warthog
 
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You'll need an ATF Form 6 to take your own firearms into the U.S. Not a big deal, but your airline may have some rules too. Suggest you have a look at the IDPA and IPSC sites. Start here though. http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/index.htm
Then plan your trip. I can attest, as a Canadian who has been to U.S. matches, that you'll have a great time. How you place really doesn't matter.
 
wart0g:

My shooting partner and I have registered for the 2007 Finn Sniper Competition on Lohtaja. Could you please give me some insight into this competition? We will be traveling from Texas, USA to attend.

Thanks
 
Rwdavidson, looking forward to meet you at Finn-sniper!

The comp is held at an coast-artellery reserve training camp. The shooting range is on and near the beach. The beach is very sandy, as beaches tend to be. We can shoot very long distances but i doubt taht the comp will have targets beyond 800 meters, but 1000 meters is a possibility. The two matches I have been to had a fairly low round-count, but every shoot was extremely important, because you get paid a lot for 1. shoot hits. 100 points for first shoot hit, 50 for second and 10 for third shoot hit. SOme stages you only got 1 shoot to complete the stage.
One stage was a "runner" so some training with movabel targets is a good idea.
Remember no digital or electronic devices for rangefinding, learn to use mil-dot or similar methods.
One of the stages you (probably) get accsess to the ninght before so you can make a range-map, the targets are hidden but you can range some other objects out in that field.
You shoot as a team, spotter-shooter and at every stage you swap roles.
Last year we also had two non-shoooting stages one were we had to crawl in a shallow ditch, while the RO were looking in a heat.camerea, infra red camerea, or what it is called, if we didnt get caught it was full score, pretty damn exhausting experience! The last stage was orientering through the woods towards the camp, find a post and avoiding a mine-field.
TIme limit on both this stages was reasnoable.
You also get scored on beahvior in the shooting position, getting in and out of position, and camoflage. A ghillie suit is a must. Face paint is also important.
But, the shooting is what gives most points by far.
Weapons used is Sako TRG 42, AI, SSG69, SOme custom Mauser actions, custom rifles from FInnland, A lot uses 338 LM, some 6,5 sweedish, 308, 6,5-284.
The match is run by excellent easy-going people, most of them speak very good english, some dont speak that good, but comunication is not a problem.
THis year I have heard ruomers of having some defensive shooting as well, but thats not official, but that will highten the round count a bit.
The suronding area is rural, Lohtaja is a small town with a grocery store and a gas-station, so you get what you need for that weekend. You sleep in the barracks used for the reservist, two man to a room, and get dinner and lunch at the mess hall. At this board i gave a report from the 2005 comp.:
http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=22740&highlight=warthog

warth0g:)
 
Hey where can one get information on the Finn-Sniper match. Sounds like fun...
 
I need to check with my club in france if someone wants to try it with me for fun...

However the dates are going to clash with the Paris Airshow... aircraft are my first love.... decisions....decisions...decisions...
 
Why not try F-Class competition? It is shot all over the world.

One good place to start is Long-Range.com: http://www.long-range.com/
You have to sign up to get to the forums but the information is worth it.

Also, the NRA UK site has information on F-Class: http://www.nra.org.uk/

The "tactical" matches have no standard rules. They make up their rules as they go along. NRA F-Class rules are the same all over the world. From Europe to South Africa.
 
USPSA and IDPA are not long range. CMP and Benchrest are not tactical.The afore mentioned disiplines are shot accross the contry and have established rules that can be down loaded off the web. There is no "tactical" game I know of that is shot nation wide. All the tactical matches I've seen advertised are different and have different rules. I am willing to learn.
 
I was making the point using an analogy: All those organizations have set but different rules, just as so-called "tactical" or "hunter" matches have set but different rules. That rules are different does not mean they are "made up as they go along".
 
I'm sorry, I must have missunderstood. Being that Warthog is from Finnland and is looking for world wide long range competition I thought he may be interested in F-Class.

By saying "They make up their rules as they go along" I mean that there is no national or international standard of rules. Is there a national or international so-called "tactical" or "hunter" match organization that holds regular matches?

F-Class rules are the same everywhere and are shot in monthly competitions all around the world. Being able to equip for and train under a standard set of rules for a specific type competition I would think is a good thing.

I do not mean to degrade tactical shooting in any fashion and wish you well with your matches.
 
Highmaster; Thanks for the input! Im a Norwegian thogh, but no offence taken, the Finns are great people!
I know of F-class, uvfortunately it is not any who organize those matches here.
But, I like matches with as few rules as possible:

1. Handle all firearms as if they were loaded.

2. Never point the gun at anything you're not willing to destroy.

3. Keep your finger off the trigger and out of the trigger guard until you have made the decision to fire the weapon.

4. Know your target, and know what is beyond the target.

These are in an ideal world all the rules you need. With good stage design you can create an enviroment that test the shooter for different part of markmansship, do you want to give benchrest guns an advantage you create a stage wich starts at a firing line with benches...Or you can make a stage where you have to walk 2 miles before you find the targets, then a 12 kilo rail-gun will be next to useless. Or you can make a stage with lots of targets, and use a timer which will give the AR-types a head start, and so on.

This is what I like about the tactical sort of matches, you get an shooting task, then solve it as good as you can with the equipment you choose, not what an rule-book tells you what you may use.


warth0g:)
 
Warth0g:

Thanks very much for the information and the link to your pictures from the 2005 match.

Are the competitors using drag bags for their rifles? I hear no mention of them in your commentary, nor do I see any in the pictures.

Second question: What paper work did you need to enter Finland with your rifle and gear? (Important question post 911.)

Thanks for you help.

Richard
 
No one used drag bags, as far as I know.

Paper work entering finnland with firearms for an US citisen, I dont know because all I needed was the norwegian license.
This is what i got for an answer last year:
"For importing and legal possession of firearms and ammunition you will need European Union Firearms Passport, this is available from your local police. Norwegian citizens will require Norwegian firearm license. Citizens of other countries will require Finnish temporary firearm license."

Here is a unofficial translation of the finnish "firearms act"
http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokset/1998/en19980001.pdf
Maybe you find something there.

BUt, if you do a minor mistake, I dont think you will get thrown in jail for ten years or something, which I understand could happen in Callifornia... The finns are not (yet) that afraid of firearms.

Warthog:)
 
Warth0g:

Thanks for the information. I guess I will try to contract the Finnish embassy here in the US and see what help they can be.

Interesting about the drag bags considering the sand and rain you experienced.

Thanks

Richard
 
Warth0g:
"...this year I have heard ruomers of having some defensive shooting as well, but thats not official, but that will highten the round count a bit..."


See ya there...
Just writing stage instructions here.

PS
Rwdavidson, e-mail incoming
 
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