Look at this and learn!!

[dgray64]

Look closely. This is a .40 S&W round. The case looked good when I reloaded it. The problem is that I was using a new-to-me powder dispenser and the lock screw either worked loose or I didn't tighten it (I think it was the last).

I was loading 170 gr lead wad cutters with 4.5 gr of Tight Group. It was a hot day, but I had a fan going and didn't recheck my powder weight as I usually do every 10 to 20 rounds. After about 250 rounds, I noticed that the case seemed to have more powder in it than I started with. I checked the weight and found that I had loaded many with at least 5.4 gr of powder.

I tried 5 each in two of my pistols and though the recoil was stout, there were no mishaps. The next day after thinking about the situation for a long time and looking at the recommended recipes where my 4.5 was max, I decided to fire a few more and then decide what to do.

I fired off 4 and got splattered in the face with debris. The XD40 locked open on a new round trying to enter the barrel. I looked and found the outside of the casing in the barrel. I checked the gun carefully after removing the case and found no damage, Thank God.

After unloading 250 rounds, I fired off the 7 rounds that wouldn't give up their bullets in my CZ40B without mishap. Then I fired off 10 of the reworked rounds with good accuracy and low recoil. While picking up my brass, I ran across the head of the cartridge. I was really lucky or blessed.

When I shot off the rest of the heavy rounds, I used goggles over my glasses for extra protection.

The lessen...? Know your equipment. Check your equipment. Check your powder charge regularly while reloading. It could happen to you!

Dave :banghead:

 

[scrat]

Wow thats pretty scary

 

[BullsEye10x]

Out of curiosity, which powder measure were you using?

 

[Mike 56]

I am glad you are ok. A story like this is a good reminder. We can all get a little careless once in a while.

Mike

 

[Griz44]

The price for perfection is unabridged diligence. Now we understand why the radio, tv, beer should be left behind while we ply our trade....

 

[strat81]

was loading 170 gr lead wad cutters with 4.5 gr of Tight Group. It was a hot day, but I had a fan going and didn't recheck my powder weight as I usually do every 10 to 20 rounds. After about 250 rounds, I noticed that the case seemed to have more powder in it than I started with. I checked the weight and found that I had loaded many with at least 5.4 gr of powder.

I tried 5 each in two of my pistols and though the recoil was stout, there were no mishaps. The next day after thinking about the situation for a long time and looking at the recommended recipes where my 4.5 was max, I decided to fire a few more and then decide what to do.

So you knew they were significantly over max but you shot them anyway???

Well, at least you're not hurt. I'm not sure if you're religious, but you have a guardian angel.

 

[kingpin008]

I was thinking that too. I don't really know much about reloading yet, but 5.4 seems like quite a jump from 4.5, especially when 4.5 is the MAX load.

And even more than that, you kept shooting after you were taking debris and blowback in the face?

I hope you don't take this the wrong way, but I would hate to share a range with you. Dodging shrapnel from KB'd guns isn't fun.

 

[FlyinBryan]

i loaded 200 45acp rounds the other day and had a few primer misfeeds during the session.

after thinking about it for a while i wondered if it were possible that i raised the ram more than once on any rounds while fighting with the primer feeder.

i then posted a thread titled "double charge in a kimber 1911" just to get an idea of what the outcome could be if my primer feeder did in fact cause me to double charge one of them.

i pulled all 200 and found them to be ok.

i am now quite a bit more aware of the ram movements and charge levels in each round.

glad you didnt lose any digits or eyeballs or worse.

 

[dougader]

No way I'd knowingly fire a .9 grain overload in 40 S&W with a fast powder like TiteGroup. Glad you're ok. I've seen blown cases before but never one where the entire base of the case was separated like that.

 

[SASS#23149]

No way I'd knowingly fire a .9 grain overload in 40 S&W with a fast powder like TiteGroup

+1
Sounds like an invitation to disaster to do this.imho

 

[wuchak]

It's mistake likes this that bullet pullers were made for. Start pulling and checking from the last one loaded until you get to good ones. After 2 or 3 good ones in a row you can stop pulling.

I don't think your decision to shoot more of them and then decide was a very good one. Fortunately you are ok but I would rethink that strategy next time. The "jump then look" method is not a good one when it comes to anything firearms related.

 

[dgray64]

And even more than that, you kept shooting after you were taking debris and blowback in the face?

To set the record straight, the 7 or eight that I shot after the exploding bullet was done after I had pulled all the bullets and reloaded them. This group wouldn't give up the bullet because they were steel cased. That was the reason I chose to shoot them. The steel case is stronger than the brass case.

As far as the shooting of a few after I had found that they had excess powder, that's part experimentation and part the reliability of the dispenser. My old Lee dispenser always leaked powder and never threw two charges of the same weight which is why I went to the Lyman dispenser. It's totally uniform and doesn't leak....but you have to remember to tighten the set screw. My fault.

I know all this is food for thought and ridicule, and I knew it would be the case when I put up the new thread, but you guys are shooters and you need to be safe and you need to learn from incidents like this one. I've been shooting a long time and loading for a little over a year and have enjoyed it. Have I made mistakes? Sure. Will I quit? No way. I will just try harder.

The worst thing about the hot charge was using a lead bullet since I got some leading in my barrel that I had to work hard to remove.

Dave

 

[Doug b]

dgray64 fans blowing across a scale will give phoney readings.

 

[wuchak]

The steel case is stronger than the brass case.

You mean nickel plated right? The nickel plated isn't any stronger. It's just slicker and some feel it feeds more reliably.

The only steel cases I've seen are not reloadable with home equipment. I've never seen steel cases for ammo directly available to the handloader for this reason. There is no difference in strength between the two. If they made the steel as thick as the brass the steel would be much stronger but the steel cases are noticeably thinner and are very easily crushable because they are so thin.

 

[seektruth]

Wow. Overcharged and shot 'em anyway? I hope you'll never do that again.

 

[seektruth]

wuchak- I don't know if there are reloadable steel cases in .40sw, but there are some in 45acp. Wolf 45acp is boxer primed. I've reloaded them after inspecting carefully. I haven't tried more than on reload, but I know that people have.

 

[dgray64]

"[You mean nickel plated right? The nickel plated isn't any stronger. It's just slicker and some feel it feeds more reliably.

The only steel cases I've seen are not reloadable with home equipment. I've never seen steel cases for ammo directly available to the handloader for this reason. There is no difference in strength between the two. If they made the steel as thick as the brass the steel would be much stronger but the steel cases are noticeably thinner and are very easily crushable because they are so thin.]"

These were steel, Wolf casings. I really like Wolf ammo. They say that the steel casing is hard on the ejector, but I haven't had any problems and the cases reload well.

Dave

 

[rcmodel]

What pictures?

rcmodel

 

[strat81]

I don't think anyone is trying to ridicule you, dgray. However, your post is full of instances of bad technique.

but I had a fan going

As mentioned, this can distort the readings on your scale.

didn't recheck my powder weight as I usually do every 10 to 20 rounds.

This is a major issue, especially with new equipment (your new measure) or equipment that was recently adjusted (changing disks, rotors, etc.).

I checked the weight and found that I had loaded many with at least 5.4 gr of powder.

I tried 5 each in two of my pistols and though the recoil was stout

Firing ammo that is known to contain overcharges is Very Bad and downright reckless.

The next day after thinking about the situation for a long time and looking at the recommended recipes where my 4.5 was max, I decided to fire a few more and then decide what to do.

So you went and fired some more overcharged cases, even after experiencing "stout" recoil. Good thing the stout recoil did not send the slide into your face.

I fired off 4 and got splattered in the face with debris. The XD40 locked open on a new round trying to enter the barrel. I looked and found the outside of the casing in the barrel.

Finally, some physical proof of problems.

I checked the gun carefully after removing the case and found no damage, Thank God.

Thank god the gun was okay, or thank god you still had 10 fingers and both eyes with no horrible burn marks on your face?

After unloading 250 rounds, I fired off the 7 rounds that wouldn't give up their bullets in my CZ40B without mishap.

Ack! Firing MORE of these cases???? Craziness! How much did those 7 rounds cost you? Let's say you loaded them with some expensive Barnes TSX bullets and VV powder and they are $1.00 each. So you risked disfigurement and a trip to the ER for $7.00. My co-pay for a doctor's visit is more than that, forget about ER and surgeon's bills.

When I shot off the rest of the heavy rounds, I used goggles over my glasses for extra protection.

What about your hands? Your face? Other people around you?

These were steel, Wolf casings. I really like Wolf ammo. They say that the steel casing is hard on the ejector, but I haven't had any problems and the cases reload well.

You were loading cases that no reputable source has ever deemed to be safe for reloading? Ouch.

You are lucky.

Please, step back from the reloading bench and re-examine your procedures and mindset. You not only risked your gun, but your hands, eyes, face, and the safety of others. Had this been a rifle cartridge that had an extra ~20% of powder in it, it could have been catastrophic.

And for what? A few cents per case (brass vs. steel) and a few more cents for bullets and powder?

I know this all sounds harsh and it is not my intent to offend you. However, new reloaders need to be aware of the many mistakes that were made and the glaringly unsafe practices you employed.

 

[DEDON45]

DUDE! I wouldn't have shot those things.... in a small case, with fast powder like that, almost a grain over... KB waitin' to happen... or at least a significant shortening of the gun's life. I've seen a BHP in .40 blown up in a similar situation... somehow it didn't trash the frame or barrel, or slide, but the internal just fell out of it. The guy had it Magnafluxed and Browning put it back together for no (or very little) charge... he did tell 'em how it happened too.

Don't get me wrong, if it was .9 over in say, a .44 Mag load that's right at max, and I had a sturdy revolver like a Ruger or Freedom Arms, I'd probably touch one off... but that's a whole different animal. Well, maybe I would... or maybe I'd be a fraidy cat and be pulling those bullets!

 

[Dirtypacman]

All I can say is please head the advice of this board. You were lucky you did not have a different outcome.

I loaded up 60 rounds of 38 and found I had used the wrong recipe. I am pretty sure I could have been ok shooting them but why the hell do I want to risk it. I pulled apart every one of them and redid them. Sure it ate up some extra time that could have been used at my bench or at the range but better safe then sorry.

 

[Griz44]

I think you need a new hobby. Say - whiffle ball or badmitton - something you cannot hurt yourself doing.

 

[Navy joe]

There's really not much High Road to say about this one. You know you have bad loads, pull the trigger anyway, one blows up, you pull the trigger some more because you can't get the bullets out of crap cases any sane person wouldn't have reloaded in the first place. I guess your face is less important than 7-8 crappy cases, a few lead bullets and 40 some grains of powder? Your decision making processes make it doubtful you should be around guns or reloading.

 

[EddieCoyle]

You shouldn't be reloading steel. You shouldn't shoot rounds that are loaded 20% over max.

You really need to read a book about this stuff.

This, of course, is assuming you're not a troll who's just posting here to get a rise out of people.

 

[fireflyfather]

Many people have experimented with reloading steel cases and reported back here. I have never done it myself, but it can certainly be done. The problems with reloading steel are twofold: 1. It's harder on your dies and will wear them out more quickly. 2. Steel cases are more prone to complete failure without warning than brass ones (Brass will show signs of metal fatigue/wear sooner).

There's nothing catastrophic about reloading steel cased ammo once or twice, provided you aren't loading 20% over max loads. I certainly wouldn't want to load a high pressure round like the .40 in a heavily reloaded steel case.

The problem here wasn't the cases. It was the severe overcharge and a nonchalant attitude about safety. The proper procedure for testing charges above max is to place the firearm in a fixed mount or in an old tire (provided it has a stock), and use a string to pull the trigger...FROM BEHIND COVER. Nobody else should be on the firing line either. Treat it like you would a small grenade, because that's what it potentially could be. Also, don't count on the gun ever being the same again, either.