Lowest Caliber for Deer

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At typical eastern ranges (under 100 yds.) a .30-30 will do just fine. There are better cartridges for sure, but the reason I lean on the .30-30 is the rifle, a well used marlin. My son killed a deer last year with my .243 using winchester ballistic silvertips. Massave tissue damage.

Just about any centerfire round with an expanding bullet will do. Just make sure the rifle fits your shoulder and carries well.
 
The Rule of 3 is boggus. That leaves out too many great Deer hunting calibers. The 270 comes to mind which IMO IS if not one of the best North American Hunting Calibers created.
 
For you deer hunters, what rifle caliber would you consider the bare minimum for putting down a deer safely and humanely at 50 to 150 yards?
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257 roberts.

yes, i consider anything smaller than 257 diameter too small. 'course, if our deer dressed out at a whopping 125 pounds, i suppose i'd feel a 223 or smaller adequate as well.
 
.257 Roberts is an excellent caliber as well for deer. I think a .243 is the minimum that should be used. And even then I'd hesitate using it on bigger South Texas Bucks and Hogs. It's ok for kids to use on a smaller 4-6pt that doesn't field dress too heavy.
 
The ever dangerous and hard to bring down whitetail deer... And his larger and more dangerous cousin, the Mule Deer :rolleyes:

I have seen people go from 30-30's to 7mm mag and I must say that it is now getting ridiculous. A .223 is a perfectly acceptable white tail round. It is capable of, I hate to use the word HUMANE but that is the word... humane kills on both white tail and mule deer. Would you hesitate to shoot a 300 pound man with a .223? Then why not use it on Whitetails????

Regarding the law, my advice is to follow it. Don't look for a minimum caliber, look for a caliber that you shoot well and have faith in. For me, that is the .257 Roberts. You can use it on Deer, Hogs, Black bear and as a varmint round (proper bullet selection applies).

Some people prefer a .308 or .30-06. Both are fine rifles. The .243 / 6mm are also excellent rounds, but lack the cross over potential of a .257 or .308.

The .357 magnum was considered for many years as a fine deer hunting cartridge, the .38 special was also considered a fine light game cartridge. Light game includes smaller white tails, the kind that are in Texas Hill country, a big one would be 100 lbs field dressed. But, those seem to have fallen by the wayside in the increasing crush to use something akin to proton torpedoes to insure that the dangerous whitetail plauges us no more....

Art Eatman said:
One problem with this sort of discussion is the difference in skill levels among shooters. Please keep that in mind when making "grand, sweeping generalizations."
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+1 Art


EDIT - I am a 30-30 nut... Great round, great rifle / round combo, excellent for all hunting save the "western type" long shot hunting, +200 yard shots.... not a good choice.
 
Would you hesitate to shoot a 300 pound man with a .223? Then why not use it on Whitetails????
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THat can be argumented as well because we all know that a .223 is not an affective Human killing machine. I don't even think that is why the military picked it. They wanted a light round that was easy to carry ammo for and would at least STOP or Hold back a threat. It is NOT a great human killing round. That and the fact that human skin is lest thick and hard than a White Tail.
 
Whoa up on the .223 and military stuff, okay? Off topic.

When TFL and THR were "younguns" on the Internet, I was pretty much down on the .223 for deer. I still am, but much less so, now, because of all the R&D on hunting bullets, these last half-dozen years.

There are bullets available, now, around 70 grains or so, that can be quite effective. The caveats have to do with distance and the angle of the shot; same as what I impose on myself with my .243.

And that's the "why" of my previous post. :)

Art
 
THat can be argumented as well because we all know that a .223 is not an affective Human killing machine. I don't even think that is why the military picked it. They wanted a light round that was easy to carry ammo for and would at least STOP or Hold back a threat. It is NOT a great human killing round. That and the fact that human skin is lest thick and hard than a White Tail.
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Don't believe the hype... Go read the one shot stops regarding the .223 It is well into the 90% range. The problem with the .223 is the same as the problem with the 9mm. It has much more to do with the bullets (FMJ's) than the rounds.

Again, with the 223 you have to consider the shot placement. I am a neck shooter. I believe that is the best place to hit a white tail and always aim there. I am also usually between 25 - 100 yards, sometimes even closer. All of that being said, it is a good round. Not my first pick, but certainly not a bad one. There are too many other good calibers out there for deer to focus on the .223, that is why I said in my post don't look for minimums.

If someone didn't have a deer rifle and was going to purchase their first one, and lived in Texas, I would recommend a .223 or .308. For the ONE reason that these have SHTF cross over potentials. If someone just wanted to add a gun to an already broad arsenal, then I would recommend the .257 roberts.
 
All deer all terrain - .257 Roberts maybe .250-3000 with a good bullet.

Although I've had a chance to eat deer taken with .223 up - and times I could have poached an animal with a .22 rimfire - it is my firm and unvarying belief that a .243/6mm will give too many unaccountable failures from time to time with decent shot placement and all the rest ( I suppose anything might but a .243/6mm will give more and sooner) - and that in heavily hunted public hunting areas the animal is more likely to move far enough to be claimed by somebody else and more important is likely from time to time to be alive and looking back when recovered after tracking - or fail of recovery. FWIW I might well shoot a deer with a .243/6mm and a good bullet assuming I was in the woods in season with a tag and a good preferably a rested shot presented itself and that was the rifle I had but for setting out to hunt a deer I prefer a .25 and up - .270/.280 is perfect and as I age I find my Scout to be a fine old man's rifle.
 
Our smallest deer gun at this time is a 243. 95 Gn Winchester drops Texas deer right there.
My favorite deer gun is a little Ruger carbine in 44 mag.
I want a dirty 30 lever gun.
Also I would feel comfortable shooting a Texas deer with a 223.
 
I always ask why someone wants to hunt with the minimum caliber? Is it because they think they are such a great shot and the tiniest bullet surgically placed would do the job on a whitetail deer under perfect conditions? Or they just want to use their AR's? I think the answer is often they want to use their AR's. So, use an AR in 308.

You can field dress a whitetail with a scalpel or razor blade, but it is a lot easier with a slightly larger knife. So, why choose the minimum for anything? I know, recoil issues and young hunters....

There is always a lot of hair splitting about recommended caliber choices for whitetail deer. 257... why not. 30-30, sure. 357 shot from a rifle, sure. Why not a 300 win mag? Okay, use it if you like a bit more recoil or you are taking longer range shots typically. How about a 338? It is arguably one of the most versatile calibers for big game in the US.

A rifle in .223 works with the right bullet. The .243 Win works better with the right bullet. But the 270 through 30-06 range of calibers work a lot better. The point of wounded game running to another hunter, or having to track further a wounded animal is a valid one depending on where you are hunting. You need to consider that for the most part it is not legal to track a wounded deer onto private property for which you do not have permission to be on and take it. So, technically you need to think in terms of quick stops. That is why I switched from a .243 to .270. When I shoot a deer in the front shoulder area, I want it to go down and not act like it wasn't even hit. I know the supporters of the 243 and 223 all say they have quick humane kills. But frankly there are better choices available.
 
Well said.

This bad boy was shot out at around 180-200 yrds with my .270 using 150gr NP's. and just FELL right where he was standing. In Fact, I thought I missed him and he disappeared because by the time I took eye away from scope I couldn't see him. I don't think you can get results like that using a .223. NO way. MAYBE just Maybe you can shooting a little Hill Country Doe in Texas that way no more than a CAT. But you head WEST to Freer, Zapata County, Del Rio and you will be a moron to try and attempt shooting bucks out there with a .223.



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"...fail to see how .243 will make all the difference, sorry..." It's about bullet construction. Most .223 bullets are made for varmints, not heavier game. They lack sufficent penetration and tend to break up before hitting vital organs on deer sized game. Mind you, so are most less than 85 grain 6mm bullets.
 
Rubenz, I don't want to come off as a smart a$$, but I have in fact dropped deer that size with a 22LR. They were both does and both were well over 200 lbs. Both were around 50 yard shots. Shot placement drops deer, not caliber. I have seen kids drop good bucks dead in their tracks with 223s and 260s. I have also seen a guy shoot a small doe with a 300WSM and we spent two hours searching for her. I don't advocate hunting with a 22LR, nor do I recomend hunting with any marginal cartridge, but I would much rather see someone hunting with a marginal cartridge and shoot it well rather than see someone hunt with some uber magnum and not shoot it worth a damn. I have yet to shoot a deer of any size with my 243 that did not drop where it stood.
 
Smallest? Probably .22-250. Would I do it? No. Have I seen it used successfully? Yep.
I shoot 6mm, it works fine. I'm sure I could go smaller, but I wouldn't want to. FWIW I'm saving up for a .308.

Jason
 
Aaryq said:
....For you deer hunters, what rifle caliber would you consider the bare minimum for putting down a deer safely and humanely at 50 to 150 yards?
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Those little southern deer are alot like shrimp....tasty and you need quite a few to make a good meal. Deer species get bigger the further North you go. While it may be effective on smaller sub species a .223 would probably bouce off the big bodied ones in the upper midwest and Canada. Not uncommon to see 300-400 lb deer in our area. That's alot more mass, tissue, and bone to penetrate.
 
Perhaps this question should be reframed?

Should you be asking about minimum bullet size rather than minimum caliber?

Although I've never shot a deer with less than a .243 I can see that the old idea that it is the "minimum ethical caliber" may not be entirely true any more. A modern expanding bullet such as a Swift Scirocco 75 grain would be little different in its impact than your generic 85 grain .243 bullet. Any bullet which can poke a hole all the way through a deer is "adequate" in my opinion. (In fact, now that it comes to mind, I may load up some .223 this fall using the Swift bullets, just to see whether this is as true in reality as it is in theory.) :scrutiny:

In my experiance there is a serious consideration for loss of edible meat in southern whitetails if one uses anything larger than a 120 grain bullet in a high powered rifle.
 
Rembrandt: This post is for you. I was born and raised in ND. I lived in a town of 1500 people and paid for my gas, dates, ammo, and everything else from working on a farm and ranch. I've seen an ELK (not a mulee or white tail deer) run away after 2 well placed shots (in the vital square they taught us in hunter's safety). Yes that second shot hit while that little cuss was running and yes he kept running. I've seen deer the size of juggernauts and elk at least 100 times the size (I have a bad habbit of exaggerating the size of critters) and I've seen them gunned down. The problem for me is I don't talk to the people who have taken those critters down. The people I used to hunt with have turned from a beer every now and then to raging alcoholics with drug addictions and I can't talk to them about hunting because they're too busy trying to get their next fix. Sob story aside, I've seen some big deer, and all exaggerations aside, I know that a lot of people use a 30-06 for deer but I know that there is a lower caliber that I can use to take them down.
 
The new issue of Field & Stream (F&S) has a piece on calibers for a wide range of puposes. They recommned 243/6mm with 100 gr core-lokt bullets for varmints & big game (transition caliber) which I agree with. (That is what I did when I couldn't afford both at the time.) 257 Roberts is their second choice. They have two big game catagories; light kickers and all around rounds. 7x57 Mauser and 7mm/08 is their choice for light kickers and 308 is second. All around.... 30/06 No. 1 and 270/280-No. 2. I like the 7x57 Mauser round. 223 is their varmint recommendation by the way.

To me the interesting choice for handgun hunting is 44 mag as No 1 and 480 Ruger as No 2. 45 Colt is their honorable mention. No mention of the 41 mag. Doesn't surprise me though.
 
I knew a poacher (American Piute Indian, said game laws didnt apply to him:rolleyes:) who took many mule deer with a head shot from a .22 mag, usually at ranges less than 50 yds.
His method of hunting quail was no more legal, he used a trot line, with many size 22 hooks and baited with a rasin or pine nut.:uhoh:
For fishing he used a gill net.:eek:
He did feed his family.:eek:

For young children and old womens I would draw the line at .243 as the smallest ethical cartridge for killing deer.
 
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