M1014 owners- 7rounds of 2.75"- as is!

[oldpaladin]

On another list, a friend named Eagles told me of the M1014 having the ability to hold ready an extra round, resting on the carrier, under the bolt. This would mean that the 4+1 became 4+1+1. This of course with 2.75" shells... Today, I called Benelli and told them what Eagles had told me... I asked them what else I could do, to increase capacity. I've had two shot magazine extensions on order for both my M1014's since October*. A little while later, the nice young lady came back and said, "Have you taken out the plug yet?" Plug? There's a plug in there? After signing off, I grabbed my manual, and yep, there is a plug... Follow the directions for taking down your M1014, and when you've gotten the barrel off, unscrew the faux magazine extension. Take a screwdriver, and gently pry out the magazine spring seal ring. Remember, the plug is under tension... Once the ring has been taken out, and the plug removed, feed the spring down in to the magazine, being careful not to bind, and secure the faux magazine extension. Reassemble the weapon. Now, you have room for five 2.75" rounds in the magazine, can place one on the carrier, and have one in the chamber(5+1+1). Remember that this is just a way to do your weapon's set-up for self defense, and NOT a suggestion that you do the same... I am not responsible for any actions that you may take- that's on your head, and NOT mine... Always be safe- there is no excuse to be otherwise...

*Benelli said that they'd just received their first invoice for 2 shot magazine extensions... With luck, these will be available in April, at the latest! Hope this info is of some help. I feel much better with 7 rounds avaliable, instead of just 5. Soon, with the new magazine extensions, that 7 will grow to 9(7+1+1)! Yee-Haw!!! Now, THAT's a combat shotgun!

Carter, oldpaladin/GLOCK21_30Man, out...

 

[Badger Arms]

Planning on missing 8 times?

 

[curt]

How do you select slug if you have the carrier and everything loaded up like that?

 

[oldpaladin]

Badger Arms and Curt,
If you have ammo when you need it, that's good. If you need it, and you don't have it, that's bad. Miss 8 times? LOL, ROTFLMHAO!!! Gasp! Haven't laughed so hard in days! Thanks! What if there are more than one or two BG's? What if it's a situation where barriers or barricades are involved? The potential scenarios are virtually limitless... Shucks, if you have to take out the trash, reloading might be a bit of a strain... Besides, I'd rather have 9 slugs and/or buckshot loads, than just the 11 in my GLOCK21 or GLOCK30... As to selection of loads, for home defense, the first 5 will be 1 Buck, followed by 2 (and later 2 more) of Federal Classic 1.25oz rifled slugs... Can always add slugs or buckshot after third shot, on a need to use basis... Can't forget the five rounds on the stock sleeve, and ten rounds on the sling... Am I willing to run empty? Uh-uh, nope, nyet, nada, nein, not a bloomin' chance. Maybe my two M1014's are a little bit heavier, but you get used to it... Now, if I know what's coming, well, then due attention is paid to ammo selection... Hope this gives some light on my thinking...

Regards and Respects,
Carter, oldpaladin/GLOCK21_30Man, out...

 

[Badger Arms]

Let me propose something that might enlighten you a bit on the types of situations you'll encounter. First, the vast majority of encounters will end without a shot being fired. Just having the shotgun will be enough of a deterrant most of the time. One sure way to let somebody know you mean business is to crank a round into the chamber. Even if this is done outside a door, in a relatively loud area, whereever. It's a LOUD AND CLEAR signal that you mean business. Imagine an intruder trying to sneak through a quiet house when a "CLANK-CLANK" breaks the silence. It's likely you'll have urine to clean up instead of blood! It's less likely he'll want to confront you unless he's suicidal.

You can do this with an auto or a pump. Storing the gun with an empty chamber and carrier is safer. With the autoloader, you can still have the shell on the carrier and simply press the bolt release. "CLANK!" You'll have an authoritative sound to backup your warning that he'd better STOP.

Oh yeah, all of my rounds are 12 pellet 00 buck. I figure if the Bad Guy is far enough that I need slugs, he is not a threat or I need a rifle instead. 00 Buck from a skeet choke will make authoritative hits on a man-sized target out to about 25 yards EVERY TIME. Beyond that, I'm taking cover.

 

[oldpaladin]

Badger Arms,
Good points all, especially about the round on the carrier, but not in the chamber. Wouldn't do that, unless I knew someone was "incoming." I would then max load- after dialing 911... As to 00Buck, yep, it's a good load. FWIW, I prefer the very slightly smaller diameter 0 or 1Buck, for more pellets on target... My M1014's are fixed, improved cylinder bore... Great for placing tight patterns at 25yards or slightly more (or at least that seems to be the promise of Remington's 00Buck Hevi-Shot. Will have to get some and try it!). The 1.25oz slugs are for driving cigar diameter holes through walls, depriving BG's of cover... Discipline is knowing where NOT to shoot. Planning, is in knowing what you'll do, when the smelly, sticky stuff hits the oscillating, rotary impellor... Yes, the sound of a bolt being drawn back and let slam forward does sound like a coffin lid being slammed shut... Does get their attention... IF, and that's a big IF, someone gets in, the alarm goes off, and IF they're still here after it does, it's a home invasion. In which case, they're not the run of the mill burglar... They're intent upon grevious bodily harm. If I'm able, I will repel them with maximum violence... If it takes sponges and mops to clean-up afterward, so be it... My home may not be a castle (certainly isn't!) but neither it, nor I and my family, will be raped, pillaged, or murdered... As so many have put on their messages, Molon Labe! Here I'll stand, and after all is through, there I'll still stand...

Carter, oldpaladin, out...

 

[hksw]

Just curious. Replacing the non-mag extension at the end of the mag with a 2 round extension on a pistol gripped M4 (keeping it in that configuration) is legal?

 

[oldpaladin]

hksw,
Benelli says so... That's good enough for me! LOL!

Regards and Respects,
Carter, oldpaladin, out...

 

[Duke of Lawnchair]

hksw,

Federal shotgun laws:

a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of the following;

(i) a folding or telescoping stock;

(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(iii) a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and

(iv) an ability to accept a detachable magazine.

Any combination of the two constitutes as an "assault weapon" here in the states.

Jim

 

[Badger Arms]

Folding or telescoping stock: No
Pistol Grip: No
In excess of 5 rds: YES
Detatch Mag: No

One for four, that makes it legal. Woohoo!!!

 

[hksw]

Now the stock being bolted permanently open, (i) is NO. But, if left in the original configuration of the 1014, (ii) would be YES.

With (iii) also YES, it would be illegal.

Just wanted to make it clear that you CANNOT have the pistol grip AND the extended mag on the gun at athe same time. You'll have to also replace the 1014 stock to the standard one.

The M4s will being coming out in that configuration in the future (standard stock, full extended mag) in the future.

 

[oldpaladin]

Ladies and Gentlemen,
The previous posts pertaining to the legalities of various mods to the M1014/M4S90 (and other shoulder weapons) is more than ample reason to lobby your legislative representatives, to make sure the AWB is killed, dead, buried- forever... Now, slightly less than 19 months left to go...
Look at those beautiful pictures... Such functional, magnificent, exquisite works of art... These, Ladies and Gentlemen, are just a delightful sample of the gun makers art... (Sigh!) Who could ask for more? ME! I want the fully adjustable stock, and if somebody can develop a totally reliable detatchable magazine, I want it!!! It ain't just a shotgun, fer pete's sake! It's a bloomin' weapon's system! It's a Benelli...

Regards and Respects,
Carter, oldpaladin, out...

P.S. Thanks, hksw, I really appreciate beautiful artwork... Just wish I knew how to post photos... cfl

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

well, considering how many times i've seen people fumble with their benellis for 20 minutes trying to get that one more round on the carrier.....

 

[oldpaladin]

Andrew,
It may not be a "fast" method of loading for some, but if being prepared is the goal, and an alert has been passed around, that extra round could mean the difference between life and death... Frankly, that's how I keep my bedside weapon: 5+1+0... The 0 means that the chamber is empty... Someone always mentions the quick freeze action of a BG, when hearing the bolt being drawn back, followed by it's slamming forward, round in chamber, ready to fire... Crack of doom, or last nail in the coffin, the result is the same- prognosis ALMOST certain termination... Haven't had a chance to see what poundage my M1014/M4S90's use on their triggers... Don't think it would be all that much, once the adrenaline starts to flow... Just glad I have another option for ammo... Lots of ammo, good. Little or no ammo, BAD Shooter, BAD! I think I've got it down... ;o) As to taking 20 minutes to place a round on the carrier, hmmmmmmmm. Practice, practice, and more practice...

Carter, oldpaladin, out...

 

[Dave McCracken]

A few thoughts from your kindly old grey haired Moderator and non Benelli owner.

I'm not slamming Benellis. Most seem to be excellent shotguns.

However, any loading method that may compromise reliability is a drawback, not an asset. How sure is this?

And, how does this work under extreme conditions and stress?

"Few that have not witnessed war know how hard even the simplest act becomes, and harder toil becomes impossible".-Churchill.

The KISS Principle applies....

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

*shrug* Whatever seems to work for you. I find the benelli m4's length of pull to be about 3 inches too long for my short arm, and I don't trust a shotgun that won't feed ammunition that's within saami specs, dimension wise but doesn't meet its preferred power factor, and I find the capacity of said shotgun to be dissapointing, considering its price tag.


I wouldn't mind owning a beretta m4, provided it came with a good non PG stock and full capacity.

 

[oldpaladin]

Dave,
You're right on Sir Winston's quote (BTW, IMHO, he was the greatest statesman of all time!). Loading of 5+1+1 is only if one knows that combat is coming, and cannot be avoided... Yessir, it DOES take a little bit of time... In a situation where there IS no time, the extra bit of insurance is forgotten... However, one of my M1014's now has 5+1+0, i.e., five in the magazine, one on the carrier, and the chamber empty, with the safety on... The five in the magazine are Remington (green colored) 0 Buck, while the one on the carrier is Winchester (red colored) 00 Buck... Visual clues are a "good thing." Wish they had a Chernobyl round for visual clues... No chance of missing the glow...
Yessir, when the sticky, smelly stuff hits the oscillating, rotary impellor, simple, much practiced, simple, is the best by far...
Truth be told, I was wedded to the idea of 3" versus 2.75", as to amount of lead that can be thrown down range. However, just under 20 yards, with three entrances, it's better to go with six, rather than five... Even here in the Midwest, there are the occasional home invasions... In such an unlikely event, there would probably be more than two or three perpetrators involved... And, I must confess, I'd feel more "comfortable" with the M1014, than with my either of my GLOCKs, although on other lists, I'd be considered a heretic...
Although I've been seen to hit five targets at 25yards in four seconds with my ex-Fabarm FP6, I like the idea of not having to jack the slide, and be even faster... Must be getting lazy in my "old" age... Still and all, you and Sir Winston are correct... Although I don't think I'm as dumb as I look, I do try to keep things as simple as I can... Only history will tell, I guess...
What kind of combat shotgun do you favor? How do you keep her loaded for potentially serious "social difficulties?" I'm always willing to learn from my "kindly grey haired Moderator and non Benelli owner!" BTW, I'm jealous- at least you've GOT gray hair!!!
LOL!

Carter, balding pated oldpaladin, out...

 

[oldpaladin]

Andrew,
There are three styles of stock available for the M1014- hopefully enough difference for anybody's taste. I can't do anything about lenght of pull, but after the AWB( ) is dead, I'd be willing to bet that the military stock option will be made available... Too, ammo capacity wise, the M1014 (commemorative of which I have two) is not what I wanted( )... From the time I made my decision to buy them, my order included two magazine extensions. The standard 4+1 loading was not acceptable( :banghead: )... With the addition of those two shot magazine extensions, they will become an acceptable 7+1+0, for eight rounds safe combat carry ready, to imminent combat ready with 7+1+1, for nine rounds... IMHO, eight or nine rounds of 0, 00, or 000 should be adequate...
"Considering the price tag," yep, it's pretty high, alright... However, with the addition of the Meprolight 21 Reflex sights, factory Meprolight tritium inserts for the ghost rings, the addition of tactical 3 point slings, and the coming two shot magazine extensions, I'm happy... You get what you pay for, if you're truly lucky... I was, and am, happy with the investment. No, unless and until Benelli comes out with an M5 or M6, these won't be on the block... They may not be, even then... I really do LIKE these beauties... If worst comes to worst, and I ever wear them out, they'll be relegated to a place of honor over a yet to be made mantlepiece...
Andrew, if Benelli could/would make the M4, with the "proper" mods that I've chosen, for under $1,000.00, that would be something that would be truly wonderful... Shucks, I'd probably go out and buy several more for more for my family... Some forms of "insurance" can be priceless... Without the mods I've chosen, it would be great if it came in under $750.00, but I wonder how it will be, before that happens... scrutiny: ) If you should look at the Benelli-USA webpage(http://www.benelliusa.com/), you'll see the different options available to you, or anyone else that's interested...
Your criticisms are valid, and Benelli should take them into account when defining future needs for the discriminating shooter. Price, certainly, would be a nice thing to reduce, but NOT at the expense of the M4's quality... As I've said, ad nauseum, I'm now a very happy camper, and hopefully soon, to be even happier! D ) If the price had been as low as I'd have liked, I'd have bought three or four! A, bliss... ) )

Carter, oldpaladin, out

 

[Dave McCracken]

Carter, I'm a walking example of follicle migration. Many hair follicles have migrated from the top front of my head and now reside in my ears and nose.

As for the hardware.....

My two "Serious" 870s are kept in Cruiser Ready with a minor deviation. Both are one round below capacity, so one is 6+0, the other and older 5+0.

Cruiser Ready means action locked shut, safety on, magazine full, chamber empty.

While an untrained person would have trouble getting a shotgun kept this way to fire, it can be made ready in a twinkling by the cogniscienti.

Color coding "Serious" ammo is a great idea. Red hulled Estate and Winchester 00, clear cased KO Brenekkes here.

Ssimple works every time, which is why I've 870s instead of autos....

 

[oldpaladin]

Dave,
Keep it up, keep it up... Next shotgun will probably be the superb Benelli M3, with all the usual bells and whistles... Would not be a come-down, or demotion, but a sidestep, here at the top of the food chain. After all, man does not usually take fowl with a dedicated combat shotgun... The M3 can do it all! So, the M3 will be the great equalizer, the mediator, the mondo-boffo answer to the question, "Pump or Semi-auto?" And the answer is, "Yes." So, that looks like the future- a brace of M4's and a future brace of M3's... Ah, that's a "good thing!" As for failing the follicle challenge, I've given-up on Rogaine- stuff tasted really vile... Have a great weekend!

Carter, oldpaladin, out...

 

[Dave McCracken]

Actually,Carter,Frankenstein does yeoman service on feathers. It's a parts 870, with a 21" barrel very similar to most found in creuisers. The vent rib's the clue.

I could use it quite well as a "Serious" shotgun, but I've better choices.

As for the M#, if it rings thy chimes...

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

I second the color coding for ammo. before i switched to the KO brenneke slugs, i bought remington slug (green) and used (and still use) federal low recoil buckshot (red).


the brennekes seem to shoot better when i do my part than the remington slugs did.