Magazine Spring Life?

[Walt Sherrill]

If there is an intrinsic advantage maybe flatwire springs in mags would help longevity. All the talk about valve spring longevity doesn't account for 1911 8 round magazines reported tendency to lose mag spring pressure, but I'm here to learn. Maybe 8 round mag springs lose pressure because of forcing them into fully compressed mode all the time.

I don't know whether there is any advantage to flat-wire springs over round ones, but do know that in the case of tappet springs, the tappet springs are designed for LONG LIFE, so that when working, the springs aren't pushed beyond their elastic limit.

That is often NOT the case with mag springs or recoil springs, where space (and space for extra material) are critical components for the spring's design and use in a gun. In the case of 1911 8-round magazines, while it may use the same spring as a 7-round mag, the spring is compressed farther in the 8-round mag.)

That simply means that WORKING the spring in an 8-round mag, or leaving the mag loaded, compresses the spring nearer to (or into) it's elastic limit. That level of spring compression (at or near the elastic limit) is where degradation of spring material begins. An example I've cited before is the recoil spring used in a Rohrbaugh R9. The maker changed the recommended service live from 300 to 250 rounds some time back. (I'm sure those springs will function longer than 250 or 300 cycles, but the maker erred on the side of safety for the shooter using the gun in self-defense. You could probably get more rounds ouf of the spring at the range.)

Why does the spring in a small 9mm get work for just a fraction of the cycles possible in a full-size gun firing the same round? Less metal and less space for the spring calls for compromises; in this case, the spring becomes a renewable resource, necessary to keep the gun small and functional. Some mag springs will perform in a similar manner.

I've been a long-time CZ enthusiast. I got my first ones about the time of the mag ban. Back then (and now) CZ, as did most gun makers, and used the same spring in their 10-round mags as they did in their 15 round mags. I think many gun makers now use the same springs in all of their full-size mags for a given model (be they 14, 15, 16 , or 17+ round mags).. The springs in those different capacity mags don't all get compressed to the same degree when cycling, or when stored fully loaded. Those differences have to have some effect on spring life, if what the engineers (working with springs on the job) and metallurgists (engineers specializing in metal applications) tell us. If the spring isn't pushed to it's elastic limit, it may continue to function with only minor degradation for YEARS and YEARS. (Some mag springs do push the limit, which is why Wolff Springs, in their FAQ area, recommends downloading a round or two for long-term storage of loaded mags; it may not be necessary for all mag designs, but it could be for some!)

re: flat versus round coil springs...

Just guessing, as I've not seen this design difference addressed elsewhere, but it seems as though you could get more metal material into the same magazine or slide space with a flatter, wider coiled spring than with a round one. More material in the same space could account for a stronger spring with more reserve power and less need to be compressed as deeply.

.

 

[Drail]

One size fits all is a bad idea for magazine springs. To get the last round to feed just like the first round you must use quality springs and don't push them beyond their limits. I have always used 8 round mags with only 7 rounds loaded in them with extra power mag springs. The gun feeds every round in the mag with monotonous regularity- all day long. As soon as you see any last round feed hangups - replace the springs.

 

[Steve C]

In my experience, magazine springs don't suddenly fail, the first symptoms that they are getting weak is that they may not always have the strength at full empty to operate the slide lock even though they feed the ammo just fine. Make sure that the failure isn't due to something other than the spring weakening like the follower or the slide lock itself. Simply change the springs when needed. Glock 19 mag springs have worked for 12 to 15 years before needing to be replaced. Haven't had a 1911 springs go bad in mags in used for 40 yrs. The rare single stack magazines that have gone bad are ones that get damaged from being dropped and stepped on enough times to bend or crack the feed lips..

 

[Walt Sherrill]

One size fits all is a bad idea for magazine springs. To get the last round to feed just like the first round you must use quality springs and don't push them beyond their limits. I have always used 8 round mags with only 7 rounds loaded in them with extra power mag springs. The gun feeds every round in the mag with monotonous regularity- all day long. As soon as you see any last round feed hangups - replace the springs.

RE: the prior two posts...

I agree about generally being warned by springs that slowly degrade...

As for using extra-strength springs in 8-round mags and loading only 7 rounds: that'll certainly work. But you've probably not done anything that you couldn't do by using the same springs in a 7-round mag.

I've never heard about 7-round mags having reliability issues -- just 8-rounders. (Because they use the same springs and are compressed farther.)

I've had quite a few Glocks, and there seems to be something unique about Glock mag springs. They're generally MUCH harder to load to capacity when new, and I've never personally experienced a mag spring failure with a Glock mag, over the years... That said, one Glock 17 I sold, with multiple mags, did seem to be unable to lock back the slide after the sale, which may have been due to mag spring failures.

 

[Drail]

There are high quality springs - and then there's everything else. How do you know which you have? You don't unless you replace the factory springs with quality springs. A LOT of manufacturers buy the cheapest bulk springs they can find. They will die a quick death.

 

[MechAg94]

Drail, that isn't my experience, but what would rate as quality springs?

IMO, Most shooters who stick with factory magazines will never see a magazine failure of any kind much less failing springs. I have never had any issue with new factory mags. I leave them all fully loaded when not in use more often than not. I don't do competitions or shoot high round counts so my mags don't see a lot of wear and tear compared to some others. The only magazine issues I have had is with cheap 3rd party mags. I don't buy those anymore.

IMO, if it is a concern, I would just buy some spare magazine springs to keep on hand if needed. Failing that, buy enough spare magazines you can afford to throw one away if it causes problems. With surplus, that isn't always a good option.

I have a Para P14 that always had magazine issues. The magazines I could find were all 3rd party and quality was all over the map. Para finally started selling branded magazines some years back and those work very well.

 

[RX-79G]

I don't know why anyone actually familiar with guns would claim that spring - mag springs in particular - would never wear out.

However, some mag designs and mag springs seem to last seemingly forever. Others do not.

I am suspicious of magazines that fit two more rounds in a space that previously held only 15 or 13. That extra capacity is coming at the cost of spring longevity.


I would not be surprised that "combloc" gunsprings are excellent quality.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

A LOT of manufacturers buy the cheapest bulk springs they can find. They will die a quick death.

As stated by MechAg94, that hasn't been my experience, either.

A large number of gun makers use Mec-Gar to make their OEM mags, and for all but 1911s, Mec-Gar mags seem to be the gold standard for magazines. I've seldom had problems with factory mags, except for price. Mags from RAMLINE or PRO-MAG have been a source of irritation, but even some PRO-MAG mags are quite good. (I've used Pro-Mag CZ Compact mags off and on for years -- they seem as good as factory mags and are a lot cheaper. That has not been my experience with all Pro-Mag magazines.) Mags bought from some off-brand sources have been more trouble than they're worth.

At different times, Mec-Gar has made magazines for CZ, S&W, Kel-Tec, Beretta, SIG, Canik, Para, Ruger, Tanfoglio/WItness, and a number of other gun makers. Factory mags are typically good, as are the mags made by the OEM mag makers under their own name.

I, long ago, quit buying new mags when I could get after-market springs from Wolff. (There are other providers for 1911s, but I'm not big into 1911s.)

 

[RX-79G]

I definitely had some Pro-mags that wore the springs out in record time. They were 15 round Glock mags in 1997. I replaced the springs and followers with Glock factory and the mags worked fine after that.