VG
Member
How often do you shoot? How much each session? What do you shoot at?
Do you ever compete, or plan to? Sounds like you have a very tight budget?
Do you ever compete, or plan to? Sounds like you have a very tight budget?
Make the pick... Garand vs AR
- Thread starter Selfdfenz
- Start date
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M2 Carbine
member
M1
When the USMC issued me a brand new International Harvester M1 in 1956 I knew I had a hell of a rifle.
Now I have two M1's and two AR-15's.
The M1 is a class act.
Tha AR is a piece of machinery.
When the USMC issued me a brand new International Harvester M1 in 1956 I knew I had a hell of a rifle.
Now I have two M1's and two AR-15's.
The M1 is a class act.
Tha AR is a piece of machinery.
Selfdfenz
Member
All great comments
VG
How often do you shoot? Every weekend, weather permitting
How much each session? 3-4 rifles and sometimes a couple of handguns as well I'm there for hours...and I like to be there for hours
HP 20 to 50 rnds per rifle/22s...the sky is the limit
What do you shoot at?paper 100 yds and farther if I can get to that range
Do you ever compete, or plan to? Hope to again...would converting to 308 keep a Garand out of hp competition? I like the idea of going and doing my best but winning a match is not a priority.
Sounds like you have a very tight budget? Aren't we all
I just want to keep the project under a thousand but included in that grand will be a significant amt of startup ammo.
I would like to get a servicable M1 but then if needed be able to upgrade the stock and or barrel and still keep it to a garand or less. If the starting point was a $350 Dane rack grade I think I can do that, no problem.
Thanks VG and all.
S-
VG
How often do you shoot? Every weekend, weather permitting
How much each session? 3-4 rifles and sometimes a couple of handguns as well I'm there for hours...and I like to be there for hours
HP 20 to 50 rnds per rifle/22s...the sky is the limit
What do you shoot at?paper 100 yds and farther if I can get to that range
Do you ever compete, or plan to? Hope to again...would converting to 308 keep a Garand out of hp competition? I like the idea of going and doing my best but winning a match is not a priority.
Sounds like you have a very tight budget? Aren't we all
I just want to keep the project under a thousand but included in that grand will be a significant amt of startup ammo.
I would like to get a servicable M1 but then if needed be able to upgrade the stock and or barrel and still keep it to a garand or less. If the starting point was a $350 Dane rack grade I think I can do that, no problem.
Thanks VG and all.
S-
I own both. I have owned a number of both.
Personally, I think the AR is superior in every way.
When I got my currect M1 I bought three cases of that Danish ammo in the clips. I think I have taken it out once. I find myself taking the ammo out of the clips and shooting it in my 03A3.
I probably go through well over 10,000 rounds of 5.56 a year.
I wouldn't want to have to pick only one, but if I was forced to I think you can guess my answer.
Personally, I think the AR is superior in every way.
When I got my currect M1 I bought three cases of that Danish ammo in the clips. I think I have taken it out once. I find myself taking the ammo out of the clips and shooting it in my 03A3.
I probably go through well over 10,000 rounds of 5.56 a year.
I wouldn't want to have to pick only one, but if I was forced to I think you can guess my answer.
freedomlover
Member
Get the Garand
Another vote for the U.S. Rifle, Cal. 30, M1.
You won't regret it.
*PING!*
Another vote for the U.S. Rifle, Cal. 30, M1.
You won't regret it.
*PING!*
TrapperReady
Member
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2003
- Messages
- 2,732
I'd vote for the AR first.
I've got both, and compete with both in HP or CMP events. They're both fun to shoot. Ammo is more readily available and less expensive for the AR. This translates into more shooting. BTW, it's more comfortable to spend an afternoon popping off rounds of .223 than .30-06... and more shooting will help make you a more proficient rifleman.
Although lots of people have differing opinions, my own experiences, both with issued M16s and civilian ARs is that they are quite reliable (with the exception of using blanks with MILES gear
). My Garand, while I enjoy it, has proven to be a little finicky. Nothing major... and everything easily fixed, but still not as reliable as the AR. Please note that I am only speaking about those particular weapons I've personally used. Remember that a CMP gun is 50-60 years old or so, and has seen heavy use... and possibly abuse.
Personally, I'd get the AR and shoot a bunch... all the time saving my pennies for a Garand. Actually, the "problem" of deciding which of these guns to get is a great one. You can't really go wrong.
I've got both, and compete with both in HP or CMP events. They're both fun to shoot. Ammo is more readily available and less expensive for the AR. This translates into more shooting. BTW, it's more comfortable to spend an afternoon popping off rounds of .223 than .30-06... and more shooting will help make you a more proficient rifleman.
Although lots of people have differing opinions, my own experiences, both with issued M16s and civilian ARs is that they are quite reliable (with the exception of using blanks with MILES gear
). My Garand, while I enjoy it, has proven to be a little finicky. Nothing major... and everything easily fixed, but still not as reliable as the AR. Please note that I am only speaking about those particular weapons I've personally used. Remember that a CMP gun is 50-60 years old or so, and has seen heavy use... and possibly abuse.Personally, I'd get the AR and shoot a bunch... all the time saving my pennies for a Garand. Actually, the "problem" of deciding which of these guns to get is a great one. You can't really go wrong.
M1 vs. AR
The M1 at 9.5 lbs. is rather heavy, although it shoots a true battlerifle cartridge. No real goodies to add except maybe a bayo. With cleaning kit stowed and a loaded en-block and sling, 10 lbs. but a heck of a lot of fun and will speak with authority out to roughly 800 meters. The AR that a buddy of mine has, with all the goodies attached, weighs 10.5 lbs. Add a loaded mag. and he's up to 11 lbs. and it is still a .223. Good up to maybe 500 meters. The biggest problem with AR's that I see is accessoritis(the absolutely neurotic need to hang or bolt something onto every square inch of the firearm). If you can avoid this deadly disease then it would be a tie in my opinion, if you can't the go with the M1 and just enjoy the hell outof it.
The M1 at 9.5 lbs. is rather heavy, although it shoots a true battlerifle cartridge. No real goodies to add except maybe a bayo. With cleaning kit stowed and a loaded en-block and sling, 10 lbs. but a heck of a lot of fun and will speak with authority out to roughly 800 meters. The AR that a buddy of mine has, with all the goodies attached, weighs 10.5 lbs. Add a loaded mag. and he's up to 11 lbs. and it is still a .223. Good up to maybe 500 meters. The biggest problem with AR's that I see is accessoritis(the absolutely neurotic need to hang or bolt something onto every square inch of the firearm). If you can avoid this deadly disease then it would be a tie in my opinion, if you can't the go with the M1 and just enjoy the hell outof it.
GLOCKT
Member
Submit the paperwork and check for the Garand.The wait can be lenghty,I'm at 5 weeks now for a HR.Was told 30-90 days possibly.
Then buy an AR and shoot it and become familar with all the extras you can get for the AR.And wait for your Garand to show up some day.
I did it kinda backwards,got a Yugo-SKS 1st,then a Bushmaster AK/shorty w/break,ordered a V-match 24" upper to go along long range,then got a prestine Swiss K31, and finally ordered the HR Gararnd.
Then buy an AR and shoot it and become familar with all the extras you can get for the AR.And wait for your Garand to show up some day.
I did it kinda backwards,got a Yugo-SKS 1st,then a Bushmaster AK/shorty w/break,ordered a V-match 24" upper to go along long range,then got a prestine Swiss K31, and finally ordered the HR Gararnd.
Bostonterrier97
Member
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2002
- Messages
- 211
My vote is for the M1 Garand..for the following reasons.
(1.) it is a rifle which has actual history behind it, it was most likely used by a real GI. whereas the AR15 wasn't. (GI's used M16's).
(2.) The M1 Garand is a more rugged and reliable rifle. It can really take a pounding try that with an Aluminum Alloy receiver, and Aluminum magazine which you would have on an AR15.
(3.) The M1 Garand while holding fewer rounds, offers superior penetration than the AR15. 168 grain Black Tip AP Ammo vs. 62 grain M855 ammo.
(4.) The .223 round isn't likely to outperform a 30-06 round in terms of wounding ballistics at ranges past 300 yards.
Once a .223 bullet's velocity drops below 2600 fps: the M193 and M855 rounds will not reliably fragment, and create large wound channels.
A 20 inch HBAR will not weigh much less than an M1 Garand. The AR's cheif advantage is that you can carry more ammo (this can be compensated by being more discriminating and aiming well, before making a shot with an M1 Garand, instead of just spraying bullets, and hoping for a hit).
(1.) it is a rifle which has actual history behind it, it was most likely used by a real GI. whereas the AR15 wasn't. (GI's used M16's).
(2.) The M1 Garand is a more rugged and reliable rifle. It can really take a pounding try that with an Aluminum Alloy receiver, and Aluminum magazine which you would have on an AR15.
(3.) The M1 Garand while holding fewer rounds, offers superior penetration than the AR15. 168 grain Black Tip AP Ammo vs. 62 grain M855 ammo.
(4.) The .223 round isn't likely to outperform a 30-06 round in terms of wounding ballistics at ranges past 300 yards.
Once a .223 bullet's velocity drops below 2600 fps: the M193 and M855 rounds will not reliably fragment, and create large wound channels.
A 20 inch HBAR will not weigh much less than an M1 Garand. The AR's cheif advantage is that you can carry more ammo (this can be compensated by being more discriminating and aiming well, before making a shot with an M1 Garand, instead of just spraying bullets, and hoping for a hit).
Teufelhunden
Member
The M16 family of rifles has served this country for 40ish years--one of (if not the) the longest run for a service rifle in common US military service. No historical value indeed!
/rant
Back OT, the Garand is 'cooler', but the AR is more practical in my mind. Get them both, AR first, Garand when you can afford it.
-Teuf
Mulliga
Member
Err...yes. Yes I do.
All the people I know who have AR-15s love them to death.RustyHammer
Member
Get the Garand now, and,
see what happens with the AWB,
before you get the AR.
see what happens with the AWB,
before you get the AR.
Ben Shepherd
Member
If it's one or the other: For me it'd be the garand, no question. Why?
The garand is effective at 100 yards, but the AK can't really reach out to 500 very well.
The garand is effective at 100 yards, but the AK can't really reach out to 500 very well.
Tough, tough choice. My choice would be the M1. I have both, and the AR15s get shot a LOT more, because they're fun, and ammo is cheap.
But, I won't part with the M1. It's a Winchester receiver, built in 1942: a WWII veteran. I hold it and wonder if some young Marine hauled it ashore on some God-forsaken tropical island, or if a young soldier struggled up the beach at Normandy with it. Don't try to convince me otherwise. Oh yeah, and:
BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!-piiinnnngggg! An experience all its own.
It's one of those rifles that get attention every time you go to the range.
My AR15s are homebrew, and there's a lot of pride in shooting a rifle that you've assembled yourself. They are FUN to shoot. I haven't gotten the accessorizing bug, at least not too bad, but that's a fun part of AR's, too. 20 and 30 round mags are common. Where I will shoot at most 40-48 rounds through the M1 on a visit to the range (shoulder gets a bit tired...), I have to limit myself to a couple hundred rounds with the AR.
But, I won't part with the M1. It's a Winchester receiver, built in 1942: a WWII veteran. I hold it and wonder if some young Marine hauled it ashore on some God-forsaken tropical island, or if a young soldier struggled up the beach at Normandy with it. Don't try to convince me otherwise. Oh yeah, and:
BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!-piiinnnngggg! An experience all its own.
It's one of those rifles that get attention every time you go to the range.
My AR15s are homebrew, and there's a lot of pride in shooting a rifle that you've assembled yourself. They are FUN to shoot. I haven't gotten the accessorizing bug, at least not too bad, but that's a fun part of AR's, too. 20 and 30 round mags are common. Where I will shoot at most 40-48 rounds through the M1 on a visit to the range (shoulder gets a bit tired...), I have to limit myself to a couple hundred rounds with the AR.
JNewell
Member
I love the AR-15, but I don't think I've ever seen any rifle generate smiles so consistently as the Garand.
The smile test...under the circumstances, doesn't that tell you a lot?
The smile test...under the circumstances, doesn't that tell you a lot?
drsteve
Member
Buy either one. It is impossible to choose wrong.
Selfdfenz
Member
To all,
I want to thank everyone for their opinions and the information you supplied.
I started filling out my CMP papaerwork for the second time last night. It's gonna happen. The more I consider the issue the more I think change over to 308 makes sense if the rack grade rifle I get has a poor barrel.
Also, I appreciate the idea of getting an AR down the road or even and SKS. I had but sold my SKS becasue it was turning into a hanger queen. I may have to re-think that with the Yugos everywhere you look.
S-
I want to thank everyone for their opinions and the information you supplied.
I started filling out my CMP papaerwork for the second time last night. It's gonna happen. The more I consider the issue the more I think change over to 308 makes sense if the rack grade rifle I get has a poor barrel.
Also, I appreciate the idea of getting an AR down the road or even and SKS. I had but sold my SKS becasue it was turning into a hanger queen. I may have to re-think that with the Yugos everywhere you look.
S-
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