Mechanically faster, revolver or semi?

[yeti]

Totally removing any human element, I think the revolver.

With S&W being faster in the Northern Hemisphere and Colt in the Southern due to the direction of cylinder rotation.

 

[Beagle-zebub]

With S&W being faster in the Northern Hemisphere and Colt in the Southern due to the direction of cylinder rotation.

LOL!

 

[General Geoff]

I'm not really interested in machine pistols or impossibly fast shooters. I'm just curious as to which (semi-auto or revolver) has the fastest cycle time.

Automatic pistols have a set cycle time. Revolvers have a cycle time which is directly dependent on the shooter. So if you're not interested in the speed of the shooter, the question is unanswerable.

 

[MrBorland]

Automatic pistols have a set cycle time. Revolvers have a cycle time which is directly dependent on the shooter. So if you're not interested in the speed of the shooter, the question is unanswerable.

Why wouldn't the revolver have a set cycle time? Recall that the revolver trigger, on reset, isn't mechanically linked to the trigger finger, so it'd reset at it's own rate, independent of the trigger finger.

I think what the OP is asking is if one were able to place each gun in a gizmo that pushes the trigger faster and faster, which would be the one that can't keep up at some point? I don't think anyone here (myself included) really knows the answer - you'd simply have to do the experiment.

 

[Izaak Walton]

Bob Munden.

Draws and fires pretty darn quick. Saw him draw and fan with his thumb and 3 or 4 fingers. The 45 wheel gun made a fast (super fast!) burp sound.
Accuracy? I doubt it but it was the fastest pistol I ever saw.

 

[Isher]

I'd look at a different aspect.........

Decision and implementation time.

If you are operating a revolver, assuming you don't carry it cocked,

You must

1.) Cock the hammer
2.) Aim the weapon
3.) Discharge the weapon
4.) Repeat the series of operations.

And by the way, doesn't matter if you are in single action or double
action mode, you are still "cocking the hammer."


If you are operating a semi auto

(I carry a CZ in decock mode)

You must

1.) Cock the hammer
2.) Aim the weapon
3.) Discharge the round
4.) Here's where it changes - the weapon automatically cycles to
inserting the next round into the chamber and cocking the hammer.
This relieves you of a decision cycle requiring a physical response.

In my opinion, this gives you precious time to stay focused on your sight picture while your trigger finger is already on the way to discharging the
next round. Fewer distractions, more speed.

This is entirely unscientific, of course.

isher

 

[john1911]

I think what the OP is asking is if one were able to place each gun in a gizmo that pushes the trigger faster and faster, which would be the one that can't keep up at some point?

Exactly, I wish I would have worded it this clearly in the beginning.

N/M. I'm not fast enough on the trigger to do the required experiment.

 

[Scratchy]

Revolver has to be faster because they do not depend on powder burn rates to cycle the action. right?

 

[polekitty]

Learned something new!

I'm a dummy! Tell me, what is "bump fire?" That's why I come to forums like this---I learn new things! I've been shootng for many, many years, but never heard that term before. Don't laugh! Just enlighten me.

 

[Doc_Jude]

look it up on Youtube. No amount of words will do actual video justice.

 

[4sooth]

Shooting Speed

Ed McGivern in his book "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" expressed the opinion that the Smith and Wesson revolver mechanism was at least twice as fast as a human could ever operate it.This would give a cyclic rate of well over 1000 rounds a minute if a human could pull and release the trigger that fast.

In the preface of the book he explains that the skill he had was after 30 years of training and millions of rounds of ammo.He was able to shoot this much because he was subsidized by Walter Goff,a wealthy Philadelphean who trained with him.

 

[Isher]

I dunno.

Seems to me you could build a machine for either which would exceed the mechanical cycle rate of the weapon.

The revolver's constraint would appear to be the duration of the hammer drop from full cock to ignition of the cartridge. Pulling the trigger faster than that still results in the ignition of a single round.

The semiauto's constraint would also appear to be the duration of the hammer drop from full cock to ignition of the cartridge, PLUS the cycle time of the action.

Assuming that trigger drop times for the two are probably within thousandths of a second of each other,
it would appear that, if you go to the theoretical mechanical limits of the two systems, the revolver is potentially faster than the semi.

isher

 

[MrBorland]

The revolver's constraint would appear to be the duration of the hammer drop from full cock to ignition of the cartridge. Pulling the trigger faster than that still results in the ignition of a single round.

You must also factor in the time it takes to 1) pull and 2) return the relatively long DA trigger through its travel. OTOH, the revolver's hammer wouldn't have to drop from full cock - you only get that in SA mode.

 

[MCgunner]

Revolver

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc-ayCF3RF4

Depending on your definition of revolver, case closed.

Jerry who?

 

[sniper5]

Watched Stan Sweet once a long time ago. He put in 4 rounds and ejected 4 empties after fanning with only 1 stroke. Sounded like 1 bang. He explained that he spread his fingers and fired 1 shot with little finger, middle finger, index finger and thumb. I doubt you could beat that with either double action or semi auto. He was firing blanks, but the cylinder and hammer still had to cycle. And it was a live show and he showed the cartridges before and after.

 

[Doc_Jude]

McGovern said the same thing, that with two hands the single action will run faster than the double action revolver any day in the hands of a skilled operator. Also, on the draw, the single action will get a shot off faster out of the holster, since you can cock it during the speed draw process. Short range practiced shots with sufficient caliber, it's far deadlier.

 

[PTK]

A revolver will be able to fire faster for a given number of rounds mechanically than almost all semi- or full- auto guns.

Most people can't do that, though.

 

[pugmug]

Faster than full auto???

 

[WardenWolf]

All the high-speed revolver shooters shoot single action revolvers, which are far from the norm today, and require 2 hands to shoot at those speeds. Compared to a modern double action revolver, the semi can be shot faster and more accurately. While there is at least one high-speed revolver shooter that does it with a double action, he still does not perform nearly as fast as the fastest single action or semi-auto shooters. For modern purposes, the semi is faster.

 

[MCgunner]

All in all, accuracy trumps speed and I ain't Jerry Miculek. As they say, you can't miss fast enough.

 

[Wolfebyte]

I vaguely remember Guns & Ammo doing a story on this back in the early 80's.. their conclusion then was that stock, straight out of the box, the revolver was faster.. The semi could be made faster using a spring kit and working over the slide, polishing the ramp etc..

either one is useless if the revolver gets out of time, or there is a mechanical failure to the semi..

 

[Gunfighter123]

I think , as has been said , the single action revolver would be faster then the semi-auto . NO trigger reset time and speed is totally dependant on the rotation of the cylinder.

 

[alistaire]

It's the man, not the machine.

 

[GoodKat]

I wonder if a machine designed to operate a revolver's trigger as fast as possible would break it, I also wonder if you could end up with bullets shooting into the frame because of the cylinder being rotated before the bullet can exit.

 

[Kind of Blued]

Mechanically, the revolver wins. If a human being is actually shooting the gun, the auto wins. Trigger travel & reset are really the only applicable factors when it comes to a real-life scenario.