Men defend selves amid gunfire from car thieves; now being evicted from Raleigh apartments

[bearcreek]

I thought lease agreements banning you from owning firearms and possessing them inside it violated the 2nd Amendment?

The 2A restricts the government, not the citizens or any lease agreements they may make.

 

[Aim1]

The property contract issues aside, these folks apparently do not seem to realize that the use or the threat of deadly force to defend personal property against theft is unlawful. They went out to defend property, and they end up using deadly force. Their problems could be a lot more serious than eviction. I would not want to be in their shoes.

Frantic, he threw on flip-flops and ran outside with his gun for protection.

“They open[ed] fire, shooting out my neighbors window,” Montgomery said. “I shot back two to three times.”

Cedric Verner is that neighbor.

Verner said the bullets that flew through his apartment “almost kill[ed] my kids by inches while they were lying in bed asleep.”

“I grabbed my gun … [and] returned fire,” said Verner.

The pair then said they received a letter in the mail notifying them they had three days to vacate.

 

[old lady new shooter]

Frantic, he threw on flip-flops and ran outside with his gun for protection.

“They open[ed] fire, shooting out my neighbors window,” Montgomery said. “I shot back two to three times.”

Cedric Verner is that neighbor.

Verner said the bullets that flew through his apartment “almost kill[ed] my kids by inches while they were lying in bed asleep.”

“I grabbed my gun … [and] returned fire,” said Verner.

The pair then said they received a letter in the mail notifying them they had three days to vacate.

I don't see how a guy returning fire after shots were fired into his apartment and missed his children by only inches, has done anything other than protect his family.

 

[Styx]

I don't see how a guy returning fire after shots were fired into his apartment and missed his children by only inches, has done anything other than protect his family.

Same here but I'm not in a debating mood today. For some people taking their car is taking their livelihood. There isn't much public transportation, and most employers aren't going to give a darn if you can't make it to work because you don't have a vehicle whether it was stolen, broke down, or you just couldn't afford one. It's how they get their children to or from school. I can't say that I'd sit back and do nothing other than watch while someone was taking my property, or I would approach or yell out warnings unarmed. It's a darn shame that we can't defend our own property with a firearm, but rather we have to call complete strangers with a badge after the fact to come with their firearms draw and ready to shoot to recover our property. If we do exactly what they'd do when we call them, we might face jail time.

After watching the video though I don't believe their story. I think the people in the car and the tenants most likely knew each other. All the white car did was slowly drive by the other car, and then drive down the street. Then the white car immediately fire shots from down the street when they saw the tenant outside? Before I seen the video I was under the impression that someone was in the act of trying to break into their vehicle when the first guy ran outside.

 

[Kleanbore]

For some people taking their car is taking their livelihood.

Irrelevant.

It's a darn shame that we can't defend our own property with a firearm,

Very old news.

 

[The Night Rider]

The property contract issues aside, these folks apparently do not seem to realize that the use or the threat of deadly force to defend personal property against theft is unlawful. They went out to defend property, and they end up using deadly force. Their problems could be a lot more serious than eviction. I would not want to be in their shoes.

Are you telling me that if I catch somebody trying to steal my car I don't have the right to go outside my home to try to stop them?

If I run out the front door and tell you to get the hell away from my car I haven't broken any laws.

If you draw a firearm and start shooting at me I get to shoot back.

 

[Atavar]

Are you telling me that if I catch somebody trying to steal my car I don't have the right to go outside my home to try to stop them?

You don’t have the right to use or threaten with deadly force to stop them.

If I run out the front door and tell you to get the hell away from my car I haven't broken any laws.

If you brandish a firearm or make deadly threats while you do so you have broken laws. I don’t agree with this but it is what it is.

If you draw a firearm and start shooting at me I get to shoot back.

Not if you initiated the combat.

 

[Kleanbore]

Are you telling me that if I catch somebody trying to steal my car I don't have the right to go outside my home to try to stop them

No.

If I run out the front door and tell you to get the hell away from my car I haven't broken any laws.

Correct. But it may not be a prudent thing to do.

If you draw a firearm and start shooting at me I get to shoot back.

Therein lies the rub. We have seen a number of cases in which defenders having so acted were convicted of serious crimes. The courts may take a different view in a specific case, but I wouldn't bet on it.

In the case at hand, the Shelby County authorities do not have a homicide case to address, and they would have to decide whether it would be worth the effort to go to trial over his. I doubt that they will.

 

[The Night Rider]

No.
Correct. But it may not be a prudent thing to do.
Therein lies the rub. We have seen a number of cases in which defenders having so acted were convicted of serious crimes. The courts may take a different view in a specific case, but I wouldn't bet on it.

In the case at hand, the Shelby County authorities do not have a homicide case to address, and they would have to decide whether it would be worth the effort to go to trial over his. I doubt that they will.

I wish I could come up with a good answer to this but I'm not sure there is one. I would have a very hard time watching someone steal my car and not doing anything to stop it.

I suppose you could pull the distributor wire every night.

I will say that I would never approach a criminal without assuming they're armed.

 

[Kleanbore]

I will say that I would never approach a criminal without assuming they're armed.

Better idea: never approach a known criminal alone unless you have to.

 

[The Night Rider]

Better idea: never approach a known criminal alone unless you have to.

What do I do at family reunions?

 

[wayneinFL]

Avoiding specifics about vehicle security, I will say it would make more sense to harden the vehicle or insure it than to run out with a gun in your hand (brandishing?) when someone gets close to it.

The car owner is lucky he's not sitting in jail while the supposed suspected car thief is on the news claiming self defense.

 

[Kleanbore]

Let's stay on topic, folks.

 

[GBExpat]

... When alternative housing that can be afforded is not available you stay your butt where you are and try to be happy about it. Low income communities are really bad about this because the community grows to utilize all reaources available… the lady who can get the kids off the school bus, the neighbor you can pay $50 a week for a ride to work and back, the guy who can fix anything. You change one little piece of that and it’s no different than shipping somebody off to China. They don’t know how to survive outside of that situation. They want to live there because that’s just where they live. ...

<applause> Nailed it! Impressive.

 

[citizenconn]

That might be okay in Texas within certain hours and under certain limited conditions, but it is rarely worth the expense, not to mention the risk.

Speaking as a native Texan of over 55 years, I contend that what is worth the expense and the risk is a personal decision and varies greatly depending on the situation. Being an administrator does not make you the ultimate arbitor on all firearms related situations.

 

[Kleanbore]

I contend that what is worth the expense and the risk is a personal decision and varies greatly depending on the situation.

Hence the word 'rarely".

One will have to compare the loss not covered by insurance with the estimable and predictable cost of legal representation if it does not go to trial, and take into account where it may go from there, when the actor is no longer in control of his own destiny.

Being an administrator does not make you the ultimate arbitor on all firearms related situations.

The subject is not at all limited to the use of firearms, and "firearms related situations" do not all involve the use of force or the threat thereof.