Military Primers for Mini 14?

[87hurricane]

Hey guys, getting ready to start reloading .223 for my Mini 14 and I have a few questions. My biggest question is about primers. I know military/harder primers are recommended for ARs due to the floating firing pin and the possibility of slam fires. Is this a possibility on the Mini as well? I'm going to start with 55g bullets since my rifle seems to like them, and either H335 or win 748. Just curious to see what you guys think. This will be my first time reloading for rifle, but I've reloaded for pistol for several years with good success. Thanks in advance guys

 

[kerreckt]

I use the Wolf srp with a thicker cup for all my .223/5.56 reloads. In the past I used CCI srp and never had a slamfire with my mini...YMMV...best wishes

 

[mtrmn]

I don't remember how many thousands of rounds I loaded for my old mini14, but I never even knew military primers were available for most of those rounds. I used CCI 400 without any problems. I also never remember seeing that little indent you see when you chamber a round in the AR15. I no longer have the mini due to its unfortunate demise.

 

[Rule3]

I don't use them nor do i use them in a 30 Cal carbine. Heck I don't use them in a AR either.

 

[Icky The Great]

I have never had issue with using standard commercial primers in auto guns. I had a select fire M4 and used reloads using CCI 400 primers. No issues at all. I know 3 other guys who shoot AR platforms using 400s in their loads. These guys are some serious prairie dog freaks, vans with shooting platforms on the roofs and upwards of 300 rounds fired daily when hunting. Of course they each have 5 guns with them. They way they think is this; Why loads specialty round for each rifles optimum performance. They run Blue Presses and churn out 8-9000 rounds in the off season. They take their ammo and run it in various rifles.
I can see loading specialty loads for an odd fast twist rifle (68+grains) as opposed to your collection of lead slingers that will shoot 55 grains all day accurately. For my 223s I use Win748 and Varget. Both do extraordinarily well spitting 55gr V Max or 69gr Varmint Grenades. Both loads are for long range rifles so they are a bit of a specialty load. I only have 2 bolt guns in 223. If they had the same twist (recently thought about changing the one for this reason) I would load 1 loading for the both.
Took a rabbit at 780 yards using the Vmax at 2900fps. There wasn't much left.
I have 5 .308s and only load one specialty load for the long range one but the others get fed a steady diet of the exact same loading: Sierra 150grFMJBT Gameking#2115 at 2600fps using Hornaday's Superformance. When I use this in my LR rifle it shoots accurately enough but the terminal velocity tends to lack beyond 800 yards. As in I would not use it on anything bigger than a coyote.

 

[rfwobbly]

I don't own a Mini14, but the answer to your question lies in whether the Mini has a spring to control the position of the firing pin. The AR does not have a spring, and therefore has no control over what the firing pin does when the bolt slams forward. Therefore, the AR sometimes needs the harder primer to prevent "slam fires".

Dis-assembly of your gun, or quickly looking up a parts diagram of the MIni14 on the Internet would give you the answer you seek.

Hope this helps.

 

[Icky The Great]

Some other threads on here people are saying the Magnum Primers are harder cups. If you think there may be an issue try them out.
I honestly think your fine running CCI400 in the mini

 

[M1key]

Never had a problem with slam fires in many years of reloading for Minis, ARs, AKs, etc. and I have been using some of the softest primers around (Federal).

Agree CCI400 will be fine.

M

 

[Slamfire]

The Mini 14 has the same free floating firing pin configuration of the Garand/M14 . The firing pin is basically unrestrained throughout the entire cycle. There may be some blocking of the firing pin retraction cam during lug rotation, but then, maybe not. All of these mechanisms have been known to slamfire in battery, and out of battery. Ed Harris, of “Ed’s Red” fame, mentioned out of battery slamfires with the Mini 14, since he worked at the American Rifleman they must have received a number of reports that are not in the public domain.

Slamfires are rare, the frequency depends on the mechanism, but on the web there is a report of a slamfire with every semi automatic mechanism with a free floating primer. Except the roller bolts, have not found any on the roller bolts. Mechanisms based on the Garand design also have out of battery slamfire reports, the greatest risk of an out of battery slamfire exists with a tight or long case and a sensitive primer. If the bolt has to de accelerate to crunch fit a round to the chamber that free floating firing pin is rebounding off the back of the primer. If the lugs are not in engagement, and the primer is sensitive enough, Ka boom!

You will reduce the risk of a slamfire by using the less sensitive military type primers. The risk is never zero, it increases with primer sensitivity, therefore always assume that the rifle can discharge when ever you chamber a round.

CCI, Tula and Federal have military sensitivity small rifle primers on the market, I have used the CCI #41's for years, they shoot fine in AR's.

 

[Slamfire]

I looked on the web for out of battery slamfire reports with the Mini 14.

It has been a default position in the shooting community to blame slamfires on “high primers” but this is because they are parroting an Army coverup. The Army does not want to admit that the Garand/M14 mechanism will slamfire, in and out of battery, given a sensitive enough primer. It is a design issue on a mechanism they designed, produced and fielded. So whenever people start diagnosing slamfires the first thing they say is “high primer”. It is what they have been taught. CCI has stated that high primers are the number one cause of misfires! So square that circle!

So, from reading the posts, the second poster thought the rifle was being fired with reloads, but it turns out the Mini 14 slamfires out of battery with LC 62 grain military ammunition!

Mini 14 out of Battery Slamfire

http://ingunowners.com/forums/long-guns/204699-ar15-slamfire-2.html

Slam fires happen. High primers in a reloaded cartridge are the usual culprit. Check all of your reloads for high primers on a flat surface. This is why I hand prime all of my rifle ammo. I check each one before they get powder and bullet. Every now and again, I get one that needs a little extra squeeze.

I had a true slam fire with a mini-14 a long time ago. It blew off the handguard, broke the wood stock, and blew out the contents of the magazine. My ears were ringing for a week from the explosion. I sent the rifle back to Ruger and they replaced it at no charge even though we all knew it was my fault. I never did find that handguard.....

There is no real reason to send your rifle back if the bolt lugs, upper, and the mag are undamaged. Technically you had a premature fire because the locking lugs must have been engaged so no pressure was released into the action.

Mini 14 exploded while shooting.

http://rugerforum.net/gun-stories/76442-mini-14-exploded-while-shooting.html

________________________________________

So I'm new to this forum and if this isnt in the right place please let me know.

I have about 16 years experience with firearms, and my family is big on firearms. we all love them. With that said I don't know everything there is to know about firearms so here's my story.

Yesterday I went shooting with my parents and my brother. We were sighting in a Mini-14 and a Saiga .223. My dad just shot his second shot with his Mini when all of the sudden it blew up. We picked up every piece we could find so that we could try to piece together what exactly happened.

Here's what we know: the bolt was open, the chamber was clear, and the first and second shots went with no problem. The trigger was also still cocked. Dad was lifting his head after his second shot when this happened.

We believe the barrel was clear as there is no visible blistering or bulging, the round being chambered was not struck on the primer. We believe the casing may have been cracked and we missed it when reloading.

The damage is severe, the stock from end to end was split, a chunk of the action was blown completely out on the right side, extractor and firing pin were blown out of the bolt, the bolt was thrown forward with the blown out cartridge.

Here's some new information, the cases are marked LC but do not say .223 or 5.56 on them, and the bullets are green tipped. I've gotten about 200 mil rounds from when I was in. the powder doesn't match what we use, and is also loaded at about 27 grains with 63 grain bullets. we only use 55 grain bullets and 25 grains of powder max. it's looking like factory 5.56 ammo. The magazine was loaded with this green tipped LC ammo.

 

[DPA]

I use magnum primers for all my ball powders (incl. h355). Recomended by Hogdon I believe. Some say to use harder primer cups to minimize slam fires. Slamfire1 covers the rest of my info.above.

 

[87hurricane]

Thanks guys. I think I'm just going to err on the side of safety and use #41s or mag primers.

 

[Rule3]

You didn't mention if yours is a regular ranch rifle or the target version??

The Ranch can take 223 or 5.56 ammo. The target is 223 only.
Even though the Ranch barrel is stamped 223 Rem. Confusing especially for such a safety oriented company like Ruger.

 

[87hurricane]

It's the newer Ranch model, a 582 series if I remember correctly.

 

[Rule3]

So what would you do if you went to the store and bought some factory ammo. Say Win White Box or any basic brand 223 Rem???

It does not have a Military primer.

 

[M1key]

So what would you do if you went to the store and bought some factory ammo. Say Win White Box or any basic brand 223 Rem???

It does not have a Military primer.

EXACTLY...

If it blows, send both Ruger and Winchester a (nasty)gram complete with pictures. Oh, and save all evidence including sales receipt for the rifle, ammo, and save spent brass, and any unfired ammo from the original box. Then threaten to only buy Chinese from now on if they don't make it right...LOL.

Seriously, shoot without worries.

M

 

[johnjohn]

I use small rifle magnum primers w/335. As per Lyman 47.