22/22mag
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Out to 100yds would there be much diference between the Mini 14 .223 or M1 .30 carbine for SD,HD?
Mini 14 weighs 6 3/4 lbs.
M1 weighs 5.4 lbs.
Mini 14 weighs 6 3/4 lbs.
M1 weighs 5.4 lbs.
Mini-14 or M1.30 carbine ?
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Scratch both and get a Ruger Police Carbine in 9mm or .40S&W.
...if you want a good HD gun.
I like my Mini 14 but the things aren't cheap and .223 is a long-distance round for varmints, not a short-distance man-stopper. Overpenetration and limited stopping power are not what you want when a robber is 15 feet from you and running your way with a crowbar. A good LE round in a pistol caliber is better, and less likely to hit a neighbor 200 yards away than the flat-shooting .223.
.30 Carbine just doesn't have the variety of effective SD rounds readily available.
...if you want a good HD gun.
I like my Mini 14 but the things aren't cheap and .223 is a long-distance round for varmints, not a short-distance man-stopper. Overpenetration and limited stopping power are not what you want when a robber is 15 feet from you and running your way with a crowbar. A good LE round in a pistol caliber is better, and less likely to hit a neighbor 200 yards away than the flat-shooting .223.
.30 Carbine just doesn't have the variety of effective SD rounds readily available.
Lobotomy Boy
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I have a PC9. It's a great gun, but its effective range is really less than 100 yards. The fall-off is pretty dramatic at 100 yards. If that isn't important, the PC9 is a cheap and fun plinker.
If you plan to hunt with it, the .30 caliber M1 is now legal for deer in Minnesota while a .223 is not. Your laws may vary.
If you plan to hunt with it, the .30 caliber M1 is now legal for deer in Minnesota while a .223 is not. Your laws may vary.
Lobotomy Boy said:
For HD, I'd say it's a GOOD thing if the thing loses a lot of energy by the time it's knocking on the neighbor's door.
WRT hunting with a .30 Carbine, by the numbers it's only a deer cartridge when the deer's close enough to use the bayonet. Legal it might be, but probably not a beginner's deer round!
MICHAEL T
Member
A m-1 carbine with a 110 gr SP bullet is a good fast handling short range weapon out to 150 yds. on people Military used to shoot out to 300 if I remember right. I have always had at least 1 in my collection since I got up close with them in 1967.
Perfect for women and younger children.My X has 1 also My present carbine is a WW2 model. Before the black rifle craze ,a lot of PD carried them in trunk of cruisers.
It hard to beat any old WW2 military weapon be it a 1911 or a M-1 Grand or the little carbine. These weapons went to war served out country and are still kicking along today. They worked in combat and they still will today even better with our improved ammo.. Just my 02
Perfect for women and younger children.My X has 1 also My present carbine is a WW2 model. Before the black rifle craze ,a lot of PD carried them in trunk of cruisers.
It hard to beat any old WW2 military weapon be it a 1911 or a M-1 Grand or the little carbine. These weapons went to war served out country and are still kicking along today. They worked in combat and they still will today even better with our improved ammo.. Just my 02
Lobotomy Boy
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For HD, I'd go with a .12-gauge pump.
At 100 yards the .30 carbine bullet is traveling at 1,567 fps and still has 600 ft. lbs. of energy while the 69 grain 5.56 still has 1070 ft. lbs of energy and the 55 grain bullet has 935 ft. lbs of energy. 600 ft. lbs vs 1070 ft. lbs makes the 69 grain 5.56 a better round. Factor in the current costs of good M1 Carbines rarely getting below the $700 mark while AR 15 type rifles can be had for that price and I think the AR 15 shooting the 69 grain bullet wins the competetion (and I'm a milsurp collector and M1 Carbine lover).
telecaster1981
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Back to the Man's Question
Between the Mini and the M1 carbine, the M1 wins hands down, at least for me. A few reasons:
1.) There are PLENTY of reliable Hi-Capacity, USGI magazines for the M1 carbine.
2.) Ergonomics are better on the M1.
3.) There is less of a problem with over-penetration with the M1.
4.) The M1 defines "handy"
I currently have two Mini-14s and one M1 carbine in my inventory, among many others. Magazine changes on the M1 are simple, and much like the M16/AR15, as opposed to having to rock the magazine into place like the Mini. Also, don't let anyone here fool you...the .30 carbine has more than enough power to get the job done, especially with soft point hunting ammunition. I've taken a handfull of deer and several coyotes with my M1 and stopping power wasn't an issue. For years, I kept my M1 beside my bed and slept easy.
Between the Mini and the M1 carbine, the M1 wins hands down, at least for me. A few reasons:
1.) There are PLENTY of reliable Hi-Capacity, USGI magazines for the M1 carbine.
2.) Ergonomics are better on the M1.
3.) There is less of a problem with over-penetration with the M1.
4.) The M1 defines "handy"
I currently have two Mini-14s and one M1 carbine in my inventory, among many others. Magazine changes on the M1 are simple, and much like the M16/AR15, as opposed to having to rock the magazine into place like the Mini. Also, don't let anyone here fool you...the .30 carbine has more than enough power to get the job done, especially with soft point hunting ammunition. I've taken a handfull of deer and several coyotes with my M1 and stopping power wasn't an issue. For years, I kept my M1 beside my bed and slept easy.
MudPuppy
Member
I don't think out to 100 yards there'd be much difference between those rounds, given identical placement.
Maybe the 30 carbine is easier to be defeated by body armor? (I don't know, just a thought--someone here likely knows the answer to that?)
Between the two, I'd take the M1--they just feel dang near perfect. Fantastic pointer too.
Maybe the 30 carbine is easier to be defeated by body armor? (I don't know, just a thought--someone here likely knows the answer to that?)
Between the two, I'd take the M1--they just feel dang near perfect. Fantastic pointer too.
Lobotomy Boy
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I have much experience with the M1 carbine (we literally shot the barrel out of one when I was a kid) and some with the Mini. I was much more accurate with the M1. In fact, I've never shot anything with open sights as well as that gun (though I'm even more accurate with my PC9 out to about 70 yards, but I have a Bushnell red-dot sight on that). I've always been disappointed with my performance with a Mini 14, though imagine I would improve with practice. Right now I believe I would stand a much better chance of getting a head shot with a good M1.
Tom C.
Member.
I have a Mini-14 and an M-1 Carbine made by Underwood during the war. Both are capable, but require some tuning for optimum performance. I have rebarreled the Mini and mounted a scope. It shoots mil ball into 1.5 - 2" at 100 yds, but does much better with handloads.
The Carbine doesn't take a scope easily, and shoots into 2.5 - 3" at 50 yds with iron sights. With handloads with 110 Sierra softpoint bullets, it cuts that in half.
Both are fully capable. Get both.
The Carbine doesn't take a scope easily, and shoots into 2.5 - 3" at 50 yds with iron sights. With handloads with 110 Sierra softpoint bullets, it cuts that in half.
Both are fully capable. Get both.
Dave Markowitz
Member
Either will work fine for HD if you use good ammo. I have an early 1980s Mini-14 and a WW2-vintage Underwood M1 Carbine. Some observations:
-- Mag changes are probably quicker with the M1. You can hit the mag release and the old one will drop out. New mags go straight in, rather than being rocked in like on the Mini-14.
-- The Mini-14's safety is superior IMHO. It has a Garand style safety, which is fully ambidextrous. The M1 Carbine's safety is one of two types: the early push-button or later swivel type. Either one is best activated from the right side of the gun.
-- The Mini-14 shoots .223/5.56 ammo. Most such ammo tends to fragment at close range and penetrate less at close range than .30 Carbine ammo. .30 Carbine Ball (FMJ) penetrates quite well but isn't such a great stopper. With expanding JHSP or JSP ammo, the Carbine's terminal ballistics are similar to .357 Magnum when fired from a rifle. Not all Carbines feed JSP or JHSPs reliably, however.
Note: Last August I spoke to a Cor-Bon rep. He told me that Cor-Bon is working on a 100 grain Powr-Ball load for .30 Carbine, but is having problems getting it to feed reliably in a variety of M1s.
-- Reliable GI 15 round magazines are easy to find and cheap. During the AWB, reliable Mini-14 magazines holding more than 10 rounds were hard to find. This is no longer the case. ProMag makes good Mini-14 20s and 30s, and even though Ruger officially doesn't sell factory 20s to non-LEO civilians, they are easy to find at gun shows or online. However, GI Carbine magazines are a lot cheaper -- $10 vs. $30 - $30 for the Ruger OEM mags.
IMO, either rifle is a good choice.
-- Mag changes are probably quicker with the M1. You can hit the mag release and the old one will drop out. New mags go straight in, rather than being rocked in like on the Mini-14.
-- The Mini-14's safety is superior IMHO. It has a Garand style safety, which is fully ambidextrous. The M1 Carbine's safety is one of two types: the early push-button or later swivel type. Either one is best activated from the right side of the gun.
-- The Mini-14 shoots .223/5.56 ammo. Most such ammo tends to fragment at close range and penetrate less at close range than .30 Carbine ammo. .30 Carbine Ball (FMJ) penetrates quite well but isn't such a great stopper. With expanding JHSP or JSP ammo, the Carbine's terminal ballistics are similar to .357 Magnum when fired from a rifle. Not all Carbines feed JSP or JHSPs reliably, however.
Note: Last August I spoke to a Cor-Bon rep. He told me that Cor-Bon is working on a 100 grain Powr-Ball load for .30 Carbine, but is having problems getting it to feed reliably in a variety of M1s.
-- Reliable GI 15 round magazines are easy to find and cheap. During the AWB, reliable Mini-14 magazines holding more than 10 rounds were hard to find. This is no longer the case. ProMag makes good Mini-14 20s and 30s, and even though Ruger officially doesn't sell factory 20s to non-LEO civilians, they are easy to find at gun shows or online. However, GI Carbine magazines are a lot cheaper -- $10 vs. $30 - $30 for the Ruger OEM mags.
IMO, either rifle is a good choice.
At 16 I started hunting coyotes for pelt with a .30 caliber Iver Johnson carbine.
It was the only centerfire rifle I could afford, cost me all of $115.00.
I shot enough coyote with that rifle and sold enough pelt that within a year I was able to buy a brand new Mini 14 Ranch rifle which one could actually mount a scope on without too much trouble.
That rifle continued to serve me for about a year and a half of shooting dogs until the temptation became too much and I joined the Army.
I remember those rifles fondly, they were not the best rifles I have ever owned and I have not owned examples of those rifles since but I spent many an hour in the field with them.
I sold them both when I got back from my Military tour and used the money to buy an M1A rifle, I was 23 at the time and I don't have that first M1A anymore either.
I never could keep hold of a firearm if something more interesting crossed my path, I guess that's how and why I started my own gunshop,,,,,,,
Either rifle will do a shooter well and why not buy them both, you can always sell the one that has the less appeal.
It was the only centerfire rifle I could afford, cost me all of $115.00.
I shot enough coyote with that rifle and sold enough pelt that within a year I was able to buy a brand new Mini 14 Ranch rifle which one could actually mount a scope on without too much trouble.
That rifle continued to serve me for about a year and a half of shooting dogs until the temptation became too much and I joined the Army.
I remember those rifles fondly, they were not the best rifles I have ever owned and I have not owned examples of those rifles since but I spent many an hour in the field with them.
I sold them both when I got back from my Military tour and used the money to buy an M1A rifle, I was 23 at the time and I don't have that first M1A anymore either.
I never could keep hold of a firearm if something more interesting crossed my path, I guess that's how and why I started my own gunshop,,,,,,,
Either rifle will do a shooter well and why not buy them both, you can always sell the one that has the less appeal.
telecaster1981
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Don't forget that there are USGI 30rd magazines for the M1. Technically, they were made for the M2 (selective fire) Carbine, but they function flawlessly in an M1. S'what I keep in mine.
MrAcheson
Member
The accuracy sounds about right, but I disagree that they don't take scopes easily. I put an ultimak scout rail on my M1 and it works very well. Installation was simple although some stocks may require a little sanding. I really didn't have much of a problem with mine.
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