Mosin Nagant rear sight Mod

[lencac]

Well, this is about my Mosin Nagant M38 errrrr uh cough cough my M44 modified to be a M38. Anyway I took off the bayonet attachment by driving out the 2 pins holding the whole assembly on the barrel, tapping it off the barrel, cutting off the sleeve just aft of the front sight band and then just reinstalling the front sight band and pin. This worked like a charm. Took it to the range to sight in. I used handloaded ammo, Norma cases, 45 gr. Varget powder, Speer .311 dia. 150 gr. spitzer SP bullets. It sighted in easily but with one problem. It shot 17 to 18 inched high at 100 yrds. off the bench. It seems that most iron combat sights that I have experienced all do this to various degrees. Nevertheless 18 inches high is a bit much. So then I tried
Sierra .311 dia. 174 gr MK bullets. Now it shot only 12 to 13 inches high. Still too much. The problem was how to correct this condition. The front sight is what it is, and being I lost my front sight post stretcher the front sight was going to remain where it was as far as elevation. So I said to myself, "self, if I can't raise the front sight my only other option was to lower the read sight". But how? Looking at the rear sight assembly and how it worked and was designed I could see if the rear sight slider was modified on the bottom side by removing material so as to allow the rear sight to sit further down it would also bring the point of impact down. So I took the rear sight apart and proceded to "modify" it and reblued it. Put it back together and right away I could see a noticable differnece in where the rear sight sat in the saddle. So I loaded some more 150 gr. rds. and headed back to the range. As you can see it the picture this made a wonderful difference. The point of aim is the bottom edge of the black Shoot&See target. All the rds. below the center line are me getting the new elevation figured out. The last 10 rds. are all above the center line. I could tell shooting it now, that allowing for my 53 year old eyes ans iron sights that it was shooting about 5 inches high. That's perfect. It should also make the heavier rds. be right on the money.
I know I'm not the only one to have this condition with these Mosin Nagants. Hopefully this may give some of you a way to bring the point of impact down at basically zero cost and a little hands-on can-do time

 

[DMK]

Not a bad idea. Should be a heck of a lot sturdier and more reliable than any of the front sight mods I've seen.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Good work and thank you for the idea. My 91/30 shoots ~20" high @ 100 yards. This should really help. Thanks again... Do you know how much material you removed?

 

[Threejs]

For mosins that shoot high, I use heat shrink tubing on the front sight, and trim till POA = POI.

 

[res45]

Here is what you need to do to fix your problem then you can leave your rear sight set to 100 Yds and adjust your front sight post to your particular reload I shoot an M44 using the Speer .311 150 Gr. SP I have also had great success using the Hornady .312 150 Gr. SP.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/mosinfrontsight/index.asp

 

[DMK]

The only problem with modifying the front sight (aside from it being a lot more work) is it moves the tip of the sight post up away from the center of the round sight guard.

 

[Cosmoline]

Good idea! I usually stick an old first gen mojo on mine if I'm going to do much shooting with it. The Finns typically just raised the front sight.

The one problem I've run into in efforts to lower the rear sight has been that on the M-91's in particular if you lower the rear sight much more than the established zero, the metal of the sight base starts to block the front sight. Those have extremely stumpy front sights, though, and you can find an aftermarket high sight pretty easily for them.

 

[Funderb]

I could see this happening, haha.
The mosin nagant was designed to shoot differently than western rifles. With a M/N you are supposed to put the aligned peg at the bottom of the black on the target, and then it will hit center.
That and the sights are in meters, which are longer than yards.
(arshins were gotten rid of in 1930)
But if that doesn't work then this idea is far more aesthetic than those stupid front site mods.

But did you ever have the problem with changed left/right trajectory with the bayonet extended or retracted?
It actually changes my m44 up to ten inches at 100 yards

 

[YardVarmint]

I've done the about same thing with various mil surps in the past, by filing down the underside of the slider on the rear sight.

Unless the rifle is given an "expert eye" going over no one will notice.

 

[lencac]

Bingo Yard. Removing some material from the slider was easy, of no cost, is completely not noticable, requires only a few things like sand paper and a flat surface, calipers to measure and punch and small hammer and the sight still functions as designed. Now if a guy had a belt sander it could be done literally in minutes. I did it by hand. I just used Birchwood Super Blue after I was done. Even the best trained eye would not know except that point of impact is now relative to the sight picture. As far as how much material I removed .... I'm not sure. To guess I'd say .030 to .040 in. Next time I'll do some measurements before. This one I did it by the "by-gosh by-golly that looks about right" method. It seemed to turn out pretty darn good though. As for the bayonett attachment on the M44's, unless you are using it to roast weenies around the ole' camp fire while singing kumbyah, it is a totally useless attachment that needs to go bye bye. It makes the firearm aukward, unbalanced and heavy. Not to mention how it affects the shooting quality. If anyone wants to know how to make that go bye bye easy let me know. It's just as simple as the sight fix. Here's a pic of my M44 without the stupid bayonett thing on it.

 

[Funderb]

I do have a question,
I can only hammer one pin out of the bayonet attatchment on my m44,
the other pin will not budge.
Seriously. I destroyed 2 punches trying to get it out. Rifle's fine, but the punches aren't. Well, they aren't destroyed, but they were peened over. I just filed them back down.

but what's the deal?

 

[lencac]

Interesting. The pins on mine came out relatively easy. Do you have it set up so as to allow a good firm hit? Which pin won't come out? Look at the pin ends to see if they look like they have any taper. Perhaps it will come out if tried from other direction. Couple things come to mind. At the part where the bayonett attaches to the sleeve tap on it there a bit both lengthwise and rotationally to try to free-up the pin a little bit. And of course heat is an option. Like from a butane torch. Try heating it a bit then give it a whack. Perhaps even try a bigger punch which would be naturally stronger. Taper the very end of the punch just enough to allow you to hit the pin with more force causing it to just budge a bit. If you can get it to budge I think you'll be home free. If it's the pin on the rear of the sleeve which will not be used again then perhaps with a Dremel you could grind away some of both ends to try to eliminate any mushrooming which might be causing the problem. Anyway let me know how it turns out for you
Oh, and before you take the sleeve off remember to mark the sight band to the barrel so you can put the sight band back on at the same clocking on the barrel as it came off.

 

[Cosmoline]

Use Kroil for the stuck pin. It has never failed me. Just don't do it in an enclosed space or the fumes will kill you.

The mosin nagant was designed to shoot differently than western rifles. With a M/N you are supposed to put the aligned peg at the bottom of the black on the target, and then it will hit center.

;-) You should have worked for their ministry of truth!