bainter1212
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Some people are more interested in comparing muscle size instead of offering practical solutions to a simple question.
Mosin Nagant Safety
- Thread starter samort457
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Sam Cade
Member
I've never had any difficulty actuating the safety on a Mosin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IibwoPhApk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IibwoPhApk
bainter1212
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Sam, that is a pretty loud "clack" noise for trying to be quiet while hunting. If it can be done slower and smoother that would be the ticket.
Sam Cade
Member
I was being dramatic. 
Just don't let it slam forward.
Just don't let it slam forward.
The 98 mauser 3 position safety Winchesters and the newer rugers the safeties lock into a notch in the back of the firing pin therefore locking the firing pin and I think they are the best.
BCRider
Member
Oh well, sure.... if we worked out with OUR Mosin safeties on a daily basis we'd all build up OUR muscles as well!
You're right that when operated firmly like a Mosin needs and seems to have been designed to work like that it's not a big deal. But it's not something that can be done with the rifle at the shoulder for most folks. And certainly not a shoulder, sight, ease off the safety and then take the shot sort of deal.
Hey, at least we haven't had the collectors stopping in to bemoan the abuse being suggested by modifying the tail piece and swapping out triggers and other "desecrations"....
You're right that when operated firmly like a Mosin needs and seems to have been designed to work like that it's not a big deal. But it's not something that can be done with the rifle at the shoulder for most folks. And certainly not a shoulder, sight, ease off the safety and then take the shot sort of deal.
Hey, at least we haven't had the collectors stopping in to bemoan the abuse being suggested by modifying the tail piece and swapping out triggers and other "desecrations"....
LAGS
Member
@ Ball3006
That is exactly why I worked on designs to block the downward movement of the sear, or blocked the forward movement of the cocking piece like on a Lee Enfield.
Both designs worked but were not practicle, and you had to modify the original receiver too much.
I made a trigger block safety, but abandoned the idea when I determined that it really wasn't a safety.
That is exactly why I worked on designs to block the downward movement of the sear, or blocked the forward movement of the cocking piece like on a Lee Enfield.
Both designs worked but were not practicle, and you had to modify the original receiver too much.
I made a trigger block safety, but abandoned the idea when I determined that it really wasn't a safety.
BCRider
Member
Sorry ball3006 but clearly you either don't own a Mosin or you are assuming things that are just not so.
The whole tailpiece jumps forward when the rifle shoots. So it's not possible to put it on safe other than when it's cocked. And when it's on Safe it's REALLY safe because the end of the striker pin is held way back off the primer and there's no floating pin of any sort that could hit the primer.
The whole tailpiece jumps forward when the rifle shoots. So it's not possible to put it on safe other than when it's cocked. And when it's on Safe it's REALLY safe because the end of the striker pin is held way back off the primer and there's no floating pin of any sort that could hit the primer.
Sorry ball3006 but clearly you either don't own a Mosin or you are assuming things that are just not so
Sorry, you are incorrect. Pull a bolt out of a MN and place the cocking knob in the safety position and see the firing pin protude past the bolt face. I have been collecting Mosin Nagant rifles for many years. I have 29 of them and a big box of spare parts, bolts included.....chris3
Sorry, I stand corrected. The cocking know catches on the receiver and does not move all the way forward. chris3
Sorry, you are incorrect. Pull a bolt out of a MN and place the cocking knob in the safety position and see the firing pin protude past the bolt face. I have been collecting Mosin Nagant rifles for many years. I have 29 of them and a big box of spare parts, bolts included.....chris3
Sorry, I stand corrected. The cocking know catches on the receiver and does not move all the way forward. chris3
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BCRider
Member
Your last post got me curious so I went and checked one of mine.
Yep, if I have the bolt out and move the tail piece to "safe" the pin does indeed stick out.
But when in the receiver and moved to "Safe" it's a different story as you found out. I also found that there are two contact points. The first is that the sear lug of the tail piece is lifted off the trigger sear and rotated to rest or at least be blocked from going ahead by a shoulder in the receiver. At the same time the cocking ridge wedges into the cam cutaway of the bolt and locks the bolt handle down. So the gun is not only on Safe but it's locked closed as well.
Ya know... the more I see and study my "crude" Mosin Nagant rifles the more impressed I am of the little details and how a few fairly simple pieces all come together to work far better than the sum of the basic parts.
While I was at it I cycled from Safe to Fire a dozen or so times thanks to the inspiration lent us by Sam Cade. And truly it's not as bad as I thought it was. I tried it back when I got the rifles and thought "THIS is rather useless ! ! ! ! ". But in reality it's not that bad at all. It DOES take a firm hand but it's not that hard to do. However as suggested before it's not something you'd do while the rifle is mounted at the shoulder. Instead it would be a case of sizing up the game and commiting to at least shouldering for a shot by switching to "Fire" while the gun is at a low position then shouldering and aiming. And with even a little practice it's the sort of thing that could be done all by feel without even looking at the rifle.
Yep, if I have the bolt out and move the tail piece to "safe" the pin does indeed stick out.
But when in the receiver and moved to "Safe" it's a different story as you found out. I also found that there are two contact points. The first is that the sear lug of the tail piece is lifted off the trigger sear and rotated to rest or at least be blocked from going ahead by a shoulder in the receiver. At the same time the cocking ridge wedges into the cam cutaway of the bolt and locks the bolt handle down. So the gun is not only on Safe but it's locked closed as well.
Ya know... the more I see and study my "crude" Mosin Nagant rifles the more impressed I am of the little details and how a few fairly simple pieces all come together to work far better than the sum of the basic parts.
While I was at it I cycled from Safe to Fire a dozen or so times thanks to the inspiration lent us by Sam Cade. And truly it's not as bad as I thought it was. I tried it back when I got the rifles and thought "THIS is rather useless ! ! ! ! ". But in reality it's not that bad at all. It DOES take a firm hand but it's not that hard to do. However as suggested before it's not something you'd do while the rifle is mounted at the shoulder. Instead it would be a case of sizing up the game and commiting to at least shouldering for a shot by switching to "Fire" while the gun is at a low position then shouldering and aiming. And with even a little practice it's the sort of thing that could be done all by feel without even looking at the rifle.
Had a bit of a problem with the safety and a loud-clicking bolt with my MN (M-44). On the advice of an long-time MN owner, I picked up a tube of Moly Paste. Broke down the bolt assembly and hand-rubbed it with the paste. Safety now engages smoothly. Bolt action now smooth and quiet. It's a once-every-100,000-miles treatment, so a small tube will last a lifetime. Highly recommended. Swing by your local auto parts store or order it at http://www.amazon.com/Moroso-35000-...TF8&qid=1388288672&sr=8-5&keywords=moly+paste
LAGS
Member
Before you do the Moly Lubing, try to polish or Lap your Cocking cam on the bolt body and cocking piece with something like SemiChrome or Flitz metal polish.
You just put the polish on the cam surfaces, and work the bolt so they Polish and lap together.
I usually Ink my cams with a felt marker, or Dykem layout fluid and work then and see what the wear pattern looks like first.
Then recheck it after I do the Lapping.
It can make your bolt open easier, and close a little quieter.
But dont overdo it. You just want to Polish it or Shine it up , Not Remove or reshape the camming surface
You just put the polish on the cam surfaces, and work the bolt so they Polish and lap together.
I usually Ink my cams with a felt marker, or Dykem layout fluid and work then and see what the wear pattern looks like first.
Then recheck it after I do the Lapping.
It can make your bolt open easier, and close a little quieter.
But dont overdo it. You just want to Polish it or Shine it up , Not Remove or reshape the camming surface
Tom609
Member
Thanks for the link. Looks like a reasonable solution.
MN safety
I believe that Brass Stacker makes a ring that attaches to the rear knob so you can put your finger through it to pull the darn thing back. The way it was made I doubt if it was intended to be used at all mine takes two people to pull it back
I believe that Brass Stacker makes a ring that attaches to the rear knob so you can put your finger through it to pull the darn thing back. The way it was made I doubt if it was intended to be used at all mine takes two people to pull it back
Carl N. Brown
Member
I learned (after complaining and receiving tips) that I should pull back on the safety (cocking piece) with my right hand and rotate the rifle with my left hand to engage/ disengage the safety. Pulling back and rotating with the left hand is too much work, which discourages some from using the safety. The safety is also intended to be used in a Russian winter while wearing heavy Artic gloves.
Kuyong_Chuin
Member
Kuyong_Chuin
Member
Mine must have something wrong with it, no way it is that easy on mine.
Update: took a cord tied it to the safety and the other end to a barbell to see if it would pull it back with the butt on the floor. Result: The safety didn't move with a 25 lbs barbell hanging from it. I don't have a bigger weight or a large fish scale to measure it with right now but I do know it is easier to pull back my 45 lbs recurve bow than to set the safety on that thing. I can do it but it is not easy to do. I am going to get a ring for mine when I can. The one I tried that had a ring on it was allot easier to work. I don't know if it was just because of the ring or that the safety on the bolt was adjusted differently.
No4Mk1*
Member
To quietly disengage the safety put the stock in the crux of your right arm and then you have leverage to disengage the safety quietly. Then aim.
Ash
Member
No4 has it exactly right. Too many folks try to engage the safety with their whole arm when all you need are finger tips. Put the butt in the elbow joint, grasp with finger tips, and turn. All you use are the muscles in your forearm. It's easy. It's quiet. It's very, very solid.
Doug Bowser taught that one to me 20 years ago. Ever since then, Mosin safeties have been easy. Arisaka safeties are more difficult than a Mosin.
Doug Bowser taught that one to me 20 years ago. Ever since then, Mosin safeties have been easy. Arisaka safeties are more difficult than a Mosin.
caribou
Member
The solution, no mods nessessarry. Do it the way the Russian/Soviets taught thier troops, its incredibly easy once you get "the trick' down.
When a Mosin Nagant is taken off "safe" the fireing pin does NOT rest againt the pirmer. Pull the rigger and watch the striker advance forwqard to the primer. If you should slip while pulling back the knob, the sear will catch it easily. In 12 years of year round hunting with my last Mosin in terribly cold, finger numbing Arctic weather, I have slipped or sloppily let my safety off, and none made it past "Cocked" with the sear. Nver had an accidental discharge either.
Ok, I taught plenty of guys, as well all my daughters (I have 5) and the wife the best way I know how to safe/unsafe a Mosin; #4Mk1 has it in short terms.
Holding the rifle, say at "aim and fire", dismount the buttstock from your shoulder and while still grasping the fore end of the rifle with the left hand, move the buttstock to the elbow/crook of your inner arm. Then remove your right hand from grasping the stock behind the trigger, and move it to behind the cocking /safety knob. Then, with forefinger and thumb, grasp the pulling knob. Then pull and rotate, either into or out of the Safe/fire positions. Its actually makes it very very easy.
You will find that you bicep will assist your pull to great advantage. Its also the way the Russians taught their troops to do this. You will be pulling and swelling the muscles in the inner arm, and the strength you have will double.
Works for my 8 year old.
When a Mosin Nagant is taken off "safe" the fireing pin does NOT rest againt the pirmer. Pull the rigger and watch the striker advance forwqard to the primer. If you should slip while pulling back the knob, the sear will catch it easily. In 12 years of year round hunting with my last Mosin in terribly cold, finger numbing Arctic weather, I have slipped or sloppily let my safety off, and none made it past "Cocked" with the sear. Nver had an accidental discharge either.
Ok, I taught plenty of guys, as well all my daughters (I have 5) and the wife the best way I know how to safe/unsafe a Mosin; #4Mk1 has it in short terms.
Holding the rifle, say at "aim and fire", dismount the buttstock from your shoulder and while still grasping the fore end of the rifle with the left hand, move the buttstock to the elbow/crook of your inner arm. Then remove your right hand from grasping the stock behind the trigger, and move it to behind the cocking /safety knob. Then, with forefinger and thumb, grasp the pulling knob. Then pull and rotate, either into or out of the Safe/fire positions. Its actually makes it very very easy.
You will find that you bicep will assist your pull to great advantage. Its also the way the Russians taught their troops to do this. You will be pulling and swelling the muscles in the inner arm, and the strength you have will double.
Works for my 8 year old.
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BCRider
Member
Thanks for the elbow trick. I'll try that.
jaytex1969
Member
Safety matters aside, seeing a 74 year old man wearing a Beavis & Butthead shirt restores a tiny bit of my faith in humanity.
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