Multiple smaller safes vs. one large safe - don't put all of your eggs in one basket!

[MCMXI]

What are your thoughts on this approach? Wouldn't it be prudent to distribute a collection over two or three smaller quality safes rather than putting everything in one safe? I've been looking at safes from Sturdy Gun Safe Manufacturing and a 2723 safe combined with a 3224 safe, both with fire protection, would cost $4,373 delivered. Combined, these two safes could hold 37 rifles and each safe weighs 775lb and 850lb respectively. A 4824 safe with fire protection would cost $3,209 and could hold 39 rifles but that safe weighs 1060lb.

PROS of multiple smaller safes

1. Each safe weighs less making them easier to move into the home
2. Smaller safes are easier to locate/fit
3. Two safes allows for placement in different parts of the house
4. A thief would need to break into both (or more) safes in order to steal the entire collection

CONS of multiple smaller safes

1. Additional upfront cost

This thread isn't purely academic. I'll be moving to a different state soon and will need to purchase one or more safes.

 

[bigfatdave]

If the plan is to bolt the safes down properly or at least bolt them together in a hard-to-steal configuration, then there might be some advantage.
On the other hand, if the safe's purpose is solely to be in compliance with some nanny-state nonsense law, then a bare minimum steel cabinet would be the way to go.

I don't know, I'm of the opinion that if one is going to do a safe, ordering one and having it installed in a semi-permanent fashion is the way to go ... but at this point I'm in an apartment and working with a cabinet ... it isn't worth it to me at this point, the cabinet provides me with a first line of defense, someday I'll be setting up a permanent solution, when I can have a "gun room" or at least some workshop space ... at which point I'll want a well-organized single container that will hold ~150% of my accumulation if carefully packed, and the cabinet can become an ammo dump or store other valuables.

I also have items more valuable than guns around, they're in a small fire safe ... don't over-focus on the guns, they're only one kind of small portable wealth, really.

 

[MCMXI]

If the plan is to bolt the safes down properly or at least bolt them together in a hard-to-steal configuration, then there might be some advantage

I would definitely bolt the safes to a concrete floor.

I also have items more valuable than guns around, they're in a small fire safe ... don't over-focus on the guns, they're only one kind of small portable wealth, really.

That's not my situation at all. I have a lot of money invested in firearms and optics and have no intention of letting some low life crack head walk off with any of them. My current set up is very secure, but I'll be moving to a more rural setting and want to do everything reasonably possible to keep what I've worked hard to collect.

 

[rbernie]

I am a firm believer in 'storage diversification', both in numbers and in location.

 

[beatledog7]

This debate has occurred in the Department of Defense re: homeporting of Naval vessels. One side says we can save money on support costs by having only a few large ports, the other says that makes it too easy for an attacker to destroy more assets. Both are right. It comes down to how you stack your priorities.

For me, splitting things up makes sense if you can afford it in terms of money, space, and spousal tolerance. That said, I currently use just one large safe but will acquire a couple of smaller ones as circumstances allow.

BTW, unless you're some sort of human forklift, moving anything that weighs over 500 lbs or so around your home is nigh unto impossible. There's hardly a practical one-man dolly with that sort of load capacity. All of the models the OP mentioned are well above the range that a single person can move safely (pun intended), so once they're put, they're staying.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

I am for diversification. I buy as big a safe as I can afford and place in the house then I fill it with guns. Once it is full and I cull the herd a time or two, I buy another big safe and start the process again. Repeat as needed.

 

[a1abdj]

The biggest advantage of this approach is that it allows you to store a larger value inside of lighter safes.

If you have an expensive collection, common sense may say that you need a TL rated safe to truly protect the value. However, by splitting the collection up, a few RSC rated safes may be sufficient.

In addition, they tend to be easier to move and install.

 

[hatmpita]

I would suggest checking the used market and taking time to find the deal. This is what I did and was able to get a TL-30 safe that is 65"x28"29" for $1,800. By the way this was a jewelry store going out of business, the safe was three years old, and they had records of servicing by a certified safe tech. There are deals out there just got to be patient.

 

[rcmodel]

I have a good friend who went with a big safe and a small safe.
He used the big safe for his extensive collection of Kimber of Oregon serial #1 rifles, and Ruger #1's.

Then he put all the Kimber bolts in the small safe with his Ruger handgun collection.

So what happened?
He got burglarized, and they stole the small safe.
Apparently the big safe with all the rifles in it was way too heavy for them to pack off.

Now all he has left is an extensive collection of Ruger #1's.
And an extensive collection of Kimber of Oregon serial #1 rifles, with no bolts!

I vote big heavy safes!!

rc

 

[MCMXI]

The biggest advantage of this approach is that it allows you to store a larger value inside of lighter safes.

If you have an expensive collection, common sense may say that you need a TL rated safe to truly protect the value. However, by splitting the collection up, a few RSC rated safes may be sufficient.

In addition, they tend to be easier to move and install.

Exactly!!

He got burglarized, and they stole the small safe.

There's no way someone is going to walk off with a 800lb safe that is bolted down to a concrete slab ... not in a few minutes anyway.

 

[rcmodel]

He had it bolted to a concrete garage floor with Hilti bolts.

Apparently, more then one guy showed up, with a big pry bar or jack? to pop the bolts out, and an appliance dolly to haul it out to the waiting truck.

rc

 

[MCMXI]

He had it bolted to a concrete garage floor with Hilti bolts.

Apparently, more then one guy showed up, with a big pry bar or jack? to pop the bolts out, and an appliance dolly to haul it out to the waiting truck.

This is why protecting our valuables needs a systematic approach with as many obstacles to thieves as possible. I don't consider it prudent to install a safe with valuables in a garage. Some might argue that they have no choice, but I would argue that if it's easy to install, it's easy to remove.

Given enough time, the necessary equipment, the necessary manpower and sufficient desire, anything is possible. However, all I can hope for is that an alarm system, dogs and quality safes bolted to a concrete floor will be enough for the vast majority of criminals. Another important factor is not broadcasting what I have and keeping what I have out of sight.

 

[Hammerdown77]

Man, they got it out and it was BOLTED to concrete? Couldn't do that with a prybar.

There's a video on YouTube by Sturdy Safe showing different concrete mounting anchors. In one demo, they had a big forklift with a chain connected to the bolt in concrete. The back end of the forklift came off the ground and they still hadn't busted the bolt loose.

Maybe he should have used one of those!

 

[rbernie]

I hear that a chain and snatch strap is often used for this sort of thing than jacks, since a hard/fast impact tends to be more useful than a slow/steady pressure.

Don't put the safe somewhere that can be directly accessed by vehicle. I also make sure that I bolt the safes to both the floor and wall, so that it's impossible to wrap them with anything that can be used to snatch them out of their mountings. If I can't back the safe against the wall, I will build up the wall with framing timbers screwed into the wall to fill in the gap in a way that is not easily removed.

 

[Mike1234567]

When I can stop spending all my cash on the old homestead I'll be buying two or three surplus GI water-tight steel 12"x12"x48" boxes and mounting them vertically on a hidden wall behind a fake wall at the back of a closet. Unless a thief knows about the wall or accidentally finds it they'll never know where the firarms are. Of course, this won't help in a fire but I don't have faith that most safes will protect firearm well enough in most fire situations anyway.

 

[a1abdj]

I hear that a chain and snatch strap is often used for this sort of thing than jacks, since a hard/fast impact tends to be more useful than a slow/steady pressure.

That's why you can't get all excited about some of the videos various manufacturers put out. At first glance they may appear impressive, but once you realize the "trick", it's not nearly as impressive.

Four 3/8" bolts could easily hold 8,000 pounds or more, which would easily lift the back of a forklift up. A 4,000 pound one ton truck that gets up to about 10 MPH before the chain goes tight is going to get a bit more than that. A small bottle jack that is easily carried could also produce more than that. In fact, I use a small bottle jack to remove drop safes that are bolted in to concrete all the time. If it's bolted well it may distort the bottom of the safe. Doesn't matter though, they all pop out.

The other big weakness to most gun safes are the thin floors/walls. You can have the best bolt in the world, but it's not going to do you much good if the floor of the safe just tears off around it.