My gun saved me today.

[dkk73]

ShooterMcGavin:

Jeez... re: Mr. Rape-apologist....

It annoys the ************ (could be any word) out of me to hear statements like that. Just like large people talking about how only cowards need guns. It doesn't take a god-like amount of empathy to understand the ways in which other people are vulnerable. Especially women.

Ugh.
Ugh again...

 

[Elvishead]

Ok, I define coward's with guns, and people that stand up for them self's (without guns).

A coward doesn't always have a gun, neither does a person that stands up to this antagonizer.

But to "brag" online that ("I felt so good to have my gun") it is just self.

Bad message!

I've been there without gun, more than once.


Excuse my Russian laguage!

 

[fiddleharp]

Grungy-looking guy? Was he homeless, or perhaps the lead guitarist for Pearl Jam out for a stroll?
Anyway, years ago I worked seven days a week for our local homeless coalition and I saw and heard it all.
Depending on how you were dressed, it really could have been a case of mistaken identity.
Were you attired in a day-glo spandex leotard and futuristic-looking helmet, bent over the handlebars of an expensive titanium racing bike?
Or were you dressed more conservatively, astride a modest bicycle that a homeless person might, when glimpsing it from the corner of his eye, make a snap judgment that this is the bike that was recently stolen from him?
Life is rough on the streets. There is a never-ending, low-intensity war going on among the homeless. They steal each other's bicycles constantly. Since bikes are their only mode of transport, they take great offense, and many street brawls start when the aggrieved party spots his stolen bike being ridden by another. Been there, seen that!
Also, some of these guys are extremely nearsighted, and eyeglasses are among the first possessions lost in this lifestyle. In our town we have an optometrist who gives free eye exams and glasses to the homeless. I used to drive guys to the office for this service, and a week later, the glasses were lost! Oh well...
So, maybe you were mistakenly accosted by a nearsighted homeless guy trying to recover his stolen bike.
Just a scenario suggestion. You were there. I wasn't.

 

[Speedo66]

The OP backpedeled with "I just instinctively put my hand on the handle".

How do any of your posts square with "My gun saved me today"?

Saved your life? Saved you from taking evasive action? Saved you from what?

It may have cost you your freedom had your action been witnessed. Your move may have been considered a threat of deadly physical force, pull it and it raises to reckless endangerment. Use it and it raises to attempted murder, or worse.

 

[ojibweindian]

Ganymede

I think you did just fine.

 

[nelson133]

The trolls and internet experts always show up with perfect knowledge of what you should have done in any situation, and BTW you have always handled it wrong. When the qualifications for this criticism consist of a keyboard and internet access, the standards aren't too high.
If your instincts told you were in danger, then you were. I suggest anyone questioning that read "The Gift Of Fear" written by someone who really is an expert. Doing your own after action report can help you learn from your experience. People have died from falls from bicycles, you were in danger.

 

[Phydeaux642]

So can any of you "experts" tell me that if the perpetrator had a weapon hidden that the OP had to wait to see him pull it first. In his situation at that time and that place and based upon his past experiences he "prepared" to take action.

I have transients approach me fairly often and my first thought is not to reach for my weapon. If I reached for a weapon everytime a questionable looking person got near me I'd have my hand reaching for something everytime I walked into a mall or a grocery store. Good lord, the paranoia runs deep. And, again, I'm not giving the OP a hard time. I wasn't there. It's all of the other folks with the I would "whip the guy's ass" attitude that bothers me. Like someone else said, maybe it was really a case of mistaken identity.

Some folks here would do well to visit the Non-firearms section on this forum.

 

[mljdeckard]

I can't see where the OP did anything wrong at all. I furthermore cannot see how his sharing it with us to reflect on and put into our own perspective can be a bad thing. He's not bragging about anything.

I have lived very close to where this happened, and several years ago I had to use mass transit from this area twice a day. I had to deal with more than one person who wanted to talk to me when I wanted nothing to do with them. Offers of drugs, unintelligible threats, general bad feelings. If I still had to go there, I would still be armed and aware.

 

[SCKimberFan]

Trying to knock a guy over while he is riding his bike seems to me that it may qualify as assualt? Am I wrong?

 

[RX-178]

I think the basic misconception that is being held by those who feel the OP's response was inappropriate is that he was escalating a confrontation.

The OP responded to an unexpected, and unprovoked attack by an unknown aggressor. Preparing to defend yourself, and observing the threat is not an escalation of the confrontation, nor is it an unwarranted response.

Flipping the man off and saying 'what the *bleep* is your problem?!' would be an escalation.

Drawing a firearm and pointing it at the man and demanding he back off, would be an unwarranted response.

 

[Speedo66]

Maybe the OP needs to ask himself "what would I have done if I wasn't carrying a gun", and do that first in the future.

Reaching for a gun is the LAST thing to do.

 

[mljdeckard]

Perhaps the reason he did what he did was he felt at the time that it was the appropriate response. He is the only one who knows whether or not there was something else he could have done. It is entirely possible that if he were not armed, there was nothing else he could have done anyway.

 

[fiddleharp]

By the way, in my post I wasn't suggesting the OP did anything wrong in his response.
I was just suggesting a possible reason for being accosted by the "grungy guy" in the first place.

 

[Seamusalaska]

This is a different scenario but my 70 year-old brother had just just left a grocery after buying a frozen chicken. It was dark and a younger man grabbed his arm in the parking lot and said, "Give me your money!". My brother unthinkingly smacked the guy in the head with the frozen chicken and dropped him. Brother quickly left in his car. He told me that only later did he remember he was armed with his concealed carry pistol. Who knows what your response may really be under sudden stress? He didn't call the police or stay around to see if the attacker was OK or not. He said he just reacted totally without thinking and didn't 'wake up' until he reached his house twenty minutes later. I hope this isn't too off topic although I chuckle about the frozen chicken aspect of it. My point is, he said he completely forgot he was legally carrying and just struck out blindly.

 

[fiddleharp]

Good thing it wasn't a frozen turkey. Your brother might have faced manslaughter charges!

 

[ganymede]

wow there sure are a lot of people out there who know exatly what they would have done in my shoes. you guys must have a ton of experience fighting for your life. People say I'm bragging, that i over reacted, but I don't recall typing something like.

"yeah i scared the crap out of some bum who was about to ask me for spare change. he tapped my tire and stuck a hand out with a look of despair in his eye, so i pulled out my 9 and pointed it at his forhead and said 'get down on your knees B!@#$. i wanna hear you beg for your life BEG ME!' and then i pistol whipped him upside the head and spit on his face."

maybe i did type something like that and then i deleted and forgot that i typed and deleted it? you would think so from some of the posts.

the fact is i was assualted. yeah trying to knock some off their bike or motorcycle is considered asault and in some case's it would be okay to use deadly force to stop that. kind of like if some rammed their car into yours at 30 mph.

as to the possability of mistaken identity. yes that's very possable. the guys words were "sorry, wrong guy." he could have meant he mistook me for someone he knew, or it could have meant "i picked the wrong guy to !@#$ with" i guess i'll never know.

and he wasn't any of the guys from pearl jam or nirvana. just some homeless looking guy.

 

[ganymede]

As to how i was dressed. black cotton t-shirt, black shorts, backback, $1000 specialized mountian bike. i suppose the bike could have looked like a cheaper one and i could have looked like a homeless dude to someone who REALLY needed glasses.

 

[Average Joe]

SK Kimber, that's the way I read it. If I am riding my bike and somebody kicks my tire and I go flying, that is a very flagrant attempt to hurt someone. I would not shoot him, but I would have kicked his ass.

 

[Seamusalaska]

-fiddleharp, ha ha. Yes, a frozen turkey would really have done it.

-ganymede, I agree with your basic response. I don't know what I would have done in your shoes. Many people Think they know what they would have done, but I'm not so sure. Some folks freeze. Some lash out. Some actually shoot. Some just run. I think your response is perfectly understandable given the circumstances.

 

[jad0110]

Quote:
he certainly does not have the point of reference of a 100 pound woman. He has also said that women fake being raped all the time and that women say "no" jus to play hard-to-get. My response was "is she playing hard-to-get when she points a gun at the guy and says 'I said NO motherf***er!!'?". I couldn't believe it. He actually said "yes". After hearing him say that, I stopped thinking he was just an idiot; I started thinking he was a real a**hole! I have contemplated starting a new thread just on the things this guy has said!!

I'd wager money this guy is a rapist.

Bingo. And if he isn't one, he's not far off. Sounds like a "friend" you need to ditch.

I started thinking he was a real [rapist]!

... fixed.

 

[tank mechanic]

I wouldn't worry about the negative responses ganymede. From what I read I think that you did a fine job in that situation.

 

[Elvishead]

That's why I carry pepper spray a whistle and sometimes a stun gun, along with my CCW. Turn the zap gun on for a second, and that will turn them right around.

A loud whistle will scare the heck out of somebody too.

 

[Prod]

I don't see why so many people have an issue with the OP's reaction. You're on a bike, you can easily be knocked to the ground. Some dude kicks your bike. You don't know if he has a knife, if he's going to mug you, if he's an MMA champion and entering into a fist fight will be the end of you. What you do know is that you're prepared to defend yourself, and you have a tool which stacks the confrontation in your favor. By alerting the assailant to the presence of said tool, without using it in a threatening manner, the OP successfully avoided what may have escalated to something worse.

A few people remarked at bringing a gun to a fist fight. First off, you don't know that there aren't any other weapons involved. Then, if you do enter the fist fight, you don't know that you'll win. I've been to various self-defense courses and also practiced Tae Kwon Do for 7 years. While very little Tae Kwon Do is applicable to street fighting, I feel that I have a decent knowledge, and chances are I could defend myself successfully with my bare hands. But I don't know that the guy I'm facing isn't a UFC champion, I don't know that he doesn't have a knife, and I don't know that I'll be able to retain positive control over my firearm while engaged in a fist fight. So I'd say there's a lot of justification for reaching if not drawing against an attacker who is not obviously armed. A year ago or so a guy in York, PA drew on some guy who was beating up a woman. The attacker advanced on the armed citizen, got shot in the leg, continued advancing. Went for a choke hold and then got shot in the chest. Shooting was declared self-defense, and rightly so. Yes, your gun is a last resort, but an attacker doesn't have to also have a gun to put you at risk of serious injury/death.

 

[ganymede]

A lot of people have said that just putting your hand on the butt of your weapon is brandishing or threatening deadly force. I'd like to point out that for brinks messangers it is company policy that they keep a hand on their weapon at all times when they get out of the truck. I've yet to hear of a brinks officer who was arrested for doing that.

 

[Prod]

As long as it's holstered, I don't think you can get in trouble for brandishing. If you draw, then it could be brandishing. If you draw and aim, then it's assault with a deadly weapon. This of course only applies to situations where it's not clearly self-defense.