My new VZ-24 8mm Czechoslovakian Mauser

[gsbuickman]

Hiya Guys ,

Here I've gone and done it again, I just bought another Mauser to add to my collection, this one being a beautiful VZ-24 8mm Chek Mauser that I picked up for a cool $140 from our local gun Grapevine .

This is in excellent condition and has plenty of patina that shows its age. It's almost all numbers matching, the only thing that doesn't match the rest of the gun is the bolt. Even the furniture stamp matches on this one. About the only thing that I can find wrong with it is a hairline crack in the handguard that needs a little attention, other than that she'll clean up really nice ...

 

[gsbuickman]

Ok, here's some decent pics

 

[Swampman]

DAMN!
140 bucks?

Sounds like an awesome deal to me!

What's the bore look like?

Just make sure the headspace is good before you shoot it.

 

[gsbuickman]

DAMN!
140 bucks?

Sounds like an awesome deal to me!

What's the bore look like?

Just make sure the headspace is good before you shoot it.

Yep I believe I officially stole this thing . I bought this from a local guy, and he turned out to be a pretty cool old dude & he carried on a great conversation. Anyway, he has a sizable Firearms collection but his wife was recently diagnosed with cancer so he's liquidating some things to come up with some extra $. He agreed to make me a smoking deal on this because he hasn't had a chance to get this out to the range yet so he couldn't guarantee anything about it which is the only reason I got it for the price I did. I just happened to be jumping around on our local gun Grapevine when it popped up for sale. After recently picking up the Argentine and the Swedish Mauser I couldn't pass this one up for the price regardless of the condition. In this case it was a damn nice score IMO.

 

[boom boom]

Nice buy. The BRNO mausers are some of the best made of all of the mausers. However, since the bolt doesn't match, do follow Swampman's advice on checking the headspace with gages. Be aware that there are actually two different chamber configurations depending on when it was made. Offhand, I believe that the Germans altered the shoulder angle of their chambers in the 1930's and do not remember whether the Czechs followed suit.

Gunboards has a running forum where you can find when it was made and for whom (a lot of Brno Mausers were sold across the globe).

 

[GunnyUSMC]

Nice score. That's about what I paid for my last VZ24. It also has a cracked handguard.
Now you need to find food for it.

 

[gsbuickman]

Nice score. That's about what I paid for my last VZ24. It also has a cracked handguard.
Now you need to find food for it.

Thanks, I already did my research and covered my bases before I decided to go ahead and pick this up. I can get boxes of PW arms for $13 from Midway and I can also get boxes of privy partisan for $14

 

[GunnyUSMC]

Doing your homework always helps.
Is sad that surplus ammo has dried up here in the states. I have somewhere around 60 Mausers chambered in 8mm. I saw the writing on the wall a few years ago and started buying surplus 8mm ammo.
I remember when you could get Turkish ammo in 70 round bandoliers for $15. It's about the hottest 8mm surplus, and kicks like a mule. The Romanian surplus is very nice to shoot. But now days you will pay as mush for it as new production ammo.
If the bore is a little dark don't let that worry you. Just clean it really good before your first range trip.

 

[gsbuickman]

Ok, just uploaded some more pictures to post #2

 

[gsbuickman]

DAMN!
140 bucks?

Sounds like an awesome deal to me!

What's the bore look like?

Just make sure the headspace is good before you shoot it.

I just got a better look at this in the daylight and the bore looked a little dark at first so I broke out my cleaning stuff. I gave the barrel a good soaking with some Hoppes #9, then ran a bronze brush through it several times & flushed the bore w/ some WD/40. There was a noticeable amount of crud that flushed out of it, so I ran a couple patches thru it & the 2nd one came out clean. I gave it a shot of Rem Oil & ran a squeegee thru it & called it good. The bore turned out pretty nice, it's still just a tiny bit dark but the rifling is sharp and clean so it oughta be a pretty good shooter.

 

[gsbuickman]

After doing some research and reading some threads on the gunboards Forum

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?136137-Czech-VZ24-Serial-Number-blocks

This is apparently a lion crested carbine from Povaska Bystrica in Slovakia.
It's marked :

E3Lion37
6***M4

Apparently this was made in the 13th block of 10,000 rifles in the 4th cycle of 260,000 rifles made for the Czechoslovakian Army. Vz/24's which bear the "M4" type phrase at the end of the serial number, like "1234 M4" are rifles made at BRNO.

Only 5 cycles of VZ24's wwere made for the Czechoslovak Army. Each cycle had around 260,000 rifles, 10,000 for reach of the 26 letters in the alaphabet...if that is the correct number for the Czech language.

( credit to John Wall on gunboards)

 

[Neanderthal76]

Awesome deal my friend. Im absolutely in love with my VZ24. Mine is a 1937 p series. I aquired it as a tip for doing a tile floor for a client. With the mojo peep sight its a damn fine shooter with a nice buttery bolt. only downfall for me is i dont like using corrosive ammo in my milsurps and 8mm factory ammo is pretty pricey at the shops out here in southeast PA. Again, great find. Enjoy shooting it.

 

[GunnyUSMC]

Shooting corrosive ammo is not a big deal like most think. It just takes a step or two more then shooting standard ammo.
People have come up with some pretty elaborate steps to cleaning that do nothing but add work and time to cleaning. In just about every one they have one thing in common, water. Water is the key to removing the salts left behind by the primer.
All you need to do is punch the bore with two wet patches and then a dry one, and an oiled one. Then you can clean like after shooting any other ammo.
It doesn't need to be hot or soapy, just wet.
If you don't have water you can substitute with, coffee, Kool-Aid, beer, or anything else that has water in it. But use caution when using beer, some will consider it alcohol abuse.

 

[gsbuickman]

Awesome deal my friend. Im absolutely in love with my VZ24. Mine is a 1937 p series. I aquired it as a tip for doing a tile floor for a client. With the mojo peep sight its a damn fine shooter with a nice buttery bolt. only downfall for me is i dont like using corrosive ammo in my milsurps and 8mm factory ammo is pretty pricey at the shops out here in southeast PA. Again, great find. Enjoy shooting it.

Here ya go, non corrosive PW Arms 8mm for $13 a box . I try and order the majority of my ammo online rather than buying it locally to save money and this is the best deal I found thus far on 8mm :

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/13...-mauser-170-grain-full-metal-jacket-boat-tail

 

[gsbuickman]

Shooting corrosive ammo is not a big deal like most think. It just takes a step or two more then shooting standard ammo.
People have come up with some pretty elaborate steps to cleaning that do nothing but add work and time to cleaning. In just about every one they have one thing in common, water. Water is the key to removing the salts left behind by the primer.
All you need to do is punch the bore with two wet patches and then a dry one, and an oiled one. Then you can clean like after shooting any other ammo.
It doesn't need to be hot or soapy, just wet.
If you don't have water you can substitute with, coffee, Kool-Aid, beer, or anything else that has water in it. But use caution when using beer, some will consider it alcohol abuse.

Yep, I agree. If you shoot corrosive ammo just flush the barrel and spray the bolt and receiver with Windex and clean as usual. You don't need name brand Windex, just use the cheap stuff from the dollar store, it works great & it evaporates.

 

[GunnyUSMC]

Here's the Romanian surplus for $0.50 a round.
http://www.sgammo.com/product/surpl...54-grain-fmj-ammo-stripper-clips-made-romania

 

[Neanderthal76]

Sweet. Ive never shot PW but ill give it a try. Thanks.

 

[Neanderthal76]

I have a rather large stock of HotShots but im not a fan.

 

[Swampman]

With a bolt action cleaning up after shooting corrosive is fairly simple, but in my opinion it takes a little more than just running four patches through the bore. I use damp/wet rags around the muzzle as well as the receiver, bolt and locking recesses. After that I hit it with my wife's blow dryer to dry it out thoroughly, then clean and oil as usual.

I also check the weapon a day or two after cleaning to make sure I don't have red funk growing anywhere in or on the weapon.

With gas guns the procedure takes considerably more time because you've got to use water on all the metal parts that might have been exposed to the hygroscopic primer residues and gas guns tend to blow that stuff everywhere but the buttplate.

As far as the ammo linked above, I'd take a pass on it. It's a fairly unimpressive and underpowered load, Midway is also asking way too much for it.
Sportsmans Guide was recently selling the same non corrosive 170 grain steel case Romanian ammo (in a different box) for $7.95/20 with free shipping if you got 7 or more boxes.

https://gun.deals/product/20-rds-mauser-8x57mm-js-170-grain-fmj-ammo-1187

Aside from surplus (which is pretty much unobtainium these days) Sellier & Bellot is about the only ammo I'm aware of that gives power levels and trajectories that match the ammo post WWI European Mausers were designed and sighted for. It also gives you good reloadable brass (which is something the OP is definitely going to need if he keeps collecting Mausers/milsurps at the rate he is).

 

[22250Rem]

I should add that the 8mm Mauser is nice cartridge for reloaders and can be very flexible depending on what you plan to do with it. Been loading 8x57 for a K-98 for years now. If you come across some old mil-surp corrosive ammo just be sure to clean that thing up when you finish shooting. Back in the early 1990's I used to shoot lots of corrosive 303 British which I had heard was pretty bad if not cleaned promptly. So I ran a few wet patches through it immediately afterward, before I even left the range. Then a complete cleaning when I got home. Never a problem; the bore on that old Lee-Enfield looks as good as when I got it.

 

[Panzerschwein]

Looks like a nice little stopper, those 8mms have some thump on to em.

 

[gsbuickman]

With a bolt action cleaning up after shooting corrosive is fairly simple, but in my opinion it takes a little more than just running four patches through the bore. I use damp/wet rags around the muzzle as well as the receiver, bolt and locking recesses. After that I hit it with my wife's blow dryer to dry it out thoroughly, then clean and oil as usual.

I also check the weapon a day or two after cleaning to make sure I don't have red funk growing anywhere in or on the weapon.

With gas guns the procedure takes considerably more time because you've got to use water on all the metal parts that might have been exposed to the hygroscopic primer residues and gas guns tend to blow that stuff everywhere but the buttplate.

As far as the ammo linked above, I'd take a pass on it. It's a fairly unimpressive and underpowered load, Midway is also asking way too much for it.
Sportsmans Guide was recently selling the same non corrosive 170 grain steel case Romanian ammo (in a different box) for $7.95/20 with free shipping if you got 7 or more boxes.

https://gun.deals/product/20-rds-mauser-8x57mm-js-170-grain-fmj-ammo-1187

Aside from surplus (which is pretty much unobtainium these days) Sellier & Bellot is about the only ammo I'm aware of that gives power levels and trajectories that match the ammo post WWI European Mausers were designed and sighted for. It also gives you good reloadable brass (which is something the OP is definitely going to need if he keeps collecting Mausers/milsurps at the rate he is).

Rats, unfortunately they're sold out, as a matter of fact they don't even list it anymore and they don't have squat for 8mm at the moment, otherwise I'd order a pile of those shells.

If you find a decent deal like that on 8mm, let me know. According to the ammo seek website the only way I can touch $0.49 a round is if I spend $300 + @ lucky gunner, otherwise the cheapest thing they have listed is $0.60 around

 

[GunnyUSMC]

With a bolt action cleaning up after shooting corrosive is fairly simple, but in my opinion it takes a little more than just running four patches through the bore. I use damp/wet rags around the muzzle as well as the receiver, bolt and locking recesses. After that I hit it with my wife's blow dryer to dry it out thoroughly, then clean and oil as usual.

I also check the weapon a day or two after cleaning to make sure I don't have red funk growing anywhere in or on the weapon.

Like I said, some people do more then what's needed. I have been collecting and shooting surplus guns since 1984.
Remember, these were combat weapons. Some saw hard use. The soldiers in the field didn't have much more then oil and patches for cleaning.
The only time you need to worry about the salts getting into the bolt and action area is when you have a ruptured case or leaking primers.

 

[Swampman]

Like I said, some people do more then what's needed. I have been collecting and shooting surplus guns since 1984.
The only time you need to worry about the salts getting into the bolt and action area is when you have a ruptured case or leaking primers.

That's nice, I've been collecting and shooting them since 1973.

Leaking primers are pretty common with the 1950's Yugoslavian 8mm. The low powered steel case Romanian 154 grain is notorious for allowing gas leakage around the case mouth, into the chamber and back into the action.

Neither one is dangerous, but they do allow combustion gasses and salts back into places other than the barrel.

Remember, these were combat weapons. Some saw hard use. The soldiers in the field didn't have much more then oil and patches for cleaning.

I'm aware that military rifles were designed for combat use (most people probably are) and that there were times during combat when weapons might not get perfect care.
But do you honestly think NCO's didn't have troops cleaning and maintaining their weapons as well as possible whenever they had the opportunity?

In garrison, the USMC rule was to clean immediately after firing and every day for 3 days after. The first cleaning often involved disassembly of the weapons and immersing metal parts in a 55 gallon drum of hot water.

As to the troops not having "much more than oil and patches for cleaning". I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the most important thing to use is water, and that coffee, Kool Aid or even beer will work in a pinch.

If your cleaning methods work for you that's great, but telling shooters unfamiliar with corrosive ammunition that punching the bore four times is enough won't hurt your rifle. It is likely to mess theirs up, especially if they store it awhile after following your advice.

I know that troops in battle at Guadalcanal and Stalingrad didn't always clean their weapons properly, but that doesn't mean it's a best practice for someone that paid good money for their rifle and wants it to last.

If a person that's new to shooting corrosive ammo spends more time than necessary cleaning their rifle, they can always modify their techniques over time based on their own experience. If they put up an improperly cleaned weapon once and don't inspect it for a while, a "do over" is either impossible or very expensive.

 

[GunnyUSMC]

That's nice, I've been collecting and shooting them since 1973.

Leaking primers are pretty common with the 1950's Yugoslavian 8mm. The low powered steel case Romanian 154 grain is notorious for allowing gas leakage around the case mouth, into the chamber and back into the action.

Neither one is dangerous, but they do allow combustion gasses and salts back into places other than the barrel.

I'm aware that military rifles were designed for combat use (most people probably are) and that there were times during combat when weapons might not get perfect care.
But do you honestly think NCO's didn't have troops cleaning and maintaining their weapons as well as possible whenever they had the opportunity?

In garrison, the USMC rule was to clean immediately after firing and every day for 3 days after. The first cleaning often involved disassembly of the weapons and immersing metal parts in a 55 gallon drum of hot water.

As to the troops not having "much more than oil and patches for cleaning". I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the most important thing to use is water, and that coffee, Kool Aid or even beer will work in a pinch.

If your cleaning methods work for you that's great, but telling shooters unfamiliar with corrosive ammunition that punching the bore four times is enough won't hurt your rifle. It is likely to mess theirs up, especially if they store it awhile after following your advice.

I know that troops in battle at Guadalcanal and Stalingrad didn't always clean their weapons properly, but that doesn't mean it's a best practice for someone that paid good money for their rifle and wants it to last.

If a person that's new to shooting corrosive ammo spends more time than necessary cleaning their rifle, they can always modify their techniques over time based on their own experience. If they put up an improperly cleaned weapon once and don't inspect it for a while, a "do over" is either impossible or very expensive.

I guess you miss read my post on cleaning. Two wet patches to remove the salts. A dry patch to remove moisture. An oil patch to lube. This is done before leaving the range. The gun still needs to be cleaned like any other gun.
I have over 400 guns, which 300 of them are surplus. Over the years I have looked at many surplus guns. I have seen many that looked great , but had bores that looked like sewer pipes.
Oh, about cleaning guns in the Corps, did it for 20 years, infantry and heavy weapons.

The point I was making about weapons in combat is that cleaning was not able to be done under the most favorable conditions.

Here is the biggest problem with some of the cleaning methods people have come up with, they tend to destroy or damage the finish on the stock. I've been doing stock work for almost 35 years and had seen most messed up finishes from cleaning then rusted guns from not cleaning enough.
If your having that much trouble with your ammo, you must have been getting bad ammo or not storing it correctly.
So I am not advising new shooters to neglect their guns, just don't go stupid when cleaning.