DenaliPark
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My sentiments exactly... I'll wager that his letter doesn't instill a sense of "community" into the teacher it's addressed to, rather I would expect that now he is on a list somewhere...
My son made a gun comment in school...
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My sentiments exactly... I'll wager that his letter doesn't instill a sense of "community" into the teacher it's addressed to, rather I would expect that now he is on a list somewhere...
Sorry to say, the first thing that photo brought to mind was Christopher Bizilj. Of course, I realize it's apples-n-oranges. Regardless, an in-your-face response to a delicate situation can produce unintended, undesirable consequences. IMO, this photo would not have been appropriate.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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Some time ago there was a similar story from Half Moon Bay , California, a 2nd Grader was assinged to write an essay on an activity he participated in with a family member, he wrote that his grandmother took him shooting. When they contacted her she stood her ground, told them where they could go and what they could do when they got there, said who were they to tell her how she was going to raise her family.
TexasBill
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The problem with her response is that telling Tyler not to speak about guns because it might upset the other kiddies will leave Tyler with the impression there's something wrong with what you do - even though he knows you believe there is nothing wrong with guns and hunting. Who's right? The teacher or the parent? And what's going to happen the glorious day he does get to fire a gun? Is that going to be a deep, dark secret, as well?
He's just seven years old and he is being asked to understand a situation that he's not yet equipped to comprehend. He may already be feeling unhappy, or even guilty, about creating an issue between you and his teacher.
Should a problem arise again, this needs to be politely but firmly explained to the teacher in the context of Tyler's development and growth. He's her student for just a year but he's your son for life.
He's just seven years old and he is being asked to understand a situation that he's not yet equipped to comprehend. He may already be feeling unhappy, or even guilty, about creating an issue between you and his teacher.
Should a problem arise again, this needs to be politely but firmly explained to the teacher in the context of Tyler's development and growth. He's her student for just a year but he's your son for life.
^^^^Good post, TexasBill. We've been addressing this from our own personal perspectives and forgetting the child and what he'll take away from this - Guns and hunting are taboo and only to be spoken of at home. Not the way to present an all american sport and family past time to a kid.
DC Plumber
Member
Similar story with my 6 year old son in Kindergarten. His teacher is a far left liberal, but a very qualified teacher. My son had to write a sentence about "what he likes". He wrote, "I like my gun". He got a .22 rifle from grandpa for Christmas. At parent teacher conferences a month ago, the teacher showed it to my wife and just smiled. My wife didn't offer too much of an explanation and new it wasn't required. I don't think the teacher really dissaproved, it was just different to her.
Non the less, the OP's letter was well written and he sounds like a safe gun owner. I don't put complaints, to teachers or anyone for that matter, in writing.
Go see her face to face and tell what you think. Your letter will probably just get circulated by a bunch of gun haters and they'll all get a laugh. You probably won't change their minds anyway. Just be professional and keep your cool.
Just the way I would handle it.
Non the less, the OP's letter was well written and he sounds like a safe gun owner. I don't put complaints, to teachers or anyone for that matter, in writing.
Go see her face to face and tell what you think. Your letter will probably just get circulated by a bunch of gun haters and they'll all get a laugh. You probably won't change their minds anyway. Just be professional and keep your cool.
Just the way I would handle it.
Neverwinter
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This is a view which is centered around the belief that the only reason not to express yourself in a certain way is because it is wrong or something to be ashamed of. There are many legitimate reasons not to share things about yourself which are not wrong or that you are not shameful of.
Some people don't disclose that they carry concealed, except maybe to their closest friends. Also, pray your child never turns out to be gay/lesbian.
Being a hunter or shooter is hardly something to hide, it's no different than being a fan or participant of/in any other sport. Hardly the same as not disclosing that you carry concealed, there's a level of opsec involved there that doesn't accompany sports and hobbies. I won't bother to comment on your gay/lesbian association.
Oh, and, yes, at 7 years old, adults telling you to keep secrets equates to something you shouldn't be doing.
Neverwinter
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Do you happen to have a facebook account? Do you post everything about yourself on it? If not, why are you hiding it? Would your idea of opsec involve not exposing yourself to additional hassles from being in an environment which is hostile to that part of your life?
It doesn't take much imagination to consider environments where disclosing certain aspects of your life would provide more hassle than if you had just neglected to mention it.
This is a teachable moment. While I'm not a liberal in any way, I do have problems knowing when to say the appropriate things. I've said off colored things in the wrong company before, sometimes I've said expletives when not appropriate.
Just teach your son sometimes it's not appropriate to talk about certain things in certain company. Call it pollitically correc or what have you. You just got to be aware.
For instance (insert 20+ year veteran) I sometimes get on an antigovernment, anti war mongering, anti foreign policy kick and yes sometimes in uniform with my comrades. I probably have cause some of the people I work with to feel uneasy about this.
Look up the word Jingoism.
Anyhow, great job on working with the school on your son's safety. I will never forget the first time I took my daughter shooting. I think she was in second grade and we shot my Ruger .22 single single six. She did great! Now she is 18.
Great Job!
TexasBill
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So you're with the teacher on this one, right?
Sorry, I just don't see favoring the kids who don't like guns any more than I see favoring the kids that do. Tyler's classmates don't need to be protected from him.
The issue came up because Tyler said he was not too young to shoot a gun. He didn't write "I am not too young to have sex" or "I am not too young to drink whiskey" or any of the typical social taboos. Since when is shooting a gun as part of an outdoor sport a social no-no?
Gee whiz, folks, it's not like anyone is coaching him for a future Columbine or Virginia Tech. We're talking about a 7-year-old boy saying he wants to participate in a time-honored activity and sport, just like his dad. And it's okay to silence him? How far have we sunk to even consider that?
Neverwinter
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It's not about protecting the children, but protecting the teacher from the parents. She's the one who has to deal with a parent who finds out that their kid learned about something that they didn't want. If you want to fix this, fix the parents that expect a child to be sheltered from knowledge they don't agree with.
And there lies the core of the problem. Many people on both sides of the isle are digging their beliefs in deeper and deeper.
To me this issue shouldn't even exist. I grew up in an era where shooting and hunting were considered main stream and perfectly normal. As our society has evolved I feel that actually we are drifting away from our core values. In a free society I believe that anyone should be able to do this. Just don't ask me to follow you in your beliefs. If we are a truly free people shouldn't I be able to hold the same vales that I have had my whole life? If our country were operating properly we as a people wouldn't need to tip toe around each other in fear of offending each other.
Unfortunately the era that we grew up in is not the same era that our kids are growing up in. The shootings at Columbine and Virginia Tech have changed our society and the way schools and teachers view and deal with gun issues. If a student brings up the subject of a gun, the teacher has no way of knowing if the student's father is an avid sportsman/hunter or a crack head/drunk that leaves his guns laying around for the kid to play with. I think the OP and his son's teacher both handled the issue well. It's not a matter of silencing the child but teaching him some discretion on when and where to bring up certain subjects, a valuable lesson that he will use throughout his life concerning many subjects, not just guns.
Something seems to be going around in Virginia.
I had a 5th grade teacher who constantly yelled at me to stop talking about guns. This was 21 years ago, well before kids got suspended for taking butter knives to school etc. My dad was ready to complain to the school board, but considering he nearly raked my 1st grade teacher over the coals when she was sending all of the kids in her class to her Dr. father-in-law to drug them up with Ritalin and had 80% of her class held back a grade, he decided the 5th grade teacher wasn't worth it.
In 7th grade I made a rifle out of poster board and pasted clipping from the Jr. NRA Insights magazine all over it. This was with the blessing and help of my art teacher.
gdcpony
Member
I haven't read the entire thread, but it seems very similar to what my kids go through. They have their own firearms, and hunt and shoot right beside me. Of course, all kids talk about the things they like so I (or my wife while I am away) get plenty of calls from the school. They never talk about their use as "weapons" only as a hobby, sport, and just something they did over the weekend.
At first I tried the polite tact. Living in a rural area I thought all I would need was let the school know that my daughters do shoot and like it. I let them know that should my daughters ever use language indicating violence toward another I want to know as I would back them and add to the punishment at home. However, I have never heard such from them and neither did the teachers.
I was also firm on the point that I defend a free country that protects the right to speak ones mind and of ones hobbies too. I will not tell my children not to speak of the hunt we had, or our day at the range, or even how they did on a 3-D course (yes, even bows caused these calls). They can speak of them the same as another child might tell of the drag races their dad took them too, or the football game they played.
I could go through a long list of the types of calls I got and it kinda got ridiculous. Ask my younger daughter what she got for birthday and send her to the office for the honest answer (a rifle). Ask my oldest her favorite thing to do with her dad and a few minutes later I receive a call because "hunting is not an appropriate past time for a young girl."
My kids became the unwitting battle front front, not for the right to bear arms in my mind, but for the right to speak freely. Fortunately, my kids are very peaceful "turn the other cheek" type, but with stubborn streaks as wide as their mom's. They simply refused to give false answers to questions and avoid topics because of someone being offended. If their friends were talking about their weekends and they were involved then I would get a call. When they were asked for a favorite picture my oldest took in this one:
And of course I got call. For what? The blood? I would buy that since it is a graphic pic since we had no better she took it. Nope, because it showed the bow she used.
So far no action as been taken against my kids as far as punishment. Once they were about to when my oldest decided to tell them that "I love to shoot the way you love to teach. So I will talk about it just you talk about teaching when you aren't even here. Why is that a problem?" I actually put on my uniform for that one and asked them to explain why I should keep wearing it if my kids can't enjoy the same freedoms I protect for them.
Their usual point is that other kids might be frightened by it, so I said show me one. They could not. All the other kids thought it was the coolest and many of the boys offered up that their dads took them hunting too. So I asked again if my kids EVER use threatening language and no they don't. I let them know that that kind of talk is the only reason I would allow any punishment even if I must take them to court. Since Kala thinks hitting others is not "ladylike" and Kenzie thinks fighting is "for idiots." I doubt I'll ever have a problem. Especially with Kala being a star student in all other respects. Kenzie didn't get that gene I'm afraid, but is still one of the best behaved kids they have.
Ok rant over. I just think it insane how some things have changed.
At first I tried the polite tact. Living in a rural area I thought all I would need was let the school know that my daughters do shoot and like it. I let them know that should my daughters ever use language indicating violence toward another I want to know as I would back them and add to the punishment at home. However, I have never heard such from them and neither did the teachers.
I was also firm on the point that I defend a free country that protects the right to speak ones mind and of ones hobbies too. I will not tell my children not to speak of the hunt we had, or our day at the range, or even how they did on a 3-D course (yes, even bows caused these calls). They can speak of them the same as another child might tell of the drag races their dad took them too, or the football game they played.
I could go through a long list of the types of calls I got and it kinda got ridiculous. Ask my younger daughter what she got for birthday and send her to the office for the honest answer (a rifle). Ask my oldest her favorite thing to do with her dad and a few minutes later I receive a call because "hunting is not an appropriate past time for a young girl."
My kids became the unwitting battle front front, not for the right to bear arms in my mind, but for the right to speak freely. Fortunately, my kids are very peaceful "turn the other cheek" type, but with stubborn streaks as wide as their mom's. They simply refused to give false answers to questions and avoid topics because of someone being offended. If their friends were talking about their weekends and they were involved then I would get a call. When they were asked for a favorite picture my oldest took in this one:
And of course I got call. For what? The blood? I would buy that since it is a graphic pic since we had no better she took it. Nope, because it showed the bow she used.
So far no action as been taken against my kids as far as punishment. Once they were about to when my oldest decided to tell them that "I love to shoot the way you love to teach. So I will talk about it just you talk about teaching when you aren't even here. Why is that a problem?" I actually put on my uniform for that one and asked them to explain why I should keep wearing it if my kids can't enjoy the same freedoms I protect for them.
Their usual point is that other kids might be frightened by it, so I said show me one. They could not. All the other kids thought it was the coolest and many of the boys offered up that their dads took them hunting too. So I asked again if my kids EVER use threatening language and no they don't. I let them know that that kind of talk is the only reason I would allow any punishment even if I must take them to court. Since Kala thinks hitting others is not "ladylike" and Kenzie thinks fighting is "for idiots." I doubt I'll ever have a problem. Especially with Kala being a star student in all other respects. Kenzie didn't get that gene I'm afraid, but is still one of the best behaved kids they have.
Ok rant over. I just think it insane how some things have changed.
rainbowbob
Member
Why?
dirtykid
Member
We just last week had a 16-yr old say to another classmate "we should bring some guns to school and shoot people",, HOLY S*& !! did the fur fly !! the kid got expelled,sent to Genrose (a psych unit) for evaluation and charged criminally for terroristic threats,, our school district has a ZERO-tolerance policy,, my oldest got suspended for 2-days for having his little "leatherman" in his posession on school grounds (it dropped out of pants pocket after gym) so from a teachers perspective i can understand her concern, about some kid talking about guns , but c'mon !! She obviously over-reacted,,, I dont know if i could have composed myself enough to write that calm of a letter,, My wife would have to do it as I would have wanted to call the school principal (not the best strategy)
SSN Vet
Member
I hope you never have an child die and the coroner rule it as SIDS.
You're views on how easy it is for social services to take your other kids away, adding trauma on top of tragedy, will quickly change.
the iron horse
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I teach 7th grade Language Arts in a public middle school.
I have magazines like Field and Stream in my class for students to read during free reading time.
We read the novel Shane by Jack Shaefer and watch the film.
Just wanting you guys and gals to know,
you have some friends in public schools.
I have magazines like Field and Stream in my class for students to read during free reading time.
We read the novel Shane by Jack Shaefer and watch the film.
Just wanting you guys and gals to know,
you have some friends in public schools.
scrat
Member
I have two boys 17 and 11. They have been shooting me ever since i knew it was safe to take them. Each child is different some you may have to wait longer than others.
Here are some old photos of my boys first one i think when my younger son was 7.
my older son
Oh and yes he is shooting a 30-30 at age 7. Of course hand loads with 5 grains of trail boss. Should have seen the look on everyones face when i was helping him load it.
Here are some old photos of my boys first one i think when my younger son was 7.
my older son
Oh and yes he is shooting a 30-30 at age 7. Of course hand loads with 5 grains of trail boss. Should have seen the look on everyones face when i was helping him load it.
SSN Vet
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not sure that's what you meant to say there Scrat
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