N110 and 44 magnum

[HisDivineShadow]

I got a problem here I think. Just got my first batch of N110 to load some 44mag with, been using N320 and N32C for CAS level loads before but now I wanted to try some magnum level loads so I got this 267gr intercast bullet thats listed in the Lapua load manual here:
http://www.lapua.com/en/products/reloading/vihtavuori-reloading-data/relodata/6/21

I set up for a charge of 20.4 grains and proceeded to start loading but I thought the powder looked like it filled the case up too well. Sure enough using my calipers depth meter and comparing it to the bullet it would mean compression of the powder at the lightest load, and even worse as you progressed.

Is this normal for N110? Quickload is the one really throwing me for a spin here because according to it I should have only filled it to 95% or so with the starting load. But I will definitely get powder compression from what I can tell.

I fed the exact specs of my case and bullet into Quickload to approximate:
Bullet length 0.778"
Seating depth: 0.334"
Case length 1.251"
COAL 1.681"

Should fill to 94.7%

 

[warnerwh]

With 24 grains H110 and a 240 jhp in my .44 load the powder is compressed. Also I use a compressed load in my 30-06. In both cases I've never had any problem. I think it actually helps to be compressed because the powder can only lay one way. If you're within listed loading data you're probably ok.

 

[HisDivineShadow]

I was mostly worried because quickload didn't match up with what I was seeing, still wondering about why that is. Also none of of the loading manuals indicate that this will be a compressed load. Even though there clearly will be some compression.

Going to be shooting this out of as 629-5 6½" barrel.

 

[NCsmitty]

It appears that you are loading near the recommended starting charge for N110, according to the V V data sheet.

I personally do not use V V powders, so I'm not sure if N110 normally gives a compressed load with recommended charges.

I do not have the quickload program, so I cannot comment on the irregularities.

You need to verify the zero on your scale to make sure that you are dropping the proper charge and eliminate any error.
Other than that, a compressed load is not necessarily bad, if everything else checks out.

http://www.vihtavuori-lapua.com/pdfs/Handgun-Reloading-Data-2006.pdf


NCsmitty

 

[HisDivineShadow]

I verified the loads on my RCBS 505 and digital scale (I am a bit OCD about weighing)

 

[Walkalong]

I have been shooting 20.4 Grs N110 (What a coincidence) under a Magtech 240 Gr JSP, and it is a slightly compressed load. it gave me an Avg 1383 FPS on an 82 degree day from a 5.5" Redhawk.

 

[Vic in Va]

One other measurement I try to get, and that's case capacity. I have two different lots of WW brass, and their capacities run 38.8 and 39.3 grains of water, and that affects the results of QL calculations.

One load I really like using N110 in is 22.1 grains, Speer 240 JSP, WW brass, and a CCI primer (300), oal at 1.610"

It is very accurate and consistent, with an average speed of 1432 fps out of my 7.5" SBH, and the SD is 9 fps. QL says this load is at 106.7% fill.

I feel no qualms whatsoever about this load.

 

[LTR shooter]

I have loaded up to 20.7 of N110 for use in my 629 Classic 6 1/2" and it looks as though there would be slight compression of powder judging by how high the powder fills the case. I was loading Hornady 240 XTPs and the result was the most accurate load to date for the 629.

 

[HisDivineShadow]

One other measurement I try to get, and that's case capacity. I have two different lots of WW brass, and their capacities run 38.8 and 39.3 grains of water, and that affects the results of QL calculations.

One load I really like using N110 in is 22.1 grains, Speer 240 JSP, WW brass, and a CCI primer (300), oal at 1.610"

It is very accurate and consistent, with an average speed of 1432 fps out of my 7.5" SBH, and the SD is 9 fps. QL says this load is at 106.7% fill.

I feel no qualms whatsoever about this load.

Yeah the brass I have takes less than that, it tooks about 2.4ml while QL assumes 2.57ml, not sure what it is in grains of water as I don't have QL with me at the moment.

Loaded 20.4 grains according to the loading data, also made some own rounds using 20 grains and a 225gr lead bullet.

What 20.4 grains look like along with the 267gr bullet:

 

[HisDivineShadow]

Tested the rounds today and they sure kick! Sadly I forgot some vital parts to my Chrono so I couldn't test and see how fast they went. But they sure kick more than the commerical 240gr magtechs. My .44spl rounds are kittens by comparison. I could only check for obvious signs of overpressure but found none, no flattened primers or sticky cases, just a whole lot of bang and recoil.

I am not sure if there was a lot of leading or just unburnt powder I saw, I suppose I shouldn't have polished off the box of .44 specials afterwards and instead taken it directly home so I could investigate, but since the chrono:ing went to heck I figured I'd shoot some specials to make up for it.

 

[NCsmitty]

I'm glad to hear that your test session went reasonably well. Recoil and bang is what a 44 Mag is all about, and you know that you're sending some serious lead downrange.
I used to love shooting my Hawes 44 Mag single action (J.P. Sauer) and had taken deer with it. I sold it and bought a 357 Maximum T. Contender that gave me more range.

Keep us posted if you chronograph your loads.



NCsmitty

 

[Vic in Va]

N110 is normally a very clean powder. It is possible, when using a cast bullet, that some of the deposit is burned lubricant. I have noticed more smoke with any powder when using a cast bullet than with jacketed. If it is leading, measure the throat of your cylinders and go .001" over that. My experience has been that usually addressess any leading (and accuracy) problems.

I would have no reservations of using the load you have listed, even with slight compression.

 

[HisDivineShadow]

The bullets are hardcast lead and the lube likewise is quite hard. I would've thought it should work better with a harder load based on what I've gleamed from the casters bible*. I've heard N110 can make a mess if loaded too light OTOH.


* = From Ingot to Target: A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners©

 

[HisDivineShadow]

BTW the stats on my revolver wrt bore size are .429" in the bore and .430" (possibly a smidgeon smaller. 4295" or so) in the cylinder throats, they are on the smaller side.

I bought a 429421 Keith mold via castboolits last year that I still haven't had the chance to use, it casts a whole .434" according to the people there, for all those with ot of spec rugers, Thats a lot to size down to, hope it'll do fine though.

 

[LTR shooter]

How was the accuracy of the load? I've shot mostly jacketed bullets through my 629 but not a lot of plain lead. I've used 300 gr lead with 2400 with good results. I might even try some 44 Specials with the 240 lead.

 

[HisDivineShadow]

I didn't check that carefully, I just tossed a bunch of clay pigeons onto the backstop 50 yards away and I got most of them

Next time I will make up a bigger load and make sure I got all of my chrono with me

 

[Vic in Va]

You are correct about N110 loaded too light being messy. I've run into that with some powders that border on being too slow in the .45-70, especially IMR4895. But, it did shoot good, nice and accurate, but dirty.

 

[HisDivineShadow]

Shot the hand loads today out of my 629. Big thump and lots of leading from what it looks like and after a few shots it was really hard to open the cylinder release. The center pin had worked loose and I hand tightened it, but that did not seem to help any.

Chronoed the rounds and found they varied between 422-440m/s or 1384-1476fps, that's not very good I gather, too much variation, almost 100fps.

Now my biggest question is why the cylinder release is sticking, also I think the center pin is not straight anymore, I think thats been like that a long time though I just never been sure if I imagined it or not.

Anyone know what can lead to the pin no longer being straight, can you take it apart incorrectly or what precisely can do this?

I assume the best remedy is a new center pin, are they all alike across 629 generations, because I've had problems with that on the model 17.