neck tension issues

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hvychev77

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so i went to the range today and experienced a problem with my bullets being pushed back into the brass case. so far, i've neck sized and full length sized my brass and both of the loads were able to be pushed back by hand. what am i doing wrong? I've loaded these pieces of brass about 4-5 times, not sure if that's a sign of the brass getting weak or if i have my neck sizing and full length sizing dies set incorrectly. any suggestions or advice on how tight the neck tension is supposed to be? or a way to remedy this issue? i'm using the lee brand dies, FL die, and the neck sizing collet die. the rifle i'm shooting here is a 300 win mag, remington 700. The recipes are as follows:

Nosler Partition 180 grain
74.5 grains of IMR 7828
COL is 3.340
Magnum large rifle primer

Nosler Accubond 180 grain
73.0 grains of IMR 7828
COL is 3.340
Magnum large rifle primer

thanks guys, hvychev77
 
The neck sizing die should be adjusted down to the point it is contacting the shell holder when the press is at full stroke. The same is true for the FL die but you should know how much shoulder set back is produced at near contact point between the die and shell holder.

Also, are you possibly crimping with the seating die? If so, you need to adjust that die back so it doesn't contact the brass when at full stroke. Crimping a bottle neck isn't generally necessary, especially with a bolt action. It's also easy to cause buckling of the neck and shoulder when trying to crimp a bottle neck cartridge.
 
I forgot to address the question of brass. I load 7 mag. also a belted cartridge, and I average 12-15 reloadings before I toss it out, and have never experienced neck tension issues with it or any other cartridge. Bottle neck brass will usually fail just above the belt or head, or develope primer pocket tension issues more commonly than problems at the neck.
 
Your collet die mandrel it too big.

Same with the expander on the FL die set.

You need to measure them precisely.
Both have to be .002" - .003" smaller then bullet dia to get proper neck tension.

You can reduce the dia by chucking them in a drill and worrying them down with a strip of emery cloth ot paper.

rc
 
rcmodel, i took your advice and disassembled both dies and measured them. both measured dead nuts .002 smaller than bullet diameter. the instructions said to screw the die down until it touched shell holder, then to turn in another complete turn, and if additional neck tension is desired another half turn could be added. I did this, and it seemed to help. How tight should the bullet set in the brass? should i be able to push it in at all by hand? also i might add, that i am not crimping at all with the bullet seating die or any other crimping die. I size, and then seat the bullet accordingly.
 
You did right, the Lee collet die needs another turn after shell holder contact, to squeeze the neck.....Dont be afraid to get after the handle a bit. No, you shouldnt be able to push the bullet in by hand, or by pusing it against the edge of your reloading bench. I do not use any crimp die either.

You dont lube the inside of your necks do ya? Cause you don't have to unless you FLS.
 
It should take in the neighborhood of 45-70 pounds to slip a bullet in the case if neck tension is what it should be.

You would hurt your finger-bone pushing on a bullet anywhere near that hard!

BTW: I'd probably be happer with .003"smaller in .308" and above calibers.

.002 smaller is about right in .223" & 6mm.

rc
 
I'll point out that the manual for Lee collet dies suggests after the first "size", to rotate the case a quarter turn and size again, "for more consistent neck tension".

I don't do this myself, but would if I were having trouble.
 
o.k. guys, i'll update ya when i try some of your suggestions. as far as lubing the inside of the neck, i do not put any lube inside. thanks for all the great advice.......hvychev77
 
Never had a neck tension problem with Lee dies,reading the American rifleman article explains some of the problem with the 300./,
 
I had a set of Lee FL 6mm die that didn't size the neck down enough.Everything was right bullet dia.,expander dia., and case thickness they just weren't sized enough and it was once fired brass.
 
I full length sized my .270 Win with no problems with my Lee dies. I decided to neck size a few to test for accuracy and found that you have to put some force to the handle. I was able to push a bullet in by hand until I screwed the die down 1.25 turns past contact with the shell holder. The extra quarter turn was perfect for me. The instructions call for 25 pounds pressure on the handle too.

I didn't try rotating the cases for a second neck size, but that might help too. Very nice neck tension on the half dozen cases I loaded.
 
Take the neck die apart and see if the fingered part and it's mating half are SMOOTH. I polished mine (30-30) today with 600 emery and lubed it well. Tomorrow I'll see if I can get it to work. The one in 243 worked OK when I REALLY pushed hard on the handle, a lot more than 25#. Mike your brass thickness and sized case OD to see if the FL die is correct. I don't think the Lee FL sizes on the rod at all
 
Your collet die mandrel it too big.

Same with the expander on the FL die set.

You need to measure them precisely.
Both have to be .002" - .003" smaller then bullet dia to get proper neck tension.

You can reduce the dia by chucking them in a drill and worrying them down with a strip of emery cloth ot paper.

rc
Click to expand...

Good advice here. Follow RC advice and you will be good to go. If you do not feel comfortable reducing the diameter of the mandrel yourself you can order a "reduced" mandrel from Lee for $5.
 
thanks for all the info. here guys. i did measure the mandrel as mentioned above, but i haven't had time to do much adjusting yet. I did take a new piece of brass, and neck size it, and then seat a bullet to see the difference and it was much much tighter! anywho, i'm not done with it yet because i feel like i should still be able to get a few more loads out of them. It is winchester brand brass, not sure if that has something to do with it or not.......once again, thanks again. it's amazing how you get so many responses in such a quick time on here.......i'll update as soon as i can. cheers, hvychev77
 
Hey guys,

I don't post much, mostly just read and learn.
However, I have had the same problem with my 30-30. I took the expander out and chucked it in a drill to slim it down some, but that didn't really solve the problem.
The problem was solved when I took up annealing the case necks. They get hardened after a few reloadings and annealing really brings them back to new.
So now, I have another new hobby and it is really paying off in all the rifle cals I load for. I haven't tried the 45LC cause I haven't seen an issue. But groups at the range have improved for all the bottleneck cases.
I bought one of the Hornady Annealing Kits with the Tempilac Paint that melts at the desired temp. Works great and after you do it a while, you can skip the paint because you know how many counts each neck needs in the flame.
Give it a try.

Bob
 
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