Need education on 1911 (2011) double stack 9mm's

[MikeInOr]

I was at the range yesterday with a couple of buddies and we found ourselves about ~25 ~30 yards away from the dueling tree when a little bit of rivalry started. I was shooting my Beretta 92 which I have owned for about 30 years and found myself competitive with their XDm target and FNX. Then I switched to my CZ75 and was doing about the same. Finally I gave up magazine capacity and switched to my Norinco 1911 from the 80's... after which I completely cleaned their clocks even with the disadvantage of magazine changes.

It was very obvious to me that I NEED a double stack 9mm 1911!!!!

I purchased my Norinco back in the 90's and over the years replaced the barrel with a target barrel, the barrel bushing, the sights, the trigger and tightened up the slide a bit. Honestly it has been so long that I forget what all parts I used but I did do all the work myself. I am honestly not sure what it is about the Norinco 1911 that is so harmonious with my shooting style BUT I would like the same in a high capacity 9mm.

I am aware of 2011's but don't know that much about them. I would love to have an STI but don't have $2K+ to drop on one. I would like a double stack 9mm 1911 in the sub $1000 range that I can build on over time like I did with my Norinco.

The 2 piece frame of 2011's scare me... do they hold together without movement between the grip and frame being introduced over time?

Are all 2011 grips polymer (plastic)?

What parts do a 2011 and 1911 have in common?

Are the barrels, slides, beaver tails, safteys, hammers interchangeable between a 1911 and 2011?

Are 2011 9mm magazines pretty well standardized?

Are there any 2011 frames available in stainless?

I do own a mill that I am pretty proficient with, I am not opposed to building a 2011 myself (Something I have always wanted to do) even though I completely understand I WILL NOT SAVE ANY MONEY! I probably won't go the 80% route but it is in the back of my mind.

Rock Island Armory has a 2011 9mm for a decent price. I have read that RIA is a decent platform to build a 1911 on, does the same hold true for their 2011's?

Are there any other sub $1000 2011's worth considering as a base to build on over time?

Are there and sub $1000 2011's in 38 super?

 

[tarosean]

I would love to have an STI but don't have $2K+ to drop on one.

You're in luck STI came out with an entry model this year called the Hawk, I believe is the name, for 1300ish +/-.

The 2 piece frame of 2011's scare me...

Are all 2011 grips polymer (plastic)?

What parts do a 2011 and 1911 have in common?

Are the barrels, slides, beaver tails, safteys, hammers interchangeable between a 1911 and 2011?

Are 2011 9mm magazines pretty well standardized?

Do poly guns scare you too?

No, there are a few designs that are built on metal lowers. Para, Bul, etc.

Pretty much everything is interchangeable. minus mag release & trigger.

STI/SVI mags are the gold standard. if whatever brand cannot run them, dont buy.

 

[MikeInOr]

I carry a polygun every day but when I get to the range I like metal and wood. I am not opposed to a poly gun if it is the best option, I was just curious if all 2011's have a poly grip.

Having the grip and frame as seperate pieces is what scares me... not what they are made out of. I haven't read any 2011 horror stories so I guess they must be a sound design. Having never held a 2011 it just seems like 1 piece would be better than 2 pieces.

I was not aware of the STI Hawk. A quick search shows them going for around $1500. Still a Hawk with quality parts from the factory might be a MUCH better use of money than a lower end gun needing many more upgrades. Thank you for the tip! I will start googleing and reading.

 

[tarosean]

Having the grip and frame as seperate pieces is what scares me... not what they are made out of. I haven't read any 2011 horror stories so I guess they must be a sound design. Having never held a 2011 it just seems like 1 piece would be better than 2 pieces.

I was not aware of the STI Hawk. A quick search shows them going for around $1500. Still a Hawk with quality parts from the factory might be a MUCH better use of money than a lower end gun needing many more upgrades. Thank you for the tip! I will start googleing and reading.

Okay, pull your Carry apart and tell me what you see? Unless you carrying one of those old boat anchor Rugers withe the plastic rails.. (I forget the model name off the top of my head) there is a good chance it's made of separate pieces too, pined, screwed, molded or combo of.. Nowadays it's a pretty safe bet that the frame can be made up of about anything and still do its job.

As for the hawk, there are some on gunbroker now for high 13's. . MSRP is right under 15 so give it some time and u should be able to pick one up cheaper.

 

[JR24]

Current production I think you are stuck with the RIA as I dont think the Remington (formerly PARA) offer any in 9mm. At least in the sub 1K range.

I have a RIA 10mm that i like a lot and is extremely accurate with a good trigger. Fit is not the tightest and finish is kinda rough with toolmarks and all, but it is a shooter.

I have looked at the 9mm/.22 TCM RIA double stacks and they did look nice and had a good trigger. If I could convince my wife I needed yet ANOTHER 1911 I'd probably have one, likely a commander length barrel.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I am aware of 2011's but don't know that much about them.

Just for clarity and to avoid confusion by future readers, let me point out that 2011 is a designation applied to a design originated and copyrighted by SVI/STI. By definition a 2011 is comprised of a metal chassis contained within a polymer grip frame.

While there are many after market parts available for the 2011 chassis, no other manufacturer makes a 2011. What they do make are 1911s type platforms fitted with a double/staggered stacked magazine.

The commonly accepted term to refer to these is Double Stack(ed) 1911

 

[Tallball]

I have a double-stack 1911 from RIA in 40 caliber. It's a good shooter. It's big. A small-handed person couldn't handle it well. The trigger is nice and I like the big sights. It's very accurate for me.

RIA 1911 40 caliber double stack

• Tallball
• Jul 7, 2018

 

[mgmorden]

There are aluminum (and steel) grips available for the 2011. Granted, the grips alone cost around $300-500, but for those that want it its an option.

Phoenix Trinity makes one set:
https://www.ptrinity.com/firearms/#tab-box|1

CK Arms also makes one:
http://www.ckarms.com/store/grips/74-ck-arms-metal-grip-kit.html

Personally I've got 2 2011's (an STI DVC Limited and a "Frankenstein" gun I cobbled together from various parts on a CK Arms frame). Both are in .40 S&W and both use standard plastic frames and have never given me any trouble. I don't see the need to bother with a metal grip for these.

Tastes vary, but personally, I'd feel like I was wasting money on a Para type gun. There's a reason why competitive shooters are all shooting STI/SVI's or clones with no Para type guns to be found.

If you truly want to go extreme budget, aside from the STI Hawk option mentioned earlier there's also the SPS Pantera availabe in 9mm and is a STI 2011 clone imported from Europe (Spain I believe). They're not quite as refined as an STI but most people I've heard talk about them have good things to say and they're parts compatible so if something breaks any smith who knows the 2011 platform can work on it.

 

[MikeInOr]

I have looked at the 9mm/.22 TCM RIA double stacks and they did look nice and had a good trigger. If I could convince my wife I needed yet ANOTHER 1911 I'd probably have one, likely a commander length barrel.

I had never heard of the .22 TCM before. I always liked my buddies FN five-seven but I could never justify the price and reloading difficulties with the coated cases. Seeing as how I am looking for a double stack 9mm 1911 the addition of the .22 TCM is really appealing! Thank you for bringing the RIA 9mm / .22 TCM to my attention.

 

[MikeInOr]

I have a double-stack 1911 from RIA in 40 caliber. It's a good shooter. It's big. A small-handed person couldn't handle it well. The trigger is nice and I like the big sights. It's very accurate for me.

RIA 1911 40 caliber double stack

• Tallball
• Jul 7, 2018

I do wonder if I will shoot a double stack 1911 as well as my single stack 1911. I have very large hands and don't have a problem with large pistol grips... I do wonder though if the thin frame and Hogue finger groove grip on my 1911 is a lot of the reason I shoot it well.

Are the frames on the STI 2011, Para Ordnance P14 and RIA double stacks all the same? Do grips from one interchange with the others?

 

[drband]

My RIA 9mm/.22TCM double stack commander size is a great shooter. My only complaint is the poorly fitted plastic grips that came on it. The checkering was quite sharp and the edges around the RIA logo on the grip even sharper. I upgraded to g10 grips made by https://www.stonercnc.com/product-page/brown-black-4 and fixed that issue.

Very accurate and no, the frame is not excessively big—I have medium sized hands and have no issues getting and keeping a good grip on the gun.
Machining fit and finish is quite good, even internally (but it’s not an STI). The parkerized finish is holding up well. I shoot reloads in mine almost exclusively except when I need more TCM brass. If you reload, getting the TCM combo is a no brainer! It’s not difficult to reload, but does require more steps than straight wall pistol ammo. It’s well worth the trouble.

I did upgrade the plain black front sight to a Dawson F/O and found it to be a big plus for me.

I believe RIA offers this combo with similar upgrades now if you search for it.

If I had the money, I’d get an STI Hawk, but the RIA combo is awfully hard to pass up based on my experience. Even with upgrades, I spent less than 1/2 what the Hawk goes for.

Good luck with it!

 

[someguy2800]

Does anybody make a double stack 1911 that’s appropriately sized for a double stack 9mm mag? The Wilson combat one is the only one I think I’ve ever seen. It seams to me they are all made for a double stack 45 mag which makes them unnecessarily wide.

 

[ATLDave]

Does anybody make a double stack 1911 that’s appropriately sized for a double stack 9mm mag? The Wilson combat one is the only one I think I’ve ever seen. It seams to me they are all made for a double stack 45 mag which makes them unnecessarily wide.

They're appropriately sized for cramming a huge number of rounds into them! Since most of them are meant for competition (or perhaps home defense), they're big pistols overall.

 

[MikeInOr]

Does anybody make a double stack 1911 that’s appropriately sized for a double stack 9mm mag? The Wilson combat one is the only one I think I’ve ever seen. It seams to me they are all made for a double stack 45 mag which makes them unnecessarily wide.

All of the double stack 9mm 1911's I have come across have been built around the double stack .45 frame size. I am sure they build them for this larger format so parts can be interchanged.

 

[Jim Watson]

The Wilson EDC X9 is a good way removed from 1911 design, not just its Walther based magazine.

The Caspian high cap receiver was designed as a 20 shot .38 Super and is somewhat slimmer than a PO or STI. If you want it in .45, capacity is 10.

I think SVI has gone to all metal butts, leaving the STI to plastic.

 

[someguy2800]

The Caspian high cap receiver was designed as a 20 shot .38 Super and is somewhat slimmer than a PO or STI. If you want it in .45, capacity is 10.

Bingo! That's exactly what I need! I can get that and set it up with a new fire control group and use the 9mm upper off my SA that I currently use for action pistol.