Need help/input on ankle carry

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StressPuppy

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I have had my CCW for several years now and I have found that more often than not, I don't carry because there is no consistant way to do so. It requires a bunch of different setups based on what I am wearing. This has bothered me for some time and I am bound and determined to find a way to ensure I have something with me!

First, let me tell you about attire and such. I typically wear slacks and a buttoned down collared shirt to work. Shirt always tucked in. Almost never wear a sport coat or suit coat.

I tried IWB with a "tuckable" holster and IWB is just plain uncomfortable for me. I tried different things and I just can't do it.

I tried pocket carry with my KelTec P3AT (380), but pocket carry in slacks is somewhat difficult as the material is thinner and it becomes obvious you have something big in your front pocket although it may not be apparrent what it is.

I wasn't happy with carrying just a .380, so I purchased a Kahr PM9. Thus far I really like this gun, it's weight and overall size. I love my Glock 19, but much harder to CCW in my work situation.

So, I finally settled on ankle carry. Many say that is sucks or is the worst place to carry, etc, but as was said in another thread that I came across while searching "Rule number one is to always bring a gun" (or something like that). So ankle is better than nothing.

I went out and purchased an Uncle Mike's #16 ankle rig the other day. I wanted to start inexpensive just in case, and most 'good' rigs take WEEKS if not MONTHS to get. Some have said that the UM works fine for them, so maybe I stick with it.

Ok, to my questions: What is the "proper" way to wear the rig? Although subjective, who makes a good, solid, sturdy, doesn't make you sweat unmercifully rig (for the Kahr PM9)?

I am wearing dress socks and dress shoes (slip ons or lace ups). I have the support strap just above the widest part of the calf. This in turn connects to the ankle rig. The rig is setup so that the barrel of the gun is about an inch or so above the ankle bone but slightly towards the back of my leg. It is over my dress sock and high enough that if my pants come up some it is still not visible. I have the support strap around the calf fairly tight, but not so much as to cut circulation. As I walk around, I can feel it slide down. Dress socks are notorious for sliding down, so I'm sure that doesn't help. I readjust (either loosen, pull back up and tighten or tighten where it is) but if I put it where it won't slide, it is sitting just about on top of my shoe making it easier to see if my pants leg comes up a bit. In looking at the support strap, it seems to sag a bit allowing the rig to slide down.

When it is tight, it seems to be solid and is fairly comfortable (tolerable). But when it loosens up and slides, it slops around on my leg and feels like it might fall off. I know it won't go anywhere, but the movement is not comfortable.

I have seen very solid leather rigs, some even have something that goes down and looks like it almost rests on the top back edge of your shoe.

How do you keep yours in place?

I know ankle is not for everyone, but this seems to be the only way for me to carry. I would greatly appreciate any input and advice you might have. THANKS!
 
Keeping an ankle holster up!

I carry often in a Galco ankle glove. When I put it on it rests just above the ankle bone. It is an excellent product and I do not use the calf strap.

Rule number one: do not put it on too tight! It will begin to bother you fairly quickly. The Galco slides very little even with dress socks.

Rule number two: Actually a secret I learned on one of these websites: Cut the top off some old white gym socks, put it on first, then the ankle holster, and then pull the dress sock over the top. This holds the holster securely while preventing anyone from noticing the holster in the event your pant leg rides up too high.

Rule three: Make sure your pants are loose enough at the bottom to quickly pull up the pant leg with the gun in the holster. My dress pants work great, some of blue jeans don't work well at all.

Rule four: For all day carry - the quality of the holster will make a big difference. My Galco came in less than a week from the date ordered.

I work in an enviroment with business casual or coat and tie can be required. Hip holster would not work with my job. I am sitting most of the day. The ankle holster is great for that situation, and in fact may be easier to access than a hip holster while sitting. I can also access it without raising suspicion in the event the bad guy is already waiving a gun around in a room full of people.
 
I used to wear an ankle holster a lot, but I switch to pocket carry for ease of carry and speed.

However, back in the days that I did ankle carry, I wore cowboy or other pull on boots. Just the thing for here in Texas. The upside is that you can carry a big gun. The downside is that access is even slower.
 
When I carried a S&W model 15 on my ankle under my flight suit, I wore it with the gun over my foot, not on the side. It didn’t slide as much and was much more comfortable.
 
Don't have any experience with ankle carry, but I might suggest a smartcarry type rig and a slim auto, depending on your build. I've got an Ultra-Hyde I purchased off a forum member, I'm wearing it and my Bersa .380 right now, hardly notice it. Pleated front pants definitely help, and with an untucked shirt I can't make it print. Watch it on dates though, you may disappoint a woman later! Another I have read of working for some under a dress shirt and slacks is a Ken Null SMZ shoulder rig. Once again, with a fairly small auto it disappeared. Never tried it personally though. Someone posted a good review of it a week or two back, I'll see if I can find it.

Edit: Here ya go, I should probably mention it's an upside-down vertical rig.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=36510&d=1141425824
 
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StressPuppy,

My 90% of the time carry IS with an ankle holster, but I can't carry anything bigger/heavier than a .38 Special snubby in it...or else it's too uncomfortable and/or the gun prints.

The guns I carry in it -- besides the snubby -- are a Beretta 21A and a Beratta 3032 Tomcat.

I wear mine inside my left ankle and it's an Uncle Mike's #10 ankle holster.

Very comfortable...often forget it's there (which can be good or bad).

-- John D.
 
I have Galco ankle gloves for a Glock 26 and a snubbie.
1. Buy longer pants.
2. When you sit down, put your left hand on your left knee. This traps the pant leg and keeps it from riding up.
3. Wear black socks and pull them up over the holster. Pull the sock up high enough that it covers all but the grip of the gun.
4. Wear heavier socks than a typical dress sock. If you get them in black you can wear a heavier sock and no one will notice, even with dress shoes.
5. Practice drawing!
 
I have Ken Null ankle holsters for both by J-frame and my PM-40. Positioned so that the muzzle is just a bit higher than the point of my ankle, the holsters are comfortable and do not slip.

I tried wearing one higher on the calf at first for better concealment, but found that when I walked the holster would alternately be too tight and too loose, and it would slide down my leg. Wearing a garter would keep it from slipping, but then all the weight would be on that thin strap above your calf. Uncomfortable.

Try wearing it lower, with a thin sock pulled up over the holster. A crew length cotton-lycra dress sock works best for me, as it is just long enough to cover the holster without interfering with the draw. At worst, people will think you just have droopy socks, but they aren't likely to see anything at all if your pants are long enough.

Both the Kahr and the S&W are quite comfortable this way. However I find the S&W conceals better -- that narrow muzzle tucks right into the hollow behind my ankle, so the countours are very organic and not likely to be noticed if an inconvenient gust of wind lifts my pants cuff a little too much. The sudden thickness of the Kahr really stands out, though. That said, plenty of people carry Kahrs and Glocks this way, so YMMV.

If you sit with your legs crossed, just be careful about which leg you put on top!
 
Thanks gang! Some good info here.

I have thought about the rigs that hide the gun in the front (SmartCarry, ThunderWear, etc) but not sure I could do that. Seems like it would be uncomfortable when sitting from a couple of perspectives!

What I have found with several days of carry with my Uncle Mike's is this:
1.) Where I put the gun to start is critical. I tend to try to have it higher to make sure it is concealed but it just wants to slide down. This in turn pulls more on the garter strap causing issues there as well.
2.) The garter on the UM is a thin elastic all the way around and when the gun starts to slide down, the strap just stretchs out instead of helping keep it in place.
3.) If the gun is loose on my ankle at all, it is a bit uncomfortable and unnerving (feels like it is going to fall off).
4.) If the gun is in the right place and tight, it nor the garter seem to bother me.
5.) With the weather being in the 20-30s in the morning and mid-50s in the afternoon, I'm not having any problems with sweating. That will probably change come summer time! (but with the changes in temperature like this, my sinus are killing me! :) )
6.) My dress pants are plenty long enough to hide it when it slides down a little, just so long as I don't cross my legs and put my left on top!
7.) The garter, while tolerable, is not my first choice. If I could get a rig that would work well without, I would be even happier.
8.) Not many people make ankle holsters for the PM9. Glaco has one for the P9, and the PM9 will fit in it, but there is an extra inch or so from the end of the muzzle to the end of the holster. While not a bad thing, it just seems like it would make it carry bigger than it is.

At this point, I'm pretty sure I will stick with ankle carry. Doesn't really bother me although until I am totally comfortable I think I will continue to feel that everyone can see that I have a gun strapped to my ankle. As I forget it's there, I'm sure I'll stop thinking/worrying if others can see it.

Has anybody used a UM ankle holster and then gone to a leather one? What was your experience like? Is it heavier/bulkier/hotter? Stay in place better?

How about the difference in the sheepskin (or faux) versus the high density foam (or whatever) as the backing (for next to your leg)? It seems each place will claim theirs is cooler than the competition.

The places I am looking at holsters:

www.bulmangunleather.com ($130 for ankle)
www.kramerleather.com (very nice but dang expensive! - $210 for ankle - but it seems to have something that rides on the back of your ankle that looks like it would help hold it up.)
www.desantisholster.com (apache ankle rig is generic)
www.klnullholsters.com ($110 for ankle)
Alessi Holsters, but I hear the wait is REALLY long and I can't seem to get a reply to my questions.

That seems to be about it for the PM9. If you have any info on any of these places, please let me know.

Thanks again for your help.
 
KL Null

Massad Ayoob and John Farnam both routinely point people towards the Alessi. It's the route I'd have gone, except I am impatient -- the KL Null is quite nice for the same price, and arrived in less than a week.

In my opinion the only way in which Null's ANK falls short of the Alessi is that Alessi passes the velcro strap through a D-ring, making it much easier to pull tight. However this is a minor hassle, and getting a proper fit with the ANK will get easier with practice and as the holster begins to conform to your leg.

Ken uses a thick piece of wool felt for his backing. It does not get too hot. Several times this last summer I would find my IWB Kimber was sticking to my underwear with sweat, but my ankle was *never* hot or sweaty while wearing the J-frame. I think Ken's holsters are much better made than the Galco and the DeSantis. I like that it does not depend on a thumb break for retention.

Farnam did publish a short field report last year that was highly complimentary of Rusty Sherrick's Ultra-Light, which uses a lot of synthetics to keep weight down. It looks well made, though honestly I think concerns about holster weight are a little overblown. It's worth checking out, at least, and is less expensive than some other options.

http://www.c-rusty.com/pages/holsters/Ankle.htm

You can get all three of those for a Kahr PM9/40.

Someone else mentioned wearing two socks on the leg with the ankle holster, one under the holster and one stretched over the top. This is good practice.
- With the inner sock the wool (or whatever) backing is away from your skin so you don't have to worry about itching, etc.
- If the area *does* get sweaty, you can just change socks. It's hard to wash a holster.
- If I happen to put it on too loose, it can only fall so far before that thin inner sock starts to jam up underneath the holster. This wedges it in place pretty well, certainly long enouth to get to a bathroom to make adjustments.

However I would avoid socks with much of a texture. The ribbing on athletic socks might help some with ventilation, but I find that it causes "pillow marks" on my leg which become sore after a while. Again, thin plain cotton/lycra dress socks work best for me; over-the-calf under the holster, and crew-length over it.
 
www.bulmangunleather.com ($130 for ankle)
www.kramerleather.com (very nice but dang expensive! - $210 for ankle - but it seems to have something that rides on the back of your ankle that looks like it would help hold it up.)
Click to expand...

Those do look nice -- I had seen the Kramer before, but not the Bulman. Both have the D-ring that I like so much on the Alessi model.

With all that leather, the Bulman looks like it ought to last forever. I'd hate to have to break it in though!

For almost double the price of other models, the Kramer had better offer some very nice advantages. It is not immediately obvious to me that it does this. Perhaps someone else has input?
 
cloudcroft,

How high or low do you wear yours? I've got reasonably shaped calves which narrow a bit at my ankles. I find that unless I wear it all the way down (muzzle just at or behind the ankle bone) it will slide down without the garter. Right now mine is situated with muzzle pointed behind the ankle bone, muzzle of gun is about 2 1/2 to 3 inches above the center of the ankle bone, putting the top of the wrap of the holster (not garter) about 7 inches above the center of the ankle bone.

I'm sure for each person there is a "sweet spot", which I guess is what I am trying to figure out.

Thanks for the info!1
 
I use an Uncle Mike's without the calf-strap to carry my CZ75Compact (Gotta love SilverTab Baggy Fit Jeans). Got it as a first/temporary holster... That was over a year ago.

Friends of mine who know I carry have critiqued it as invisible. The only draw back is when I cross my legs sitting in a chair, I have to make sure not to cross my left ankle up on my right knee (holster is inside of left leg)

This works VERY WELL with my boot (Redwing ankle-support) The Strap covers the laces and no more.

I'm looking for a nice IWB, but still haven't found what I like... soon though...



Czar
 
I used to have an Alessi for my Glock 26. It was very well made and functioned beautifully. For me, it rode too low and was a little bulky. I think it's designed more for people like police officers who no one will bust if someone should see the gun on their ankle. I sold it to another guy, who was very happy with it.
 
StressPuppy,

It's below the calf, right at the ankle, down low on the inside of my left ankle, as low as you can go (won't go down further because of the shoe). Snug up the Velcro flap and it stays there even if I run with it...does not slide around or move. The barrel is snug against the ankle and alongside (just behind) the protruding ankle-bone (which keeps it from moving counter-clockwise), butt of gun facing the rear (of course) with a slight cant towards the left. Depending on the shoe worn, sometimes the very tip of the holster is inside the shoe.

Kind of hard to explain in words.

I wear jeans regularly so I look for boot-cut jeans to give me more room.

Also, I have a 32" inseam and it covers the gun just fine, so I've not had to get jeans with a longer inseam...I just try to get jeans with legs that do NOT narrow at the end.

When I ride my MC I wear boots...NO WAY the ankle-holster works due to a VERY obvious bulge down there for all to see (we don't wear bell-bottoms anymore so there is no fix with boots). So the gun goes in my MC jacket/vest "gun pocket." When I'm driving the car, it goes back to the ankle.

-- John D.
 
Thanks. With where you have yours, mine is a bit higher and is probably why I have to use the "garter". I'm afraid if I wear it any lower, it will be seen if I am sitting in a meeting or something. Where it is right now stays hidden, if just barely, when I sit down. The bottom of the cuff of my slacks is maybe a 1/4 inch below the bottom of the holster. If I wear dark socks, even a little higher wouldn't be too obvious. But lighter socks (like I am wearing today) could be a problem. The issue for me being I am always in slacks and dress shoes. Jeans, which are of course thicker and boots which will hold up the holster are not an option for work attire for me (dang it!).

The idea of wearing the sock over the holster (with a strip of a sock under it to help with sweat) seems like a reasonable idea, but also seems like it would over stretch the sock. I guess if you always wore it on the same foot and always wore the ankle holster, you would never know. But without the holster I'm guessing the stretched sock would be around your ankle all day!

Ankle carry is different, but after about a week, I can see how, if done properly, you can get used to it and almost forget it is there. I'm not there yet, but moving in the right direction.

As for motorcycle riding, I'm with you. No way to get to it easily on your ankle. Really, if you are right handed, there is no easy way to get to it if you are riding/moving because your right hand is the throttle hand. But in a jacket or vest is probably the best bet. Hopefully we would never have to use it while actually riding, but there are definitely some idiots out there that see motorcycles as targets.... don't get me started.
 
This has been a great thread for my information. I'm awaiting my CCW, but have no idea how I can carry, given the way I dress. Ankle may be an option, but I have a stupid question...several actually.

Apparently, from reading this thread, ankle carry is usually on the inside of the opposite leg, correct? What about outside the strong side leg? Is that just impractical?

Please forgive my ignorance, but I'm mostly a milsurp guy, so carry to me usually means, on a sling, over your shoulder. ;)
 
StressPuppy,

As I said earlier, riding a MC with boots on does not allow me to use the ankle-holster at all, so "getting to it" down there while riding isn't an issue...it's not there to be gotten. ;-)

But since I have the "BreakAway" throttle-lock on my bike, I can maintain cruise speed, let go of the handlebar with my right hand (or both hands) and get to my gun in my right-side jacket pocket...not a problem. But I don't expect to shoot while riding, that's just how I carry the gun when riding so it's always with on me. If I HAD to shoot while riding, I could.

And if I did want to use an ankle-holster while riding with shoes on rather than boots, I'd switch it over to the right foot, so I could engage the throttle lock, reach down and get it. So it could be done, but it's not likely...so the gun is just in a pocket which is more secure and much easier to get to, especially using both hands (I practice riding with no hands on the handlebars occasionally in case I need to do that for some emergency...it's no big deal as the bike is very stable at speed...passing motorists (cagers), however, seem somewhat surprised).

The shoes I wear -- when I'm not wearing MC boots -- do not have high tops so they're probably much like the shoes you wear at work, but the low tops of mine do not cause problems at all concealing a gun there as yours apparently do...I don't see why the difference. Yes, you do have to be aware of how you sit to reduce chances of the gun printing but I have sufficient jean leg cover there. And jeans are stiffer material so they don't sag as much as slacks do which would show the holster's form much more readily.

I have even crossed my legs -- holster leg on top of my right leg, holster up -- and it still doesn't print due to the heavy material of the jeans which keeps a straight line of "bulk" to the eye unlike softer material slacks that would sag around the bulge and make it quite obvious.

I wear black socks (black goes with anything) only, all the time, but I never use a sock to cover the holster...each of us has to find the best way for ourselves

In your case, you might try slacks an inch longer in length.

-- John D.
 
Red Tornado,

1. Yes, ankle-holsters are usually for the opposite leg (of your strong hand side), inside carry.

2. You COULD carry it same leg outside carry but the problem is it would be more likely to print. Inside is best.

3. I'm a "milsurp" guy, too...all my field gear is GI-issue (mostly old canvas stuff and some new) and even my 1911 open-carry belt holsters are reproductions of GI-issue shoulder and belt holsters (by Pacific Canvas).

-- John D.
 
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The idea of wearing the sock over the holster (with a strip of a sock under it to help with sweat) seems like a reasonable idea, but also seems like it would over stretch the sock. I guess if you always wore it on the same foot and always wore the ankle holster, you would never know. But without the holster I'm guessing the stretched sock would be around your ankle all day!
Click to expand...

Oh, you'll definitely wear out your socks faster this way, but it's really not all that bad. I bought six pair of identical black socks and six pair of identical brown socks a year ago, and with daily wear I'm just now having to think about throwing some out.

Added: And having that many pairs means you can always find an un-stretched sock when you need one.
 
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