Need help selecting a .22 for cc

[BlindJustice]

Note:

S&W 351PD .22 Win RF mag. 7 shots
S&W 317 .22 LR 8 shot cyl. - load with solids for penetration

That Walter P22 looks good as well, what do they $run?

R-

 

[Quoheleth]

Carl Levitan:

You forgot a few little details of importance.

You are certainly correct in the details, and thank you for adding them. I did not realise Agent MacCarthy was forced to retire due to his wound. Actually, he did not charge Hinkley. He positioned himself between Reagan and the door to the limo, squatting slightly and spreading his arms out to maximize HIS body area as a human shield for the President. The one MacCarthy caught, forensics later determined, would almost certainly have hit Reagan as he was being shoved into the car. Without disrespecting anyone's valor that day, IMHO, MacCarthy deserves the Secret Service equivelent of the Medal of Honor for what he did that day.

My point was a .22 - even fired "spray & pray"; perhaps even moreso when fired in this manner - is a dangerous weapon. Hinkley was determined to do bodily harm and he succeeded, even in the face of dozens of men armed with "superior" firepower.

Q

 

[Oyeboten]

If he wears a bulky jaket, an XP-100 in .221 Remington Fireball would be THE '22' to carry...



But, if it were me, I'd go with a 4 inch 'pre-Woodsman' Colt .22 Auto...or, a 4 inch Hi-Sandard Model B.


Easy to carry, 10 shots, good looking, reliable...'sweet'...


Or, any mid-frame older Colt or S & W Revolver, in .22, medium, or short Barrel length or 'Snubby'...

 

[sadp40]

simple if all could carry was a .22

a beretta model 87 target.

it is important to put those .22's where they are gonna

do the most good.

the walthers and sig mosquitos are too problematic,

in a real world defense scenario you must put the

bullets where they are gonna work and they must come

out of the barrel.

its that simple.

 

[bigfatdave]

That Walter P22 looks good as well, what do they $run?

Fairly cheap, actually.
If you have a rental range near you they are almost sure to have one to play with, if you want to try it out.

I think his biggest hang-up is that he is afraid the ammo will be too expensive for him to afford shooting it. He wants to be able to practice so that he can hit something.

If your nephew goes the P22 route, do not get the extended "target" model, it would be less concealable, less reliable (almost all problems with our P22 range gun went away after converting to the shorter barrel), and less accurate.

I can see where he is coming from on the cost of ammunition, but the ammo it takes to run a .22 auto-loader at the range and the ammo that will run it reliably the day you need it are different. I wouldn't go with anything below CCI mini mags, and preferably velocitors/stingers as carry ammo in a BUG. (or their equivalent in another brand - I like CCI)

Seriously, spot the man some ammo and range time, and SHOW him the difference between a water jug shot with the nastiest hunting .22LR round, and a cheapo 9mm hollow-point.

Is the .22 a formidable weapon in skilled hands? - yes
Would I want a .22 that didn't get practiced with as a carry weapon? - absolutely not

Not to get off topic here, but shouldn't a process server have enough income to save up and buy a cheap 9mm and some ammo? I can recommend some books on personal finance if needed.

 

[PT1911]

walter p-22 runs about 300 -330 new give or take depending on where you get it. I have enjoyed mine greatly... Worth every penny I paid.

 

[fishjar]

I carry a NAA mini .22lr with Remington 40 gr. SV. (Also have S&W 637 but don't carry as much given my personal situation)

What I like about the NAA is when I walk out to the parking lot at night or in a mall lot I can have the mini in my hand at the ready and nobody can see it as it is covered by my palm and two fingers. There is no drawing from the pocket, just point and shoot. My point and shoot effective range is only 5-10 feet, any further out I figure I would just turn and run.

The mini does take practice and I can see with the small grips why many don't like it. But at 10 ft. mine will go through 1/2" plywood and that's good enough for me.

As always YMMV.

 

[mr.trooper]

According to independant ballistics testing, this is what a P-22 with a 3.5" barrel will do to you, shooting run of the mill .22LR:



Any hit to the thoratic triangle is going to puncture a lung or the heart. Exactly HOW are you people panning to "kick someones ass" or "shove their .22 up someones butt" with deflated lungs and rapid loss of blood pressure due to blood loss?

How much fight are you going to have in ya' when you have 10 of those holes in your torso? Get real people.

To the OP: have your friend look at a Walther P-22, or a Bersa .22. You could also try and find an old Walther PPK in 22. A Snub-nosed MKII or Buckmark may be an option as well, depending on your friends body type.

 

[patrick526]

Yes, .22 LR is very lethal! Let's not also forget the BG named Cho who massacred student and teachers at Virgina Tech last 2007. He is also using a Walther P22 aside from his Glock 19. Just see how horrible that BG did to that university.

That's also the reason why my purchase of Walther P22 has been delayed for 2 years (I wanted to buy it since 2007), but the near thought of getting the dreaded Walther P22 that massacred students frightened the hell out of me! It's only now that I actually decided to get it again.

 

[bigfatdave]

That's also the reason why my purchase of Walther P22 has been delayed for 2 years (I wanted to buy it since 2007), but the near thought of getting the dreaded Walther P22 that massacred students frightened the hell out of me! It's only now that I actually decided to get it again.

Our P22 hasn't been out massacring anyone that I know of.
Of course, I don't have it under surveillance 24/7, so I suppose it may be getting out unassisted and massacring students as I sleep.

Must be the updated "B" magazines keeping it from animating and going on a rampage.

 

[LibShooter]

+1 on the Walther P22. Mine goes bang everytime I pull the trigger when loaded with good ammo. (MiniMags)

It looks and works just like Walther's big guns, so the skills and muscle memory should scale up easily.

Almost every gun store seems to have one right there in the case for $350.

The front sight is plastic and often sort of loose. That should limit any colonic trauma.

 

[BCRider]

While I love all three of the semi auto .22's that I own there's not a one of them I'd trust to protect me. The ammo is too problematic as well as the pistols themselves need to be fastiduously clean to function correctly.

Nope, if I was in this situation and insisted on a .22 then I'd want one of the 8 or 9 shot revolver options. The revolver relies on the finger muslces to cycle and fire and all the bullet has to do is go BANG!. And for my money my finger would be a whole heap more reliable than wondering if my gun was going to cycle correctly for a follow up shot. Also a .22 revolver can be crazy safe if you carry with the hammer over an empty chamber and give up one round to do so. Mind you if the gun has a lifter block like the S&W's do or a transfer plate like the Rugers they should be completely safe from AD's regardless of handling issues.

I have to admit that if it was me in the same situation I'd want something like a .38Spl. But I have to admit there's some pretty impressive facts that are coming out in this thread. If the idea is to primarily sting hard enough to take the BG's mind away from chasing or some knife work then the .22 may work out just fine. However if your relative is faced with an actual gun then the ability to stop the BG right NOW becomes pretty important and that's where some extra hitting power may prove handy.

 

[ScareyH22A]

Like BCRider said, .22 shooting from a semi auto is quite unreliable for a SD weapon. Rimfire cartridge and finicky pistols. With so many choices of caliber out there, wouldn't one want a caliber that may save his life someday? At least a .380 which is available for use with so many fine concealables. Or a .38 Special in a J-Frame. How about a 9mm Kahr PM9 even. It has a bit of a kick but very controllable and accurate enough out to 15yds. I'm always amazed when my tiny liwwle Kahr reigns thunder like the might of the Mjöllnir of Thor himself.

 

[rbernie]

According to independant ballistics testing, this is what a P-22 with a 3.5" barrel will do to you, shooting run of the mill .22LR:

The reason that the FBI came up with a minimum penetration distance of 12" for their testing protocol was because they determined that rarely does the shooter get presented with a proper frontal shot on the assailant's thoracic cavity. Ofttimes, the bullet has to penetrate an upraised arm or at an angle (because the assailant isn't just standing there stock-still) and even 9mm HPs (circa 1990) didn't always penetrate enough to hit vitals. Yes, a 22LR is capable to reaching the vitals of an assailant, but only under very specific circumstances. That doesn't mean that it's not useful - just that it's got a narrower margin of utility than would a more powerful round.

There is no doubt that a 22LR can be useful. It is less useful in a self defense role than a 9mm or other higher-powered round. It is more economical to shoot than a 9mm or other higher-powered round.

Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances.

In all my years of shooting 22LR pistols (and I've shot just about all of 'em), I have found NONE that were reliable enough for self defense work. They all rely upon recoil to operate, and most all rimfire ammo is simply too variable in quality to be trusted to properly cycle a semiauto under all circumstances.

A good 22LR revolver would be my choice, if I had to carry 22LR for SD use.

 

[lloveless]

I've had several .22 s over the years. I have used all of them for ccw at times and will again when the situation demands. Remember the Mossad uses the Beretta 21- they empty the clip into the victim and then leave the gun with the body. I agree a larger caliber is preferred, but a .22 beats something in the trunk/home etc.

 

[moooose102]

OMG have him talk to a police officer before he does something to get himself killed! if he is going to carry, he needs to have enough gun to save his life, not get someone angry enough to kill him! :banghead:

 

[mgkdrgn]

1) Nephew might want to check and see if he is -allowed- to carry on the job, CCP or not.

2) If he wants to go 22 ... have him go 22 Magnum. An NAA Black Widow in a holster will pocket carry in any business attire he cares to wear, and will be for all intents and purposes invisible. It's my daily carry.

 

[jad0110]

OMG have him talk to a police officer before he does something to get himself killed! if he is going to carry, he needs to have enough gun to save his life, not get someone angry enough to kill him!

See post 25.

I think his biggest hang-up is that he is afraid the ammo will be too expensive for him to afford shooting it. He wants to be able to practice so that he can hit something.

Hey, I gotta respect him for not wanting to start on a pistol he can't afford to shoot, and that may not be the best gun for a beginner, like a Glock 20 or S&W 329PD.

Afterall, IMHO it is better to rely on a 22 that you have lots of perfect practice with than a 45 with only few rounds once or twice per year.

 

[Maia007]

Very well stated, Carl.

 

[gazpacho]

Revolvers have the added advantage of not having a slide that can be pressed out of battery. Your nephew's job will necessarily bring him in VERY close contact with people who may want to do him harm.

Again, the Taurus Model 94 meets his criteria. Also, of all the current production revolvers, it is the only one that has an available speedloader (that I know of). You should be able to find it in the high $200 to low $300 range. Interestingly enough, Taurus also sells their basic steel 38 special snubbies in this same price range.

 

[hardluk1]

I to you go with a tuarus 22 revolver .If the 22 auto does not shoot you could be in trouble and a revolver you just keep pull'n the trigger and you have 9 shots. They have a light wieght models too that wieghts 13 oz's so wieght would be a nothing to carry.

 

[dispatch]

woad yurt- you have it right. The old H&Rs are solid and reliable. I don't know that I would regulary carry one as a CCW, but a keep one in my truck at all times. I know it's going to shoot and if someone steals it- replacement cost is less than the window they broke.

 

[dagger dog]

Your nephew may like the Beretta
21A Bobcat in.22 rimfire. It has the double action feature along with the tip up barrel which makes it very user friendly and one of the safest autos for even first time users.

It's very concealable extremely reliable and easy to get into action, and is a whole lot better than a fist in stopping an attack. Accuracy is acceptable out to 21 ft or closer , with practise you can empty a full magazine into a 8" circle.

 

[thesolidus]

ruger charger

How about a Ruger Charger with a drum?
or one of these?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2BXI1Bsvgs&NR=1

 

[Ichiro]

Firestorm .22.

If there's more money to spend later on and the desire for a more powerful round, the Bersa Thunder .380 is almost the exact same thing.