Need some help identifying an old S&W, and finding parts for it..

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Conall

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A buddy of mine asked me to try and figure out what exactly this poor, butchered old S&W revolver was and help him find parts for it. Looks like maybe an old M&P? Not sure, not too familiar with these old revolvers. Also not sure if it's even worth trying to rebuild.
At some point someone cut the barrel down and apparently decided to take a grinder to the rest of it just for fun..
revolver04.jpeg revolver03.jpeg revolver02.jpeg revolver01.jpeg
Any ideas what it is? Is it worth rebuilding? Best place to find parts?
 
That looks like a very butchered Victory model from WWII. Not even worth thinking about doing anything with it. There is no value there.

Stu
 
It appears to be a pre model 10 so yes an M&P removed of any essence of its former bluing , It is not a victory model there is a V pre cursor in the serial numbers of those that would identify as such but this M&P was modified and whoever did it, didnt even bother to put a front sight back on it. I see no value there at all in trying to bring it back to its past glory, if this gun could speak it would beg to be shot and taken out of its misery. Might make as an interesting mantle/wall hanger but to attempt to repair it would be like being resuscitated when the body's been dead for 50 years.
 
I tried to talk him out of it but he's wanting to try and become a gunsmith at some point and figures that if he can successfully get this poor thing shootable again then he can work on anything.
I don't see that happening, but if he wants to try, well, it's his money..
 
Howdy

It actually might be a very worn Victory Model. Here is the butt of a Victory Model with the V way over on the other side of the lanyard hole. I think I can see the vague remnants of a V on the photo of the butt in the OP's photo. You can also see where a lanyard hole has been filled in. You can see this one also has the 'flying bomb' indicating it was issued to the US government.

victory%20butt%2002_zpsivng3huj.jpg




The Victory Model was a standard S&W 38 Military and Police revolver chambered for 38 Special, made during World War Two. Because of the rush to crank out as many as possible, they did not have the usual deep polish and lustrous blue that S&W put on their other revolvers. Some were Parkerized and some had a matte finish. The Victory Models sent to England were usually chambered for 38 S&W rather than 38 Special. After about SN V 769,900 a newly designed hammer block was installed in the Victory Models and the SN had a SV prefix to indicate they had the safer hammer block in them. Barrels were usually 4", 2" barrels were scarce.

But frankly, that revolver is in such poor condition that it really is not worth putting much money into it, even if the 2" barrel is original, which it may not be. If I was going to undertake to restore it the first place I would look for parts would be Numrich Arms.

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/

And I would buy Jerry Kuhnhausen's book about S&W revolvers, so I knew what I was doing. This is the best book on the market for working on S&W revolvers.

http://www.gunbooks.com/sw.html
 
If you got the gun for free by the time you are done buying the parts you need, you'll already be into that gun about what it will be worth when fixed.
 
Working on old guns is a hobby. Thus: Money is not the object. Having fun is!

Go for it. Just figure out how much the total is going to be before you start.
 
Driftwood Johnson said:
Howdy

It actually might be a very worn Victory Model. Here is the butt of a Victory Model with the V way over on the other side of the lanyard hole. I think I can see the vague remnants of a V on the photo of the butt in the OP's photo. You can also see where a lanyard hole has been filled in. You can see this one also has the 'flying bomb' indicating it was issued to the US government.

victory%20butt%2002_zpsivng3huj.jpg





The Victory Model was a standard S&W 38 Military and Police revolver chambered for 38 Special, made during World War Two. Because of the rush to crank out as many as possible, they did not have the usual deep polish and lustrous blue that S&W put on their other revolvers. Some were Parkerized and some had a matte finish. The Victory Models sent to England were usually chambered for 38 S&W rather than 38 Special. After about SN V 769,900 a newly designed hammer block was installed in the Victory Models and the SN had a SV prefix to indicate they had the safer hammer block in them. Barrels were usually 4", 2" barrels were scarce.

But frankly, that revolver is in such poor condition that it really is not worth putting much money into it, even if the 2" barrel is original, which it may not be. If I was going to undertake to restore it the first place I would look for parts would be Numrich Arms.

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/

And I would buy Jerry Kuhnhausen's book about S&W revolvers, so I knew what I was doing. This is the best book on the market for working on S&W revolvers.

http://www.gunbooks.com/sw.html
Click to expand...

Now I see it, Yep I'm going to have to change my previous opinion and concur with you Mr. Driftwood.
 
No guts, been totally abused with a grinder, and the barrel has been chopped. That is a very very sad shell of its former glory. At best it is a usable crane and cylinder assembly for someone else's repairs. Anything more than that is not financially responsible and is not safety advisable.
 
WestKentucky said:
No guts, been totally abused with a grinder, and the barrel has been chopped. That is a very very sad shell of its former glory. At best it is a usable crane and cylinder assembly for someone else's repairs. Anything more than that is not financially responsible and is not safety advisable.
Click to expand...
Doesn't even have the crane, that's why the cylinder is held in with a rubber band. I hate to think what kind of abuse bent the cylinder so badly.

Absolutely NOT worth trying to restore.
 
Did a bunch of these just get released onto the market? Two in this configuration (complete, more or less) turned up at one of my local gun shops last week and I've seen similar examples on other boards about the same timeframe.

From the one I got to inspect at close range...Victory Model, butchered nearly beyond recognition, buffed over and refinished by either an amateur or a half-wit, with around 30% of the markings still legible. They seem to vary in whether or not they have a front sight and, if so, how well it was reattached after amputation; some have none, some look competently affixed, and some let you see daylight under the sight base (which may or may not align with the bore).

There's also the question of removing the forward lug, meaning the only thing keeping the cylinder in place is spring pressure on its central pin. An M&P has two points of lockup (one fore, one aft) and whoever decided this was a good idea also figured it would run just fine with only one.

For bonus points, some carry non-military English proof marks. This adds the possibility of a .38 S&W with the cylinder bored out to accept .38 Special and all the accuracy problems that may entail.

The cost of replacement parts liable to be four or five times the value of the gun. Which, when complete, will still be a sadly abused and probably dangerous wallhanger. The cost of parts to make it passable as a (mismatched) wallhanger is likely two or three times the value.

What you have there is a shining example of why Bubba should have his tools seized. And quite possible his fingers broken.
 
You can buy a decent M&P and spent untold hours swapping parts from one to the other, only to cut the value by 3/4's.

It is scrap. I wouldn't even use it for holster fitting.


Conall said:
...he's wanting to try and become a gunsmith at some point and figures that if he can successfully get this poor thing shootable again then he can work on anything.
Click to expand...
Are you familiar with the phrase, "you can't get there from here"?
 
I enjoy refinishing/refurbishing firearms. I see it as a hobby. I don't try to make money doing such, as customers who would want my services would not be able to support me. I'm too slow! I take my time, I enjoy my projects. I'm never rushed. The customer is never unhappy! There is no way I would try to make that into anything.

Although... it could be sleeved for .22 LR...

I'm having a thought here...

Okay, the frame looks "okayish" and if it were me and I really, really, really needed a project, it could be tinkered with (assuming that your gunsmith hopeful has a welder and welding skills in addition to machining skills that rival our illustrious MachIVshooter) and turned into a .22 top break! Actually, this is something that I've always wanted to do, but I would start with an H&R solid frame. To do this, you would basically be manufacturing your own revolver, and some of the S&W parts would fit.

What your friend needs to do to learn gunsmithing is to learn how to make money as a gunsmith. Many, many of us on this forum have the mechanical skills to "be" a gunsmith. However, very few of us could be real gunsmiths who do that for a living. Learning how to make money as a gunsmith is not done with that revolver frame.
 
Well, he did it.
It's a frankenstein made up of newer and older parts but it functions perfectly.
 

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The barrel has been cut down to the point that the front locking lug for the end of the ejector rod is gone. Would be fun to mess with if free since it can't be screwed up worse than it is
 
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