New Makarov or used Walther PP for $240 ?

[Zerstoerer]

Which would you choose and why?

A NIB Bulgarian Makarov in 9X18 or a used post war Walther PP in .32ACP:

Like the caliber of the Mak - if they are as good as the Arsenal AK Rifles then I aswered my own question already.

Like the PP for the looks, the 'Made in Germany' AND the caliber.
Yes - the .32 ACP with WIN Silvertips is o.k. for the intended purpose.

Both guns can be had for $230-240.

Which one would you buy?

 

[MICHAEL T]

I had a 1968 German PP and it was a excellent weapon I carried it with Corbon HP and never a hicup. Between my PPK/S and the PP the little 32 was a tack driver. I would much perfer the Walthers myself. Of course I don't care for any Russian designed weapon.

 

[ugaarguy]

Plenty of arguements for the Makarov here; http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=211856

I'd go with the Mak, and you can get them for less money here; http://www.kyimports.com/amt.htm

 

[Pilot]

Makarov is a far superior weapon to the Walther PPK or PP. See the Mak thread the previous poster linked. No contest.

 

[Teakwood]

For the $$ stated, the Makarov is over-priced and the Walther is under-priced.

If you want a good pistol, the Makarov is the better choice.

If you are looking to invest in a safe queen, the Walther is the better buy for the price stated.

 

[Essex County]

i have found the Mak superior to the Walther....Much more shootable IMHO...Essex

 

[aubie515]

I paid $120 for a mint Bulgy 2 years ago that came with 5 mags. I wouldn't pay $240 for a Bulgy...you can get a russian for that price.

 

[RON in PA]

The Walther PP was a major advance in handgun design when introduced in 1929 and probably was the inspiration for the Makarov. IMHO the Makarov is a superior design with better ergonomics,ie., safety works the right way and there is a slide release. Also the internal design of the Makarov is very different with a better DA trigger.

The one advantage of the PP is that if you are recoil sensative the 32ACP is more comfortable to shoot. I find the Mak quite snappy. The price on the PP is very good providing the gun is in good condition.

 

[lee n. field]

Price is high for the Bulgarian Mak.

 

[BluesBear]

I'd grab the Walther.

 

[gopguy]

The Walther is the better buy...assuming good condition.

The Walther will be the better investment down the road. It was not all that long ago a Bulgarian Mak was only $150. Great deal I even bought a couple myself. However it all depends on what you want her for. The Mak is superior as a defensive pistol, if bulkier. But the Walther is a classic that is no longer in production in Germany.....or France for that matter. The prices will rise when they dry up.....

 

[Onmilo]

With the exception of one Chinese Makarov, I have not shot any other countries version of the pistol that will shoot anywhere near as well, or as accurately, as a Walther PP of any caliber.

That said I am not convinced the Chinese Makarov would continue to shoot so well as a Walther for any great length of time either.
The Chinese gun had just over fifty rounds fired through it before I had the chance to shoot it.

That said I am also well aware that even the very best .32 acp ammunition falls short of the ballistic advantage of the military full metal jacket 9X18 cartridge and won't even come close to the advantage provided by top grade 9X18 ammunition, I still choose to keep, carry and shoot .32acp Walthers.
Ammunition for either caliber will cost you about the same amount of money whichever you choose, no advantage there to either.

I live in a rural area and the greatest threat out here are feral dogs not roving bands of miscreants, though the kids do get drunk and get their cars stuck in fields every now and then, however, they don't generally start a gunfight when someone comes to help them.
The .32acp does a remarkably effective job of taking all the sap and wind out of an angry or rabid dog and I have never felt undergunned using one for the purpose.

My vote goes for the Walther.

 

[Dr.Rob]

That Walther is as close to James Bond as you are going to get for $250.

Why the heck not?

 

[kentucky_smith]

May I suggest CZ82?

 

[Buck Nekkid]

+1 on the CZ 82

Here you have a more modern design than either the Walther or Mak, a pistol still in production (the CZ 83 is the civilian version of the CZ 82), excellent ergonomics, and a great price!

Yep, the CZ 82 is a great alternative and there are a bunch now available at various MilSurp dealers across the country

 

[Onmilo]

Actually, I myself have been looking for a CZ82 or 83 in .32acp,,,,,
Never could get warm and fuzzy with the 9X18 Makarov cartridge, or the .380acp for that matter.

 

[Teakwood]

"Actually, I myself have been looking for a CZ82 or 83 in .32acp,,,,,
Never could get warm and fuzzy with the 9X18 Makarov cartridge, or the .380acp for that matter."

Say what? 32 ACP has half the force of the other two and youi are looking for a CZ83 in 32 ACP?

I have shot Makarovs in 9x18 and .380, and Walthers in .32 and .380. Frankly, the Makarov is a lot more comfortable to shoot.

I do not get it.

 

[Pilot]

have shot Makarovs in 9x18 and .380, and Walthers in .32 and .380. Frankly, the Makarov is a lot more comfortable to shoot.

X2. The PPK is not comfortabke to shoot and often gives slide bite. THe safety works backwards to every other gun I have. They are sometimes finicky with ammo. I would carry or shoot a PPK or PP and I own a WWII bring back PP from my Dad, so I know the breed. Stick with the Mak, but you can do a little better than $240 for a Bulgie.

 

[Onmilo]

Teakwood you don't need to get it.
Some folks like .38 caliber guns and some folks like .32 caliber guns.
I happen to be in the camp that likes .32 caliber guns.

As far as a Walther safety working backwards from every other gun you own Pilot, then you must only own a Makarov because the safety on a Mak is backwards from everything else using a slide mounted safety/decocker.
Except when compared to pistols using a frame mounted safety lever/decocking lever the Makarov works like no comparable small frame automatic.

For further clarification, I do not care for .38 caliber snub revolvers any longer either and for serious concealed carry I would much prefer to use my Glock 26 9mm, alas, we in Illinois are not allowed to do so except on our own property.

 

[Pilot]

As far as a Walther safety working backwards from every other gun you own Pilot, then you must only own a Makarov because the safety on a Mak is backwards from everything else using a slide mounted safety/decocker.
Except when compared to pistols using a frame mounted safety lever/decocking lever the Makarov works like no comparable small frame automatic.

The Mak may have a slide mounted safety, but it swipes down to fire just like my 1911, Hi Power, HK USP, CZ-75B, Beretta 85 FS, etc. The motion for the PPK is OPPOSITE. You swipe UP tp fire. I prefer frame mounted safeties, but if I have one mounted on the slide like a Mak, I want it to work similarly (i.e. same direction) to my other guns. I think most others understood what I was saying.

 

[BluesBear]

The Walther may work backwards to ever other gun YOU own but not so for the rest of us.

I see this mentioned all of the time and for the life of me I can't understand anyone who has a problem remembering that frame mounted safties go up for safe and slide mounted safties go down for safe.

I've known many people who own both and have never heard anyone claim they couldn't keep it straight.

If you just think of the location of the firing pin you'll see that both operate in a direction that "blocks" the firing pin when on safe and in a position that "clears" the pin when in the fire position.




Except for the Mak.

 

[Pilot]

The Walther may work backwards to ever other gun YOU own but not so for the rest of us.

I see this mentioned all of the time and for the life of me I can't understand anyone who has a problem remembering that frame mounted safties go up for safe and slide mounted safties go down for safe.

Wait until you are presented with a Hi Stress, real life situation and see which way your brain defaults. "Remembering" isn't part of the equation at that point, instinct/habit from training takes over.

 

[BluesBear]

Wait until you are presented with a Hi Stress, real life situation and see which way your brain defaults

Been there done that. Did just fine.

My brain knows what to do, by default, because my hand tells it which gun it is holding.


Plus no one I ever worked with carried a traditional DA auto with the safety on.

 

[Teakwood]

"Plus no one I ever worked with carried a traditional DA auto with the safety on."

Amen.

 

[wbond]

I own a Firestorm (Bersa) version of Walther and a Makarov 9x18

I actually own both a .32 and a .380 Firestorm (Bersa variant), a Makarov IJ-70 in 9x18, and 3 CZ-83s in various calibers (.32, .380, and 9x18).

I think all are nice weapons. To be comfortable the Makarov needs a rubber grip. I have a really nice rubber grip (from Pierce I think) that wraps around the back. Really comfortable.

However, the Makarov is rather thick, fat and chunky and not good for IWB carry, which is my preferred mode. Likewise the CZ-83 is no picknick to conceal and carry. Rather fat, IMO. However, the CZ-shoots better and more accurate than any other handgun I've ever shot. This is true in all calibers, but the 9x18 is the most accurate of my CZ-83s.

The Firestorms are thinner and lighter and much easier to carry. Yet still heavy enough to control recoil.

Stopping Potential?

IMO the 9x18 is the same diff as a .38 Spl if you shoot the hotter Mak ammo like 115 gr Silver Bears, but you'll need or want a stiffer recoil Spring upgrade from Wolf, if you want to shoot that hotter ammo.

Standard 95 gr 9x18 ammo is dandy with the stock Mak spring and it has a stopping potential similar to .380 +P.

However, let me point out here that .380 and .38 Spl have proven to be very similar to each other in real world shootings. Some say the .380 is better based on their stats. Others say the .38 Spl is better based on their stats.

I think it's fair to say that both the .380 and the 9x18 are similar to .38 Spl in stopping potential. The 9x18 undeniably has a bit more poop than the .380, but is it really enough to matter? The greater issue is ammo cost. I've found 9x18 ammo to be incredibly cheap. The Silver Bear stuff and some others are good and cheap. However, I'd avoid Wolf ammo (dirty).

The .32 ACP (my normal carry gun in a Firestorm) is rather anemic compared to a .380, and especially compared to a 9x18. However, the .32 ACP is easy on my arthritic hands and much better than no gun at all. I prefer the Fiocchi JHP for my .32 ACP because it is second most powerful after Corbon .32. The Fiocchi does not expand quite as much as Corbon, but penetrates more (about 10" total).

The Walther would be much easier to carry, IMO. The Makarov is much more powerful since you are comparing a .32 ACP to a 9x18. No matter what anyone tells you, 9x18 ammo is cheap and plentiful online and even at my local gun store. Well, one gun store. The other doesn't carry it.

Honestly, I'd suggest you get a .380 Firestorm or Bersa. They can handle JHPs well and carry fairly easy. If you get a compact concealed carry version of the Bersa .380, then it will carry very easy. The price is right on Firestorms and Bersas too.