New Sig P220 doesn't like my semi wadcutters

[Hammerdown77]

Hello all,

I managed to snag a factory refurb Sig P220 with night sights last weekend, and shot it for the second time today. The first outing I shot mostly 230 gr lead round nose over 6.0 grains of Unique. Gun ran like a top. Today, I had a batch of 200 gr. LSWC (Missouri Bullet), again over 6.0 grains of Unique, and the gun just didn't want to cycle them reliably at all. This same load shoots lights out in all my 1911s (even the short 3" ones). In the Sig, what would happen is after firing, the spent case rim would hang on the shoulder of the bullet below it, which was already part of the way out of the magazine. Pretty repeatable failure. That sharp shoulder of the LSWC would snag the rim of the spent case as it was being extracted. I was using the one 7 round magazine the gun came with from Sig.

This is my first Sig Sauer. Is this a common problem? Magazine problem? Design problem? Or just a "don't use semi-wadcutters in that gun" problem?

 

[Steve C]

SWC's are the most problematic bullet type to get working in a semi automatic. Bullet shape and OAL for that particular bullet may have to be adjusted to get it to feed and eject reliably.

....the spent case rim would hang on the shoulder of the bullet below it, which was already part of the way out of the magazine. Pretty repeatable failure. That sharp shoulder of the LSWC would snag the rim of the spent case as it was being extracted.

In your case I would see if keeping the bullets securely against the back of the magazine after loading would stop the premature release you are getting with the top round. I'd also try adding a bit more crimp or bit of chamfer to the case mouth to see if that would stop the snagging.

If a making a few simple adjustments didn't work I'd personally just shoot the RN bullets from the Sig and forget the SWC's.

 

[Hammerdown77]

Found this quote from an old post on the 1911 forum:

http://forum.1911forum.com/showthread.php?p=77092
"The P220 will not work with the famous sharp shouldered Hensley and Gibbs style semi-wad cutter. You will get one of the mose unusal jams you have ever seen in your life. Due to the Sig P220's short feed ram the empy case that is being ejected is actually rubbing over the loaded round beneath it while it is being ejected. The rim of the empy ejected case will plow a real neat trench through the shoulder of the lead bullet beneath it and then peal back the mouth of the loaded round. Wow what a jam that causes."

Yep, that's pretty much what's happening with mine (without the peeling back the case mouth part).

 

[RevolvingGarbage]

Have you thought about rolling the shoulder of the bullet inward a little with a file?

It would be labor intensive and tedious, but if you use a different OAL to fix the problem, then it might be a good solution.

 

[MCMXI]

I've been shooting 185gr SWCs through my SIG P220 since 1992 ... usually in front of 5.0gr of W231. I've literally put more than 10,000 rounds through it without any issues ... EVER!! My Kimber TEII won't feed these rounds at all. I recently bought a factory refurbished P220 for my ex-wife and a new P220 Carry for myself. Both came with two 8-round magazines so not sure why yours came with just one 7-round magazine.

Here are the bullets in question ...

And here are some loaded rounds ...

 

[Hammerdown77]

I don't know why it only came with the one 7-rounder. I know for a while Sig was only shipping one magazine with their guns. I think this gun was a LEO trade-in that the factory completely rebuilt and refurbished and sold to my local shop. It's basically a new gun, with new (stiff) springs, new finish on the slide, new night sights. No rail.

7-round mag


The rounds in question:


The gun:

 

[MCMXI]

That is a severe shoulder on that bullet though. As I mentioned, my Kimber TEII won't feed my 185gr SWC reloads at all so I plan on shooting 200gr RNFP bullets in that and maybe some 250gr RNFP bullets too. I suppose that's your best option ... order different bullets. MBC has three RN bullets to choose from. I have three SIGs and they're all excellent pistols. It's not Kimber's fault or SIG's fault that our reloads don't work. Just find what does work and stick with that. If you were having a problem with factory RN bullets then you can blame SIG.

 

[Hammerdown77]

From some of my other reading, the Springfield XD .45 had the exact same problem. It has to do with the way the feed cycle is designed. Mine doesn't fail with every shot, it's more like one or two out of 7 rounds, so it's right on the ragged edge of functioning. But it's still a hard failure, requiring the magazine to be dropped, the slide locked back, and the spent casing extracted from the chamber with fingertips.

I don't blame Sig at all, this is a great gun. I had been on a lucky streak with guns feeding all my different reloads. Guess it had to end sometime!

 

[evan price]

Your bullet is different from the ones 1858 shows in his anwer. Your shoulder is square and sharp. His shoulder has a radiused edge. This makes the problem worse for you.
My P220 did not like the Lee tumble-lube 200-gr SWC for the same reason and it's the way the gun is designed. I suggest a different bullet shape. My P220 never did get 100% with the lighter SWCs no matter what and so now I just run 230-gr 2-radius ogive or ball-style 1-radius ogive round noses in all my 45's, since my Ballester-Molina won't do SWCs either.

 

[MCMXI]

Missouri Bullet Company sells a 185gr SWC that looks just like the ones I use if you're set on a SWC. You could always pick up a Ruger Blackhawk chambered in .45 Colt/.45 ACP to dispose of those troublesome bullets.

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=123&category=5&secondary=13&keywords=

I'm going to use 200gr RNFPs in my Kimber TEII. I have Black Talon 230gr SXT for the real world.

 

[ljnowell]

That is the EXACT same jam that XDs suffer from with SWCs. Fought it for awhile, then switched to the Missouri Bullet 200gr XD, and 230 LRN. No more problems.

 

[Jim Watson]

My first P220 would misfunction in the exact manner of the O.P.
If you take the barrel and slide off the frame, put a case in the chamber, put the barrel in the slide with the case rim under the extractor as though being fired, and move the barrel as though it were starting to unlock, you can see the rim of the case being extracted drop below the breechface. Tailor made to extract back and hit the shoulder of the next SWC. It is hard to see how anybody's will function with a #68 SWC, but some do.

I traded the gun because it would not shoot the ammo I was loading for my 1911, but liked it so well that I got another and feed it roundnose for practice and ogival hollowpoints for carry.