New to this board Question about two-piece barrels

[Six-Gun]

First off, I'd like to say hello! I'm new here, but not new to gun boards at all. I am regular over at the OutdoorsBest (aka Guns & Ammo) forum and ran into this board a bunch while doing Google searches, and figured it was high time to register and start posting here a bit.

I browsed your forums most recently, looking for affirmation or dissent on my decision to buy a Smith and Wesson Model 686. I was looking at a Model 620, but decided against it specifically due to my leeriness about the two-piece barrel construction of the Model 620.

Now, Dan Johnson, the board moderator for OutdoorsBest.com and writer for G&A magazine is obvoiusly a fairly knowledgeable guy. He stated the following:

"Theoritically, the two-piece barrel is on average more accurate because it is more easily tightened to the frame with precise tension. A one-piece barrel with front sight ramp built-in must be tightened to a point where the ramp is perfectly vertical. This means some barrels may be either over torqued or under torqued to line the sight up. With the two-piece barrel the barrel can be torqued perfectly and then the outer sleeve holds it in a stress free position."

I'm sure some of you own both standard forged Smith barrels AND the newer two-piece assemblies. I want your opinions.

Am I just being overly paranoid here, or was it smart to stay away from the newer design?

 

[dfariswheel]

Most issues aside, the new barrel is a wash for the average owner.

While there are potential issues when it comes to re-barreling, or custom work like shortening barrels, the average owner will never have this done anyway, so the only questions are: is the accuracy OK, and does the new barrel system work?

Accuracy appears to be at worst the same.
Does the barrel "work" as intended, seems to also be yes.

So, unless you're planning on having a non-factory gunsmith do barrel work, or you want to shorten a new barrel, this is a non-issue.

On the up side, the new barrel system offers at least the potential for a more accurate gun, and there is an almost certain likelihood that an after-market maker, if not S&W, will offer interchangeable barrels similar to Dan Wesson.

The biggest strike against the new barrel system, is, it ain't the old barrel system.
New shooters will not have this prejudice against the "new" and should have no actual problems with it.

 

[unspellable]

Two piece barrel

The two piece barrel has the advantage that you can screw the barrel tube in until the cylinder gap is correct and then add the outer sleeve as opposed to the old system of installing the barrel and then grinding off the rear of the barrel to set the gap.

I've seen plenty of S&W's with excess cylidender gap, off square breech face, etc. Of course it that's due to sloppy work, so there's no gurantee that making the job easier will mean they go to the trouble of doing it right.

 

[Six-Gun]

Good points, gentlemen. Thanks for the input.

 

[Brian Williams]

The two piece barrel has the advantage that you can screw the barrel tube in until the cylinder gap is correct and then add the outer sleeve as opposed to the old system of installing the barrel and then grinding off the rear of the barrel to set the gap

NOOOOOO!
The outer flange of the barrel holds the barrel shroud on. It is not put on after the barrel is installed but before. The barrel cylinder gap is set by measuring the space and chucking the barrel in a lathe and then facing it off to the correct length.

 

[Six-Gun]

Wow - you guys have a lot more manufacturing nickel knowledge than I do. I had no idea that this how we get to this portion of the end product. If what Brian said is the case, then there should be no excuse for the cylinder gap to be excessive in neither a forged, nor a two-piece barrel.

 

[unspellable]

cylinder gap

Brian, now that I think of it, I believe you are correct in saying the front of the barrel is flanged and holds the sleeve.

Still leaves the question of whether or not the factory sets the cylinder gap correctly, and they do not have a sterling record in this regard.

This is one big advantage with the Dan Wesson, the cylinder gap is adjustable and the question of whether the factory set it right or wrong does not arise.

Since S&W borrowed the technology directly from Dan Wesson, one wonders why they did not make the barrel interchangable like the DW.

 

[Six-Gun]

Speaking of Dan Wesson, I went to their page to look at their revolvers. Now, I bought a Patriot Expert 1911 .45 ACP from them a few months before CZ-USA bought them out.

Now, I can't find squat for their revolvers, even though the site still says something about them in the index. What gives? Are they simply no longer offering them? Are they updating them?

 

[unspellable]

Dan Wesson

The revolvers have been missing from their website for a while. They were still making them, I bought one fairly recently. Since the CZ merger, take over, or whatever it is, they say they are retooling the revolver line and will resume full production.

To my mind, what they really need is better marketing, hopefully this will happen with CZ added to the mix.

 

[swiss 210]

Its normal you cant find any thing on dan wesson when the company was taken over last year they desided to stop well put on hold there revolver line i have phoned them i was looking for a 445 super mag but they had already stoped them !!!!But then again i dont know if i want a gun from a company that seemes to change hands so often after sale service may be bad !!! Nice guns though.

 

[unspellable]

Dw

Odd. I bought a revolver direct from DW this spring. I then ordered an extra barrel assembly for it and had to wait two weeks while they made it.

 

[popeye]

Aren't most Taurus revolvers two piece (I always heard the term sleeved) barrels. I remember a couple years ago a reputable well known gun smithing opperation (the name has slipped my ageing brain) offered a system where they took your 686 and removed the existing barrel. They offered 2-4-6" barrels and sleeves. The only change made to the frame was it was notched to accept aprojection on the sleeves to prevent their rotation. Nothing was done to frame to prevent original stock barrel back on. The whole thing emulated the DW system. It looked good and prices were very reasonable. The only thing that kept me from trying out the system was the sleeves were alloy as opposed to DW steel. I was cocerned about their durability as far as marring the matte finish on the sleeve. Also there would be a large difference in barrel weight.

 

[Six-Gun]

unspellable - your DW order

Odd. I bought a revolver direct from DW this spring. I then ordered an extra barrel assembly for it and had to wait two weeks while they made it.

Spring sounds, in my mind right around when they were bought out.

My patriot Expert took literally months to get, as they were back ordered to the ends of the Earth. I initially had a stainless version ordered, and went with a blued gun because the stainless order would have been an additional 9 weeks!

I think they need to expand their manufacturing plant, and CZ has the capital to do it.

As for the site, it's about useless in it's present format. CZ links you to a page with no revolvers and a whopping 2 semi-auto 1911s.

 

[unspellable]

Two piece barrels

If we say two piece barrels without regard to system, they go way back. Any gun with an aluminum or titanium outer barrel will have a steel sleeve inside. Today we see fairly high quality arms with such, but in years past right up untill today there have been many cheap arms so made. A lot of lower quality 22 LR handguns have a stell liner and alloy sleeve.

 

[Brian Williams]

All Taurus revos are 1 piece and the Gunsmith who made the interchangeable barel/shroud system for 686s stopped, He is Jack Weigand, he is now primarily working on manufacturing scope mounts. He at one time set up some of the best Ruger SP101s with his "Tame the Beast" package

 

[unspellable]

Taurus

Not all Tauri have a one piece barrel. There are many with a two piece barrel. So far as I know, all the titanium and aluminum models have a two piece barrel. It's required, as titanium and aluminum will not stand up to having a bullet pushed through them.

I had a Tuarus titanium snubby in 44 Special with a steel barrel liner. I rather liked it, but unfortunately, the chamber alignment was off.