New Video from Pres. of Federal

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CQB45ACP said:
Why aren’t the foreign manufacturers importing to USA?
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The Russian primers are subject to trade sanctions which are now hurting us more than them.

I haven't seen any credible explanation regarding the lack of Fiocci, MagTech, S&B, etc., except forum rumors which are unable to site sources.
 
My lifetime LGS decided during the Clinton ammo squeeze that they would no longer sell primers by the 1000. You could buy 100 pretty much any day, limit 1 per customer. That caters favorably to hunters that don't typically burn through 1k in a day's shoot like semi-auto folks. A buddy I reload and hunt with went by on Saturday to get duck ammo. I gave him a short list of powders and primers to check on. He found 1# of Hogdon I could use. They now only sell 100 primers if you buy a box of bullets to go with them. They didn't have the bullets we needed, so no primers. Frustrating, but somewhat reasonable IMO. We're fortunate to have some inventory on hand already.
 
I viewed the video as corporate political correctness.
First concern of customers - covid protection for workers. While every company should and must protect workers, I doubt this is customers first concern.
Second concern - where is the hunting ammo. I think most customers are want to know where is the handgun and 223 ammo. Focusing on hunter ammo shortage hunting takes away criticism of making evil handgun ammo.
Third concern - lack of primers. His response - too bad reloaders - your are not getting any.

While I love and use their products, I am disappointed in this response.
 
Highland Lofts said:
So where is all of the ammo & reloading stuff going? Retailers can not get merchadice to put out on the shelves. So where is it all going?
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The supply chain is bled dry. Warehouses are empty. It comes off the production line and ships to their customers (distributors). Distributers handle their biggest customers first and the low-volume mom&pop shops are at the bottom of the priority list. When it finally hits the retail market, poof, it's sold and gone. It is amazing how efficient the internet is when everybody wants the same thing. Like a swarm of locusts on a farm field. Gone. Then people turn to reloading and buy all that equipment up (most of which will be for sale in the next five years).

I had been looking for SPP online for weeks. When I finally found them online, as soon as I checked out I looked back at the product page and they were all sold out. It took less than 5 minutes. A million people looking for the same item, all trying to buy it at the same time. Few get lucky, most don't. This then reinforces their resolve to 'buy it as soon as I see it' and furthers the panic. Just like the toilet paper shortage. Purchase quantity limits help to spread the available stock to more people. People complain about purchase limits. People complain about items being out of stock. You can't please everyone all the time.

Eventually people will calm down. Some, when they have enough quantity in their stock to feel comfortable. Some when they feel safe in the environment (political, etc). Some, when the thrill of it goes away. When this happens, there will be stacks of ammo and primers on the shelves on sale due to the excess capacity. I doubt all the ammo that is sold is actually being shot. Yes there are millions of new gun owners, but typically the new gun owners aren't quantity shooters and are satiated by a few boxes of ammo. I bet that the actual total number of rounds down range in 2020 is slightly more than 2019. Most of the ammo and components sold are in peoples' closets or basements.
 
Funny story... Went to the range with a friend last week. He mentioned how hard it was to find 9mm ammo and that after that trip he only had four boxes of 9mm left. I kinda chuckled and pointed out that he had written '12/18' with a sharpie on his box of ammo. He purchased that box of ammo two years ago. He had plenty of time to build his stock when it was on sale for $8.99 a box. Apparently, two years ago he had decided that six boxes was a good enough stock for him and entered into the 'shoot a box, buy a box' mode. Now he is getting interested in reloading because he can't find ammo to buy at a reasonable price.

I bet this story is similar to many and is the source for the majority of the new reloaders buying up new equipment.
 
WeekendReloader said:
The supply chain is bled dry. Warehouses are empty. It comes off the production line and ships to their customers (distributors). Distributers handle their biggest customers first and the low-volume mom&pop shops are at the bottom of the priority list. When it finally hits the retail market, poof, it's sold and gone. It is amazing how efficient the internet is when everybody wants the same thing. Like a swarm of locusts on a farm field. Gone. Then people turn to reloading and buy all that equipment up (most of which will be for sale in the next five years).

I had been looking for SPP online for weeks. When I finally found them online, as soon as I checked out I looked back at the product page and they were all sold out. It took less than 5 minutes. A million people looking for the same item, all trying to buy it at the same time. Few get lucky, most don't. This then reinforces their resolve to 'buy it as soon as I see it' and furthers the panic. Just like the toilet paper shortage. Purchase quantity limits help to spread the available stock to more people. People complain about purchase limits. People complain about items being out of stock. You can't please everyone all the time.

Eventually people will calm down. Some, when they have enough quantity in their stock to feel comfortable. Some when they feel safe in the environment (political, etc). Some, when the thrill of it goes away. When this happens, there will be stacks of ammo and primers on the shelves on sale due to the excess capacity. I doubt all the ammo that is sold is actually being shot. Yes there are millions of new gun owners, but typically the new gun owners aren't quantity shooters and are satiated by a few boxes of ammo. I bet that the actual total number of rounds down range in 2020 is slightly more than 2019. Most of the ammo and components sold are in peoples' closets or basements.
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Maybe that’s the problem? Locusts!
 
WeekendReloader said:
Then people turn to reloading and buy all that equipment up (most of which will be for sale in the next five years).
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This indeed is the "bright spot" which most everyone is overlooking. In the next several years, high-end reloading equipment will be flooding the market. Crazy people who rushed in and paid through the nose for a machine today will be selling it when ammo prices return to "normal" because, as everybody knows, "You can buy 9mm cheaper than reloading".

Which reminds me, I saw a striped, used Dillon 550 on CraigsList yesterday for $900 without a single accessory or die set. And there are new 750's on Ebay now for $1200 to $1500.

Sometimes you just have to laugh out loud.
 
mlankton said:
2020 created a lot of new gun owners fueling demand. As CNN and the rest of the mainstream media keep hammering them with how everything is fine now that Trump is gone and Harris-Biden are in command, that demand is going to plummet through 2021. We're going to have to suffer through this for a while yet, but there will again come a day when you can buy a box of primers at Bass Pro.
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Politics has nothing to do with it. It can't. Ever. Nothing is political. Ever. Nothing. Now repeat after me: stay above the fray, ignore reality, think only as instructed, 2+2=5...
 
Otto said:
Vista Outdoor owns Federal, CCI, Speer and Remington. I'm thinking VSTO stock ($29.31) might be a good play.
52 week low/high has been $4.29--$30.15. Next earnings report is Feb. 4th, which should blow away consensus estimates. Buy now or wait for a dip?
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If you can't buy Class A or Class B shares of stocks, don't bother. Stick to the packaged bundles of Class C shares and take the 1.5-3% + inflation route. The wholesale stock houses own the real money-making shares; unless you're on the board or a founding owner, you can't even buy a voting block of shares.
 
WeekendReloader said:
Funny story... Went to the range with a friend last week. He mentioned how hard it was to find 9mm ammo and that after that trip he only had four boxes of 9mm left. I kinda chuckled and pointed out that he had written '12/18' with a sharpie on his box of ammo. He purchased that box of ammo two years ago. He had plenty of time to build his stock when it was on sale for $8.99 a box. Apparently, two years ago he had decided that six boxes was a good enough stock for him and entered into the 'shoot a box, buy a box' mode. Now he is getting interested in reloading because he can't find ammo to buy at a reasonable price.

I bet this story is similar to many and is the source for the majority of the new reloaders buying up new equipment.
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Wow! Yes, that was me, too. When I hit a thousand rounds on-hand of 9mm, .45ACP, .357magnum, .38Spl, .32S&W Long, .380ACP, and 7.62Tok, I started that same "shoot-a-box/buy-a-box routine," too. Huge mistake!

Doesn't count reloads, or reloading capacity, just on-hand, loaded, in the box and on-the-shelf commercial ammo. Still, next time I'll do shoot-a-box/buy two to replace it.
 
MosinT53Hunter said:
Now news comes out that Vista Outdoors is kicking up the price on their ammo 15% in the up coming months.
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Wait until the price of commercial over-land diesel hits $6/gallon. The price of everything transported by truck in this country will quadruple. Now, to make you feel better, name something NOT transported by truck in this country and relax in the knowledge that your overlords consider your feelings when making these tough decisions - as they fly to summits to discuss how much to restrict drilling, mining, weapons and free speech. They care about you sooooo much!
 
GeoDudeFlorida said:
Wait until the price of commercial over-land diesel hits $6/gallon. The price of everything transported by truck in this country will quadruple. Now, to make you feel better, name something NOT transported by truck in this country and relax in the knowledge that your overlords consider your feelings when making these tough decisions - as they fly to summits to discuss how much to restrict drilling, mining, weapons and free speech. They care about you sooooo much!
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I know, right?!? Such caring people, always looking out for the little guy. ;) ;)
 
PatH65 said:
First concern of customers - covid protection for workers. While every company should and must protect workers, I doubt this is customers first concern.
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Yeah, the moment he laid down this whopper, his credibility was gone.

Then, he proceeded to explain, in painstaking detail, how Vista is screwing the handloaders. That part, I found credible, but I already knew that.
 
My sense is the large ammunition manufacturers would ensure they have sufficient raw material and components to accomplish their goals before focusing on components for reloaders and other hobbyists.
 
WeekendReloader said:
The supply chain is bled dry. Warehouses are empty. It comes off the production line and ships to their customers (distributors). Distributers handle their biggest customers first and the low-volume mom&pop shops are at the bottom of the priority list. When it finally hits the retail market, poof, it's sold and gone. It is amazing how efficient the internet is when everybody wants the same thing. Like a swarm of locusts on a farm field. Gone. Then people turn to reloading and buy all that equipment up (most of which will be for sale in the next five years).
Click to expand...

To make matters even worse, the prices to the distributors was the same as it was in 2019. Those distributors are not distributing to the normal channels. Only the select few that have access to the product are jacking up the prices and putting things up on gunbroker. Despite the fact that Vista has been producing more ammo than in any previous year, I have yet to see (or hear) about any stores getting stock. They are pretty much going straight to gunbroker.

What this does is it cause those with access to the distributors to put in more and more orders as they can order more and more ammo for what they sell their current stock at. This is why you won't see any stock at your LGS except for inflated prices as they have to pay inflated prices. If you could order primers for $15 a box still and sell them on gunbroker for $200+, of course you would put in an order for billions of them. Ditto for Ammo. It won't let up at all till Vista starts charging them $50-100 per box. It will still be bad, but they might not be able to corner the market at those prices.

Perhaps once Vista raises it's prices, those in the middle won't make enough to keep placing endless orders. I'm still not sure 15% will be enough, but at the end of the day it's not a supply demand pricing issue if Vista is still selling at their original prices and it's only the distributors jacking up the prices.
 
IMtheNRA said:
Yeah, the moment he laid down this whopper, his credibility was gone.

Then, he proceeded to explain, in painstaking detail, how Vista is screwing the handloaders. That part, I found credible, but I already knew that.
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When "employees" become "workers," the Marxists have won.
 
CQB45ACP said:
Workers of the world unite!
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You have nothing to lose but your freedom...

I can see $6 overland diesel, $5 farming diesel, and $5-7 regular unleaded gasoline in the near future - but I'm willing to bet heating oil will be subsidized to the point that it falls in price. Likewise, IF ammo becomes available again, expect the Feds - every department from Ag to Parks to Transportation to the National Zoological Police (yes, there is such a thing) and every agency in between - ordering millions of rounds of common SD pistol/carbine/rifle ammo. The Fed's have buying power like no one else - all taxpayer funded - and they can tie up supply chains for a decade to starve the general public, then simply dispose of "old-stock" - also on the taxpayer's dime.

There is no law requiring Federal agencies to sell surplus ammunition to the public.
 
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