Next Quantum Leap???

Status
Not open for further replies.
Laser-pumped particle beams, which can accelerate mass (the particle beam)to 10-50% of light speed, while using the unique properties of each technology to bolster the other. The laser provides a neutrally charged environment for the particle beam to ride in while the particle beam offers a waveguide for the laser beam to minimize beam diffusion.
As a bonus, it would make a nifty visible beam when fired. Pew pew pew, Buck Rogers.
 
I always wondered if there would be an advantage to a hex shaped cartridge with a hex shaped bullet that used a hex shaped chamber to line up with hex shaped rifling to minimize bullet distortion when it hits the rifling with the purpose of improving accuracy... and speed... and lowering chamber pressure?

I always thought that caseless ammo would be best for Gatling guns in planes, choppers and vehicles. More ammo capacity with less weight and simpler mechanics since there wouldn't be a need to extract anything. The caseless ammo could be linked with paper or cellophane strips that would burn in the chamber.

Just thinking out loud.
 
I can see a railgun/coilgun set up someday. Very small projectiles accelerated to insane velocities. Imagine a .177 or smaller pellet moving a five or six miles per second, made of some super strong material and what it could do.
 
What's the future?...................... I'm not trying to be a downer here, but it will probably be further restriction and regulation of the use of lead in ammunition with copper bullets and NT primers being the "norm." Upgraded barrel treatments to reduce copper fouling. Maybe by then enough enthusiasts can petition Ruger to cater to the public demand of a phased plasma rifle in the 40kw range, but it would still probably require the use of Remington Etronx primers.
 
I always wondered if there would be an advantage to a hex shaped cartridge with a hex shaped bullet that used a hex shaped chamber to line up with hex shaped rifling to minimize bullet distortion when it hits the rifling with the purpose of improving accuracy... and speed... and lowering chamber pressure?

That's not new. That existed, for cannon, during the American Civil War. British Whitworth shells looked like this:

5323387_1.jpg
 
I’d be pretty excited about a high pressure AR15 style gun that shoots a 300blk cartridge to 308 win velocities or slightly above even in a <16 barrel. Maybe uses 15 grains of powder.
 
Blasters. Fusion fuel cell powered blasters. That's the next quantum leap.
".....ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side." Han Solo
 
Galil5.56 wrote:
Wondering if we will ever see a true quantum leap as it relates to ammo performance anytime soon, and how?

The metallic case, explosive primer, propellant and projectile have been around for more than a hundred years because 1) it works under combat conditions, and 2) in spite of a lot of research, nothing else has come along that offers enough of an advantage to supplant it.

What ultimately does supplant the current ammunition system will likely be based on a completely different paradigm and so difficult to predict today.

but can you imagine a rifle that say if proofed at 260,000 psi, has a working pressures at the stated 200,000 psi! Not sure what metallurgy could do this today,

First of all, simply increasing the pressure of the current cartridge paradigm is not revolutionary.

Second, 200,000 psi pressures will take us outside the scope of ferrous metallurgy and into the realm of exotic materials leading to a significant increase in cost for only an incremental increase in performance that would be sufficient to prohibit widespread adoption.

What have you thought along these lines?

In the near term, look for increased emphasis on cartridge cases made of non-strategic materials (plastics, inorganic waxes, etc.) and/or caseless ammunition once the perennial problem of leakage from the beach is sufficiently addressed.

In the longer term, look for the emergence of systems that don't rely on kinetic energy.
 
It was a blind alley in large-bore ordnance development. Is there any reason to think it would be better in smaller bores?

I think artillery shells have a copper ring around them that engage the rifling in the bore. I don't believe the artillery shell is actually deformed in the barrel of the artillery piece, just this copper ring is distorted.

A bullet when fired leaves the case and travels the free bore (hopefully some what straight) with a large amount of blow-by until it hits the lands of the rifling. When it hits the rifling it is deformed considerable, hopefully in a some what concentric and repeatable manner. Then the bullet travels down the rifle barrel which imparts a spin. The initial blow by of hot burning powder and gasses is going to heat the throat of the barrel. The friction of the bullet hitting and deforming is going to impart even more heat to the barrel. This heat and friction is what I believe is a major cause of barrel erosion.

Yes, I do seat my bullets for my target rifles long so they are just shy of contacting the lands. Yes this does seem to make a more accurate load by what I believe is the bullet hitting the lands in a more consistent manner and conforming to the rifling in a more repeatable way making the flight characteristics more uniform from bullet to bullet and help the bullets hit the target in a more consistent spot.

To me it stands to reason that a bullet that doesn't have any freebore, minimal to no deformation and almost no blow by will be more consistent in the bore of the rifle and after it leaves the barrel???? It also stands to reason, to me at least, that less deformation and less friction will result in a faster bullet from the same charge. I understand that when I seat my bullets long for my target loads that this will cause a higher chamber pressure. A hex bullet having no free bore and no blow-by seems like it would also translate to even higher pressures... so less powder would be used or a slower powder would be used to compensate. No blow-by or a more consistent minimal blow-by would also eliminate or reduce one variable in the ballistics of a bullet resulting in a more consistent bullet velocity and hence bullet path after it leaves the barrel.

To sum it up, my theory is a hex shaped bullet initially aligned in a hex shaped bore by a hex shaped case will be more accurate, capable of higher velocities, cause less barrel heat (and less barrel distortion from heat) and reduce throat erosion in my expensive target barrels.

This is just my theory so take it for what you will... but remember... you asked! :)

P.S. I have also considered steel cased cartridges ( an inch plus in diameter with VERY thick walls ) aligned to a chamber-less barrel via a hex recess in the breach of the barrel in which the hex tit on the end of the case aligns. The cartridge would be mounted to the barrel with a threaded retainer that goes over a shoulder cut on the external of the case then threads over external threading on the breach of the barrel. Not only would this eliminate the inconsistencies of a brass case from the ballistic equation but it would also allow the steel cases to be precision machined to very tight tolerances. What I would really love about a setup like this is the vast number of internal cartridge geometries that could be tested with a single barrel without having to cut custom chambers in the barrel. But, again, just more theorizing... take it for what it is worth.

OK, maybe there are no great leaps of improvement to be made here... but I would be ecstatic with a couple millimeters of improvement! :) Would you like to ask me how I would make barrels more accurate?
 
Last edited:
Problems with rifled-to-match projectiles, such as the Whitworth, include:
  • Each projectile has to be precision machined. Currently, projectiles just have to be concentric and have a generally consistent ogive and base... all the shaping to engage the rifling is done in the barrel. That's not a bug, that's a feature. The rifling will "machine" each bullet in substantially the same way, ensuring consistency. Look at the cost of the non-rifled, machine mono-metal bullets... then multiply that many times to reflect the far more complex and exacting machining required for a pre-rifled projectile. Costs of multiple dollars per projectile would be nearly certain. Perhaps around the cost of high-quality golf balls, which run ~$45/dozen.
  • The rifling configuration - land shape, groove number, twist direction, twist rate - will all have to be precisely matched between bullet and barrel. If a bullet maker stops making your desired twist/rifling/shape bullet, your gun (or at least your barrel) is now garbage. And forget about gain-twist!
  • The first two points are about practicality/usability. Worse, those pragmatic costs wouldn't buy anything worthwhile. Lousy performance is likely. Those ridges and bumps introduce turbulence and drag.
Again, this concept was abandoned in large-scale ordinance. A simple, cylindrical obdurating/engraved driving band was found better. In smaller bores, the whole parallel surface of the projectile can act as the driving band, and CW is that this bearing surface is good for accuracy - more is often thought to be better.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top