NICS denial appeals still suspended?

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Ryanxia

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A friend received a wrongful NICS denial (has purchased guns before, not prohibited, etc.) and is about to send in an appeal. I seem to recall there being a situation where they said they were "too busy" to process appeals.

Is that still the case?
Are they 100% not processing appeals?
Or am I mistaken?

He has already requested the reason for his denial and (according to him) received a generic letter of why he might have been denied, none of which he believes he falls under.
 
Interesting. Certainly is a lot to do for someone just trying to get his own gun back (he had some work done on it so was logged in).
 
Were I in his shoes, I'd file the appeal. Maybe they're too busy, maybe not, but they're certainly not going to take action if he doesn't.
 
Also, if he does eventually decide to go to court, he can't really complain that the ATF has never processed the appeal he never filed.

(another thought, if he has any gun friendly congresscritters - file the appeal, and if it hangs ask the congressperson for help. I've known folks who had good results from that for other agencies)
 
Thanks guys. There's no question he's going to file the appeal, I was just curious where it stood. If they aren't doing any at all, if they are doing "some" or what the deal is currently.
 
Sorry if I missed something in this, but I didn't see where he was just trying to get his own gun back. As far as I know if it is already your gun and was just in for repair there is no 4473 required. The exception being if a part being replaced has the serial number on it, am I wrong about this?
 
Sorry if I missed something in this, but I didn't see where he was just trying to get his own gun back. As far as I know if it is already your gun and was just in for repair there is no 4473 required. The exception being if a part being replaced has the serial number on it, am I wrong about this?
If they take it for longer than 24 hours I believe they have to log it in maybe? I'm not sure but either way it got logged in whether it needed to or not.

And regardless, if he's going to get denied on future purchases he wants to get it cleared up.
 
Sorry if I missed something in this, but I didn't see where he was just trying to get his own gun back. As far as I know if it is already your gun and was just in for repair there is no 4473 required. The exception being if a part being replaced has the serial number on it, am I wrong about this?

If they take it for longer than 24 hours I believe they have to log it in maybe? I'm not sure but either way it got logged in whether it needed to or not.

And regardless, if he's going to get denied on future purchases he wants to get it cleared up.

A gun taken in for gunsmithing does have to be logged, but doesn't require NICS or a 4473 for return. A new serial number does require special handling, but I don't remember exactly what or whether that's California or Federal law.

A gun placed on consignment and then returned to it's original owner does require NICS and a 4473.
 
A gun taken in for gunsmithing does have to be logged, but doesn't require NICS or a 4473 for return.

That is certainly correct. I have done that many times while leaving a gun for repair, even while out of state.
 
Does anyone know of any negative consequences for simply laying payment for the gun on the counter and walking out with it when improperly denied? Is there some law you would be violating?
 
Does anyone know of any negative consequences for simply laying payment for the gun on the counter and walking out with it when improperly denied? Is there some law you would be violating?
Yes, the Brady Bill. Plus no dealer in his right mind would release the gun to someone denied by NICS.
 
Yes. Trick. The mind explodes! As Terry keeps telling me, " It's only the Internet." Truth

This has to be a trick question.


Trick question or not, I didn't see it as an invitation for the pompous to come out to play.

In response to the original question, I'd file a lawsuit if I were denied an appeal. I know I'm not a NICS denial, though.
 
In response to the original question, I'd file a lawsuit if I were denied an appeal. I know I'm not a NICS denial, though.

Thanks but I really just wanted to know if the appeals process is suspended like I've heard. I read some articles here and there but haven't known anyone personally that had it happen so now I'm more curious.
 
Does anyone know of any negative consequences for simply laying payment for the gun on the counter and walking out with it when improperly denied? Is there some law you would be violating?
Negative consequences for whom? The FFL or the proposed buyer? I'd say yes to one, the other, or both, depending on the circumstances.
Congress said:
(t)(1) Beginning on the date that is 30 days after the Attorney General notifies licensees under section 103(d) of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act that the national instant criminal background check system is established, a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer shall not transfer a firearm to any other person who is not licensed under this chapter, unless--
(A) before the completion of the transfer, the licensee contacts the national instant criminal background check system established under section 103 of that Act;
(B)(i) the system provides the licensee with a unique identification number; or(ii) 3 business days (meaning a day on which State offices are open) have elapsed since the licensee contacted the system, and the system has not notified the licensee that the receipt of a firearm by such other person would violate subsection (g) or (n) of this section; and
(C) the transferor has verified the identity of the transferee by examining a valid identification document (as defined in section 1028(d) of this title) of the transferee containing a photograph of the transferee.

(2) If receipt of a firearm would not violate subsection (g) or (n) or State law, the system shall--(A) assign a unique identification number to the transfer;(B) provide the licensee with the number; and(C) destroy all records of the system with respect to the call (other than the identifying number and the date the number was assigned) and all records of the system relating to the person or the transfer. . . . .

(4) If the national instant criminal background check system notifies the licensee that the information available to the system does not demonstrate that the receipt of a firearm by such other person would violate subsection (g) or (n) or State law, and the licensee transfers a firearm to such other person, the licensee shall include in the record of the transfer the unique identification number provided by the system with respect to the transfer.
(5) If the licensee knowingly transfers a firearm to such other person and knowingly fails to comply with paragraph (1) of this subsection with respect to the transfer and, at the time such other person most recently proposed the transfer, the national instant criminal background check system was operating and information was available to the system demonstrating that receipt of a firearm by such other person would violate subsection (g) or (n) of this section or State law, the Attorney General may, after notice and opportunity for a hearing, suspend for not more than 6 months or revoke any license issued to the licensee under section 923, and may impose on the licensee a civil fine of not more than $5,000.
(6) Neither a local government nor an employee of the Federal Government or of any State or local government, responsible for providing information to the national instant criminal background check system shall be liable in an action at law for damages--(A) for failure to prevent the sale or transfer of a firearm to a person whose receipt or possession of the firearm is unlawful under this section; or(B) for preventing such a sale or transfer to a person who may lawfully receive or possess a firearm.

(u) It shall be unlawful for a person to steal or unlawfully take or carry away from the person or the premises of a person who is licensed to engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, any firearm in the licensee's business inventory that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce.

18 U.S.C.A. § 922 (West)
I would also add that laying your money on the table doesn't mean that the FFL has accepted it. In addition to the Brady Bill violation, you (the proposed buyer) could be looking at theft charges. I don't know about other states, but in AR, theft of a firearm is a felony.
Arkansas General Assembly said:
(2) Class C felony if:
(A) . . . .
(C) The property is a firearm valued at two thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500) or more; . . . .
(3) Class D felony if:
(A) . . . .
(B) The property is a firearm valued at less than two thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500);

Ark. Code Ann. § 5-36-103 (West))
 
Thanks but I really just wanted to know if the appeals process is suspended like I've heard. I read some articles here and there but haven't known anyone personally that had it happen so now I'm more curious.
Ironically I was in a gun store this afternoon where another customer was purchasing his first handgun since being wrongly denied just over a year ago, he now has a UPIN (he was proceeded). When I was wrongly denied in 2011 I appealed it on March 18, 2011, the appeal was upheld May 20, it took 2 months to resolve.

Sadly, the trajectory doesn't look too good for present day appellants.
 
Ironically I was in a gun store this afternoon where another customer was purchasing his first handgun since being wrongly denied just over a year ago, he now has a UPIN (he was proceeded). When I was wrongly denied in 2011 I appealed it on March 18, 2011, the appeal was upheld May 20, it took 2 months to resolve.

Sadly, the trajectory doesn't look too good for present day appellants.

I did mention to him (since I hardly see him) that if/when he gets it straightened out he can setup a UPIN. He said he does not fill out his social security # but never has in the past either and got proceeds. I don't fill it out either and would sooner setup a UPIN if the issue arose for me.
 
The dangerous reality is they never tell you why you are denied. My bro-in-law bought a rifle awhile back and was delayed 3 days. He is squeaky clean as the Fire Marshall for a major university has to be. My brother is now delayed 3 days every time he buys a gun, but they never tell him why. He is a decorated veteran and has purchased dozens of firearms over the years with no wait; why now does he haver to wait. We are forced to speculate as to why the Feds do what they do and they are never held to account.
 
I do not know if the FBI is currently processing appeals.

What I do know,

I was once delayed on the purchase of a firearm.

After three days, the dealer released the firearm to me, with no disposition.

The next day, the dealer called me and informed me that he received a disposition of 'denied'.

I returned the firearm, and he returned my money.

I filed an appeal, immediately, by fax so I had a transmission report, and by mail.

After a year of calling monthly to check on the status, I was finally told that if I attempted to purchase a firearm, I would likely be approved.

No reason why I was denied. No guarantee that I was not a prohibited person.

Since then I've purchased 'a few' firearms. I get refereed to a supervisor every time. If there is no supervisor available, I am delayed. Computerized LEEP has stopped that problem and I always get a proceed.
 
I would also add that laying your money on the table doesn't mean that the FFL has accepted it. In addition to the Brady Bill violation, you (the proposed buyer) could be looking at theft charges. I don't know about other states, but in AR, theft of a firearm is a felony.

An offer, acceptance, and transfer of consideration says otherwise. I'm not sure what your court system is like, but you will never receive a filing here under these circumstances. I'll guarantee, if you could somehow pull off a filing, you'll never get a conviction.
 
An offer, acceptance, and transfer of consideration says otherwise. I'm not sure what your court system is like, but you will never receive a filing here under these circumstances. I'll guarantee, if you could somehow pull off a filing, you'll never get a conviction.
You're joking, right? Until the background check is completed and the transfer approved, the gun is not the legal property of the buyer. The money has nothing to do with it. Whether you think otherwise is irrelevant. It's not a ladder or a loaf of bread. It's a Federally regulated item involved in a tightly regulated transaction.

To the OP, if there's a way to find out the reason for denial (which isn't easy in most cases), that's usually the easiest way to get it reversed. I was denied a couple of years ago and was able to figure out that it was a warrant for an "unpaid" expired-registration ticket. I was able to get it reversed the same day by taking the receipt showing that I had paid the ticket on-time to the court and taking the warrant release to the BCI (that's who does the background checks here in Utah). But either way, he needs to file an appeal and look into getting a UPIN if it's because he's conflicting with someone else's information. (I've since gotten a CFP which bypasses the normal background checks and they just check to see if the CFP is still valid)

Matt
 
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