Noobie Questions - BP Deer Rifle

[Smith357]

OK so After 30 years I finally found some 5000 acres of private land that I can hunt here in Ohio. Since OH is a Slug and BP state I have decided to go BP for that extra range if needed (though I doubt there will ever be more than a 75 yard shot).

I have always had a hankering for a Hawken Rifle and now is my chance to scratch that itch. But the last time I did any BP shooting was as a teen some 30 years ago with a Kit Gun that I built with my father, sadly that rifle was lost in a flood in the 80s. So I have a few basic questions.

1. As for caliber there are basically three choices .45 .50 and .54 but for medium sized Whitetails should I be leaning towards bigger is better or a .45 will do just fine with proper shot placement.

2. As far twist rates, is it safe to assume that the faster twist rates are for conicals and the 1:44 and 1:66 are for patched ball. And how well does patched ball work on deer?

3. Do the BP substitutes like Triple 7 work well or should I stick with BP and Pyrodex?

4. What brands should I not even bother to look at, and who builds a quality Hawken replica at a resonable price? I'm looking at a T/C Hawken as my goal, should I consdier something else?

5. Are there any other thing I have overlooked and need to know about?


Thanks

 

[mykeal]

1. As for caliber there are basically three choices .45 .50 and .54 but for medium sized Whitetails should I be leaning towards bigger is better or a .45 will do just fine with proper shot placement.

A .45 will produce a clean, one-shot kill in a whitetail with proper shot placement. A .50 gives you more room for error in placement. A .54 gives the most flexibility, and is preferred by yours truly.

2. As far twist rates, is it safe to assume that the faster twist rates are for conicals and the 1:44 and 1:66 are for patched ball. And how well does patched ball work on deer?

Your assumptions regarding rate of twist are correct; anything faster than 1:48, such as 1:22, favors a conical roung; anything slower, such as a 1:60 favors the patched round ball. 1:48 is a compromise that, with proper load development, can be used for either. BTW, patched round balls can be accurate and effective in faster twist barrels if the powder load is reduced. Conicals will not stabilize from the slower twist barrels, so no amount of powder will help. A patched round ball is very effective on whitetails up to 100 yards; beyond that the poor ballistics coefficient of the round ball becomes important, and accuracy and energy fall off dramatically.

3. Do the BP substitutes like Triple 7 work well or should I stick with BP and Pyrodex?

BP substitutes can work well, but you must redevelop the load to find the most accurate. Just assuming a certain percentage increase or reduction in velocity is correct, but it does not necessarily apply to accuracy.

4. What brands should I not even bother to look at, and who builds a quality Hawken replica at a resonable price? I'm looking at a T/C Hawken as my goal, should I consdier something else?

Absolutely consider the Lyman Great Plains. I have 4 T/C Hawkens and 2 Lyman GPR's. Both are great guns. I like the Lyman a bit better. A bit further down the scale are the Dixie Gun Works Investarms Hawkens and Traditions rifles. Pedersoli makes some great ones too, but I have no experience with them; they are very pricey, so for the money, it's a Lyman GPR for me.

5. Are there any other thing I have overlooked and need to know about?

Lots of stuff, perhaps, but you've hit the high spots.

 

[messerist]

I hunt with a .50 cal. Lyman's Great Plains Rifle. It is a flintlock and I use a .490 patched round ball with 90 grs ffg black powder and a little ffffg for priming the pan. With the exception of the years I was overseas and the few where I never had a shot, I have taken everything from a little spike buck to a 12 pt monster. No complaints but alot of practice to make the flint work for me. I really love hunting with the flintlock and will never use anything else. My two-cents. Good luck on what you decide and good hunting.

p.s. Mykeal beat me to the punch on the GPR. Listen to the man. He knows his blackpowder, and definitely is one of the "go-to-guys" on this forum for any questions.

 

[StrawHat]

Smith357 OK so After 30 years I finally found some 5000 acres of private land that I can hunt here in Ohio. Since OH is a Slug and BP state I have decided to go BP for that extra range if needed (though I doubt there will ever be more than a 75 yard shot).

Nice bit of acreage. You will find black powder to do all you need for hunting. Anywhere.

Smith357 1. As for caliber there are basically three choices .45 .50 and .54 but for medium sized Whitetails should I be leaning towards bigger is better or a .45 will do just fine with proper shot placement.

I lean toward the bigger is better and believe 50 is the minimum for deer. I have shot deer with the 45 and with a 40 but the 50 and bigger provide greater knockdown and quicker kills. My go to rifle is a 58 flintlock.

Smith357 2. As far twist rates, is it safe to assume that the faster twist rates are for conicals and the 1:44 and 1:66 are for patched ball. And how well does patched ball work on deer?

PRB is excellent for any game.

Smith357 3. Do the BP substitutes like Triple 7 work well or should I stick with BP and Pyrodex?

In percussion guns I have heard they work well.

Smith357 4. What brands should I not even bother to look at, and who builds a quality Hawken replica at a resonable price? I'm looking at a T/C Hawken as my goal, should I consdier something else?

For a Hawken styled rifle, the rifle sold by Lyman was one of the better ones and designed by an Ohio gunsmith.

Smith357 5. Are there any other thing I have overlooked and need to know about?

Practice from field positions until you can keep your shots on a paper plate. Start close and keep extending the range as you get proficient. This will help you determine your effective range.

Smith357 Thanks

Welcome and good luck

 

[arcticap]

OK so After 30 years I finally found some 5000 acres of private land that I can hunt here in Ohio. Since OH is a Slug and BP state I have decided to go BP for that extra range if needed (though I doubt there will ever be more than a 75 yard shot)...

...5. Are there any other thing I have overlooked and need to know about?

It's hard to match the accuracy, range & knock down power of a shotgun slug with patched round balls, especially slugs fired from a rifled barrel or using a rifled choke tube. The .54 round ball comes the closest to performing as well as a shotgun slug.

And the side lock muzzle loader really doesn't provide any extra range over a shotgun. An inline muzzle loader would provide the most extra range that can truely better the performance of a shotgun.
Even if the side lock muzzle loader and shotgun were to have the same effective range, the shotgun usually offers a much quicker follow up shot and can be rigged with a scope. So there's really no advantage to using a side lock muzzle loader. Except only that an inline muzzle loader can usually be counted on to offer longer range performance.
A medium twist muzzle loader firing a heavy hunting PRB load is more akin to shooting a very accurate smoothbore shotgun, or a smoothbore shotgun with a rifled choke tube installed.
Depending on the ammunition and particular details of each type of gun & ammo, that's my conclusion.
High powered black powder hunting loads just aren't always reliably accurate shooting patched round balls, at least not without having a slow twist. I know someone that used to hunt with a slow twist GPR and his effective range was about 70 yards. A single shot H&R shotgun with a rifled barrel can often shoot better than that, plus it can have a scope mounted on it.
And the longer barreled muzzle loaders are heavier and don't handle as well in the field as the inlines or most shotguns do.