carlrodd said:
fringe group ideologues formed the nation. and most of them were terribly rational. great argument.
Fringe group ideologues who were just about comparably equipped (though not as numerous or as well trained) to their adversaries (who were an entire ocean away), with the aid of another powerful nation which was at war with said adversaries at the same time.
Now try fighting an adversary who is HERE, and is more heavily equipped than any group of J(oe/ane) Average Gun Owner could hope to be without being seven kinds of independently wealthy and well-connected, better trained than the majority of us could hope to be, with little or no outside support, and not (apparently) a significantly large portion of the populace on your side of the fight. You lose. Fedgov 2, Secession 0.
I don't mean to sound like a jerkwad, but we have to fight by the rules, because if we fight by the rules, we have, what, 535 people to contend with in the US Congress? If we try to play dirty, sneakin' out the back, takin' our collective ball and going home to form the United Territories or somesuch, well, those 500-odd folk in congress have about 1.4 million friends (wikipedia stat of number of active servicefolks in our armed forces) at the nation's disposal with which to respond, loudly and angrily, and.. uh.. boomily.
~GnSx
(this is not to make any assumptions about the activities of servicemen or anything when faced with the decision to shoot at seceding ex-US Citizens, or anything, I'm just saying that the time for effective civilian uprising against the government is somewhat past, considering the vast disparity of force available to the citizens and the government.