Obama: Ban all semi-automatics

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I couldn't stand to read the whole thread...

Did anyone suggest voting for him or Hillary out of protest over the Republican candidates only being 95% on our side?

It's pretty sad that the consistent strategy fielded by the Democrats has turned into "vote for anyone but a republican."
 
It seems to me like the government has strayed away from treating us like adults, and gotten into the habit of thinking of us as little kids who needed to be protected "for their own good". I tired of this nanny bs, the left wants the government to be my mommy(Stop playing with that, you'll put your eye out!), and the right wants to be my daddy(Now son this will hurt me more than it hurts you, but it's for your own good).
 
I always found that amusing, consdering this was once the party of Pro-Jim Crow laws

Well, the GOP was once the party of limited government. Things change, obviously.
 
The "You gotta vote GOP no matter how crappy the candidate!" line is based on exactly the same premise that Dems tells blacks that they MUST vote for them--fear.

This ISN'T the argument people are making. What people ARE saying is that given the particulars of THIS election casting a vote for someone who is guaranteed not to win to "make a statement" is ridiculous since it will likely cost gun owners most if not all of their rights.

Its not "vote GOP" its "lets do whats best for our rights".
 
This ISN'T the argument people are making. What people ARE saying is that given the particulars of THIS election casting a vote for someone who is guaranteed not to win to "make a statement" is ridiculous since it will likely cost gun owners most if not all of their rights.

Its not "vote GOP" its "lets do whats best for our rights".

Remember during the Nixon days many Republicans were all for gun control. You can never count on either party IMO.
 
So a question regarding the recent DC ruling in regards to future attempts at gun control.

I the SCotUS rules that the Parker decision be upheld, how would that affect any future attempts by any governing body (even one presided over by Obama) to restrict 2A rights?

Also, from what I heard a very big chunk of the Dems in both houses were voted in on pro RKBA platforms, would you trust them to keep thier word on this for the most part?
 
This ISN'T the argument people are making. What people ARE saying is that given the particulars of THIS election

Oh yeah--it's funny how every election just happens to be "THIS election": "The Supreme Court is up for grabs!". I've heard that for a quarter of a century, from libs and and conservatives.

The GOP could reform itself, but it has no incentive to do so if block voters brainlessly cast ballots for it regardless of whatever idiot is nominated. If it doesn't reform on its own, then a well-deserved few years in the electoral wilderness is the answer--then they can ponder how they utterly squandered the huge legacy they had from Ronald Reagan, and how they can get it back. Besides, if recent history is any guide, the GOP seems incapable of asserting its first principle UNLESS it first has to suffer minority status.

And please don't try to scare me with the "freedom will be forever dead by then!" argument. That has also historically proven to be BS.

I am not voting for scumbag I don't respect, period.
 
Did anyone suggest voting for him or Hillary out of protest over the Republican candidates only being 95% on our side?

...and which Republican candidates would those be, besides Fred Thompson, Ron Paul, Duncan Hunter & Tom Tancredo? I for one am rapidly tiring of being admonished that we should put blind faith in whoever has the R by his name, past record be d*mned. Personally, I don't trust someone like Giuliani, McCain or Romney to keep his nose out of my gun safe any more than I'd trust someone like Hillary or Barack Obama. And it's been said before that an anti Republican is more dangerous than an anti Democrat because it gives the gun-grabbers that bipartisan mandate that -- at least to some extent -- eludes them now.
And for a little Friday morning levity...I was looking at a picture of Mitt Romney yesterday, and thought, "you know who he looks like? A brown-haired Max Headroom..." :D
 
If it doesn't reform on its own, then a well-deserved few years in the electoral wilderness is the answer--

You don't get it. Its not a few well deserved years, its a non-sunsetting AWB. Its the registration of all semi auto handguns. You can send the biggest message you like to the republican party but after a few years they will be back in power, but american gun owners will be screwed.
 
Anyone who wants to "stay the course" or wants more troops in Iraq is not going to win. As far as I know, only one Republican candidate doesn't want to "stay the course."

But, apparently the Repubs have forgotten why they were punished in the last elections, and will continue to be punished. This is bad news for gunnies.

I believe that you, much like the Dems, mis-read the message. They did not get an anti-war mandate. They got a "conservatives are fed up with big-spending, corrupt and pro-illegal immigration RINOs" mandate.

The reason that polls on the war come out so negative is:
Most (D)s do not support the war... period.
Many (R)s believe that we are going about it all wrong.
Thirty per cent think we are doing it just right.

Fred Thompson is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations. *This extremely important and powerful insider Establishment foreign policy and media think tank has long been linked to internationalism, global government, the New World Order, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council...eign_Relations

Please, do not quote Wiki as an authoratative source. You do know that Wiki is written by it's readers, right? No potential for disinformation there...:rolleyes:
 
STAGE 2 said:
You don't get it. Its not a few well deserved years, its a non-sunsetting AWB. Its the registration of all semi auto handguns. You can send the biggest message you like to the republican party but after a few years they will be back in power, but american gun owners will be screwed.

Boy, you've really gotten used to the federal-level Republicans doing nothing more than holding the line against gun control, haven't you? :(

Over the past half-dozen years, congressional Democrats have been afraid to push gun control in DC in any significant way, and with control of the Executive and Legislative branches Republicans still haven't been able to roll anything back.
 
Over the past half-dozen years, congressional Democrats have been afraid to push gun control in DC in any significant way, and with control of the Executive and Legislative branches Republicans still haven't been able to roll anything back.

And so you're willing to give the dems complete control of government on the chance that things are going to stay in a deadlock? We have the most anti gun congress and the possibility of having the most anti gun president to ever occupy the whitehouse and you're going to throw things to chance?
 
And so you're willing to give the dems complete control of government on the chance that things are going to stay in a deadlock? We have the most anti gun congress and the possibility of having the most anti gun president to ever occupy the whitehouse and you're going to throw things to chance?

We have the most antigun congress ever? Hyperbole? Potentially the most antigun president ever? More Hyperbole?

I don't think actually rolling back gun control laws is all that unobtainable, given properly motivated politicians - do you?

Edit: You and I have been through this before, so I'm not going to bother inconveniencing any more electrons debating it with you.
 
Hmmm, given a choice between R's, who do nothing to rollback existing gun control laws but don't erode my rights or do I vote for D's who are actively and agressively trying to further curtail my 2A rights.

I think I'll vote for the R's. Clinton and Obama will sign anything piece of Gun Control legislation a D controlled Congress will send them. Mitt or Rudy may at least think twice and listen to other R's who tell them there committing political suicide (didn't Mitt just recently become a life member of the NRA ??? Why do yoiu think he did that ??? Do you really think he'd now sign any GC legislation ???)
 
Better to lose with a man of principle than "win" with another set of neocons.

And frankly, a Dem president and Repub congress was better than the past 7 years. At least back then "separation of powers" meant something.
 
You don't get it. Its not a few well deserved years, its a non-sunsetting AWB. Its the registration of all semi auto handguns. You can send the biggest message you like to the republican party but after a few years they will be back in power, but american gun owners will be screwed.

Actually I get it completely--I just refuse to be used like a $20 crack whore.

That "non-sunsetting AWB" you mention--that would be a law, right? Which means if the Dems passed it, and got a Dem President to sign it, then these great Republicans you are touting to us could, when they recaptured Congress and the White House, repeal that law just as easily as it was passed--right?

Unless, of course, deep down you fear they have become a bunch of moral cowards who,in large part, don't really support the 2A, like that pathetic sack of crap in the White House right now. Is that it?

The bottom line is this--if Republicans get run out of DC, it is no permanent loss to the 2A, despite the scare tactics of their shills here--unless the Repubs remain the gutless, big government-loving cowards they are now. And the only way to cure THAT is to send them to the frickin' electoral woodshed--rewarding their horrific record with a no-questions-asked vote is exactly the WRONG message to send them.

But be my guest if, with your vote, you want to endorse the War on the Constitution the GOP has embraced these past several years.

I will vote for Ron Paul in the primary, and I could see voting for Fred Thompson in a general election--but there is absolutely no way in ten hells I am voting for McCain, Guiliani or Romney EVER, so go try to scare somebody else if any of those bozos turns out to be "your man".
 
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coltrane679;
I am not voting for scumbag I don't respect, period.

THANK YOU!!

I said it before, and I will say it again. A vote for your conscience is NEVER wasted. It is the vote NOT CAST that is wasted.

I believe that it is those people who do not vote that has turned our two party system into a ONE party system that has two sides that use different lies. The line between the parties has faded, and it is blurry at best, there is a lot of blending happening. Does the acronym RINO (Republican In Name Only) ring bells?

I propose that rather than arguing about who to vote for to keep from wasting a vote, we start writing letters to newspapers, making banners, talking to non-voting friends and co-workers, whatever your creativity and means will allow, to get them registered to vote, and then to VOTE. It is only then that we might get our country back.
 
Whats even scarier is that despite all these blatant warnings, some people are still going to waste their vote on Ron Paul or some other non existant candidate to "send a message" even though it means a Clinton or Obama presidency.

Well, we can elect Giuliani, but the result will be the same...kiss our guns goodbye.
 
I assume you're referring to guliani. If we are to take each man at their word then guliani would leave gun control up to the states while Obama would actively try and ban everything.

So against Obama we have a checklist referencing a comment he made. Against that, the mobster from NYC has a very long track record not merely of anti-gun comments but of lawsuits against the gun industry, support for the most draconian anti-gun laws in the nation, consistent disregard for civil rights of any kind AND to top it all creation and support for a ruthless plainclothes anti-gun cop unit THAT ACTUALLY WENT AROUND KILLING PEOPLE they suspected of packing!

I'll put it to you bluntly. If you support that New York scum because he has an R near his name, you are a selling out the RKBA and all civil liberties for the sake of stale partisan loyalty. Giuliani would be the most dangerous President in generations. A Clinton I can live through. I've done it before, and come out alive on the other side. Obama I don't know so well but he hardly scares me. These mealy mouthed Dems are a devil we know. They're a devil we've fought before, and beaten. And we can beat them again. Guliani--a cunning, ruthless and stalwartly anti-gun east coast Republican--is not a devil any of us have had to deal with in the white house before. He's coming at sideways, hoping idiotic loyalty to the GOP and kowtowking to his superior fundraising will blind us to the fact that he's an enormous danger to us all.

Clinton and Obama will sign anything piece of Gun Control legislation a D controlled Congress will send them. Mitt or Rudy may at least think twice and listen to other R's who tell them there committing political suicide (didn't Mitt just recently become a life member of the NRA ??? Why do yoiu think he did that ??? Do you really think he'd now sign any GC legislation ???)

Don't be so sure. Mitt perhaps. He's not exactly pro RKBA but he's not Satan incarnate either. Guliani, OTOH, might as well have cloven feet. The dynamics are extremely dangerous. I've tried to explain this before, but I'll do it again becuase it's not sinking in.

Assuming the D's control both houses as they do now, the central problem for any Democratic President will be to get through the narrow gap of the Senate. This gap will work to block any legisliation that goes too far left--including any strong anti-gun legislation. In order to placate the Senate minority and get her nominees and other laws through, expect Clinton certainly and perhaps Obama to sell out their own anti-gun supporters in a heartbeat. They have bigger fish to fry.

Assuming the D's control both houses and Guliani is in the WH, the dynamics change completely. Giuliani has enough loyalty from the Senate GOP and is a cunning enough task master we cannot expect them to fight him. Certainly enough will kowtow for their own purposes to nullify their blocking power. This leaves Giuliani with a completely unfettered opportunity to move whatever anti-gun law through Congress that he wants to. His problem is going to be to placate the liberal House in order to get his anti-terror and foreign policy agenda through. In other words, HE MUST COMPROMISE LEFT, WHILE A HC WOULD HAVE TO COMPROMISE RIGHT. And who doubts that he would would sell us down river in a heartbeat to get some Patriot III passed as a compromise with the liberal Dems in the house.
 
^couldn't have said it better myself. I'd MUCH rather have an anti-gun Dem in the White House than an anti-gun Rep. The vast majority of Republicans in congress don't have the balls to stand up to a Republican president (as the last 6 years have shown), especially since they'd frame a gun-grab as being in the interest of national security, or having to do with stopping terrorists. I can hear the Sean Hannitys of the world now: "we're gonna have another terrorist attack because a few gun owners so selfish that they'd destroy America to keep their hobby." And, I'm sure he'd throw in a "WE MUST DEFEAT YOU" or two for good measure

Why, in an age where we're discussing news minutes after stories break, has there been no discussion of Paul Helmke's speech to the National Press Club last week. When asked about the current presidential candidates, he said that all of the front-runners are pretty good (meaning bad for us). Why are so many people here telling me to vote for candidates that Paul Helmke likes???

Romney, McCain, and especially Guiliani will NEVER get my vote in any election.
 
Two words. RON. PAUL.

Alot of today's political coverage is based on sensationalism. Oooooh, a woman is running for President. Oooooh, a black man is running for President. Yeah, that's great. Unfortunately, they would like to turn the U.S. into the North American half of Western Europe.

How's this for sensational: Oooooh, a man that might actually take the words "protect and defend the Constitution" seriously is running.

Tell all your friends about Dr. Paul. He is what our country desperately needs.
A Clinton in the White House. Never again.
 
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