Old Technology Powders like W231

[Dudedog]

So I loaded up several small sample batches to test for this weekend and while the w231 does meter well using Silhouette most recently the Silhouette meters like water. Both are waaaaaaayyy better than the Unique that I used mostly.

I think almost all other pistol powders meter better than Unique.
I have never used 800X but I have seen reports that it meters worse than Unique.

Unique does meter ok for me in larger charges, and while it shoots well I just don't like the metering hassle when other powders that work as well for me meter better. Also most other pistol powders are cleaner IMO.

 

[ljnowell]

I think almost all other pistol powders meter better than Unique.

I have never used 800X but I have seen reports that it meter worse than Unique.



Unique does meter ok for me in larger charges, and while it shoots well I just don't like the metering hassle when other powders that work as well for me meter better. Also most other pistol powders are cleaner IMO.

The only two I can think of are 800x and 700x. Red dot and promo are t the best either.

 

[ColoradoShooter77]

I weigh every charge on a scale, I'm old school, so the metering issue is irrelevant to me.

 

[orionengnr]

If you have access to W-231 at a reasonable price, grab it.

 

[bluetopper]

"Winchester 231 certainly has been hard to get. The plant that makes Winchester powders does not want to make 231 as well as a few other powders. These older technology powders have different chemistry than the new powders and this older chemistry makes it much slower to make powder: basically, you can make about 2.5 times as many pounds of new chemistry powder in the time it takes to make 1 pound of old chemistry powder. During the process of making the old powders, the waste stream created is huge compared to the waste stream of the new chemistry powders. Chemical waste is very expensive to get rid of. So, the plant wants to phase out the old chemistry powders and replace them with new chemistry powders. While they are still making 231, the amount is being reduced and the amount of new powder such as Titegroup and Longshot is being increased.
Now, we are kind of stuck in the middle. The market is demanding 231 but the maker is not wanting to produce the powder. The result is, over time, 231 is going to go away. Shooters should begin using other powders as they can.
Mike Daly
Hodgdon Family of Fine Propellants
Hodgdon Smokeless Powder
IMR Powder Company
Winchester Smokeless Propellants

 

[Gravedigger56]

I would NEVER pass up a bottle of W231 or HP-38!!

 

[Hangingrock]

So, the plant wants to phase out the old chemistry powders and replace them with new chemistry powders. While they are still making 231, the amount is being reduced and the amount of new powder such as Titegroup and Longshot is being increased.Now, we are kind of stuck in the middle. The market is demanding 231 but the maker is not wanting to produce the powder. The result is, over time, 231 is going to go away. Shooters should begin using other powders as they can.

A producer/manufacture passes the cost with profit margin included to produce the product on to the consumer. At which point the consumer purchases the product. At some point the consumer decides if the product is worth the purchasing cost, if not the market share goes away and the manufacture no longer produces the product.

 

[kcofohio]

A producer/manufacture passes the cost with profit margin included to produce the product on to the consumer. At which point the consumer purchases the product. At some point the consumer decides if the product is worth the purchasing cost, if not the market share goes away and the manufacture no longer produces the product.

I agree. But right now it is hard to gage the market share, as for a variety pistol powders being on the shelves is still hit and miss. Once consumers are able to select their powder of choice, then the market can have a gage to correctly go by.

Below are some pricing of similar powders taken from Powder Valley. They are one of the more constant fair pricing across the board. All pricing is taken from the largest marketed jugs and figured by pound.

HP-38.........$15.89/lb.
W231.........$16.72/lb.
Titegroup....$15.97/lb.
Clays..........$16.58/lb.
Bullseye......$14.94/lb.
Red Dot......$15.22/lb.
AA #2.........$16.65/lb.
Zip.............$18.06/lb.

It just seems to be that the older powders pricing is less than the newer powders.

 

[X-Ring]

A producer/manufacture passes the cost with profit margin included to produce the product on to the consumer. At which point the consumer purchases the product. At some point the consumer decides if the product is worth the purchasing cost, if not the market share goes away and the manufacture no longer produces the product.

This it true with most manufactures that sell products to the public. Not so much with the military industrial complex. The small profit made selling powder to reloaders is of little consequence to them. If they don’t want to produce a product, they just don’t. Unless the government tells them they must in order to secure that multi billon dollar contract for building the navy’s ships.

 

[gunfighter48]

I'm just getting back to reloading after a 15 year break. I found 2 1lb bottles of Unique still unopened. I had packed them away 15 years ago! I used Unique for 12 years in my 45ACP and 45 Colt loads. I also picked up 1lb bottles of Autocomp, W231, Universal, Titegroup, and CFE Pistol powder. I want to do a some experimentation and try some new powders. I used Titegroup in my 45 Colt cowboy loads and really liked it. I can't find Unique for sale anywhere that I've checked. But I have enough powder to last me a couple of years and then some!!

 

[Toprudder]

The only two I can think of are 800x and 700x. Red dot and promo are t the best either.

To me, Red Dot is just a little better than 700x, but I can get both of them to meter +/- 0.1gn on my Dillon measure using the aquarium pump trick. 800x, on the other hand, the absolute best I can do is about +/- 0.25gn. I will use my 800x up, using my Chargemaster to measure, then I don't think I will be buying any more.

 

[salpal48]

I must Be missing something. i have been using w 231 for many, many years. i must be in a time Warp. when did it become Old.