Open Carry experiment in progress

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bobs1066

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As many of you know, our *^*&^ governor vetoed a CCW bill for Kansas last week. Open carry is supposed to be legal except where prohibited by local ordinance.
I'm sending letters today to the sherrif of Johnson County and the police chiefs of Lenexa, Overland Park, Olatha and Shawnee to see if open carry is legal in their jurisdictions. I'll post the replies I get.
Depending on the answers, I may strap on the hawg leg & go strolling about.
 
Well if you find yourself down in Wichita, keep the piece in the trunk (or just CCW it ... its only a misdemeanor if you happen to get caught by a cop that cares ... I was robbed one night when I lived there and told the cop "This makes me want to start carrying a gun!" His response; "You Should!").

The RINO's that run the city (in particular the former RINO Mayor Bob Knight ... who wanted to be yet another RINO Governor) outlawed open carry several years ago :fire:
 
Here ya go bobs1066

http://www.wichita.gov/CityCode/Default.htm?code=1487

Section 5.88.010 Unlawful use of weapons.

use of a weapon is knowingly:
manufacturing, purchasing, possessing or carrying ...
any pistol, revolver or other firearm concealed on one's person except when on one's land or in one's abode or fixed place of business;
on one's person any unconcealed, loaded firearm, except when on one's land or in one's abode or fixed place of business;
in any vehicle under one's immediate control, any loaded firearm, except when on one's land or in one's abode or fixed place of business;
Click to expand...

Its all in the first section.
 
Good luck I hope you actually hear back from them. If you don't get a response from the the police try the district atttorneys office.
 
Indiana

In Indiana open carry is legal with the issueance of a "liscense to carry" permit. Concealed is not on the permit. Some local jurisdictions in recent past have ordinances prohibiting such though I do not know of this being tested as yet.
What I am told by LEOs is rank and file support RKBA. FOP in Indy may soon go the way of the fossilized animal species "internal to city conflicts". Open carry so far has never caused alarm. It has produced a comment "do you know your hammer is back?" and that is how a 1911 goes through life.
I have open carried many different places in and around Indpls. Skated on the canal downtown with IWB in SOB. Walked throughout the surrounding city unmolested. The panhandlers under breath say "don't shoot me" but they find new places to congregate asking for smokes and a dollar. In this I do not mean those destitute in need people. But those who look healthy enough to get the labor job they are dressed for.
Indiana respects and honors the carry liscense of any state and some other countries. I have heard of some depts in the area being more inacurate with regard to common sense but not in this context.
Good luck in your learning experiences.
Pass the word. BOR of the US constitution is still under attack. The people should know.

oh yeah 'bump'
 
This is key:

any unconcealed, loaded firearm
Click to expand...

If you strap on a gun for open carry, it better be unloaded. I don't know if the law states how the ammo is to be kept, so you may want to get clarity on that. Speed loaders or loaded mags may or may not be okay on your person.

Thin Ice....dunno if it's worth it. Especially after teh veto, anti-orientated people and police will bring the hammer down since it's in the spot light.

Over here in MO, I am still waiting on our CCW status, and am not carrying a gun in my vehicle. I don't feel like being the first test case of a bored cop/lawyer/etc...

sucks, but watch your six.
 
In Indiana open carry is legal with the issueance of a "liscense to carry" permit.
Click to expand...

WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!

ONLY CONCEALED CARRY IS LEGAL IN INDIANA.

OPEN CARRY IS "RECKLESS ENDANGERMENT--BRANDISHING A WEAPON."

DO NOT DO IT.

"Concealed" means the holster or weapon must be covered by clothing, or must be inside the waistband--butt showing is okay.

ANYONE on duty or in uniform for the job, including a black T-shirt that says, "SECURITY" may carry openly.

But private citizens MUST conceal the weapon.

We also have state pre-emption. NO local jurisdiction can change the law.

If you've been carrying openly, you've lucked out with good cops. As far as carrying goes "Good cops" means most Indiana cops--I've never been asked for my license and my "conceal" is pretty obvious.

Sorry, ghobrien, but you've gotten some VERY INACCURATE information from somewhere.
 
ONLY CONCEALED CARRY IS LEGAL IN INDIANA.

OPEN CARRY IS "RECKLESS ENDANGERMENT--BRANDISHING A WEAPON
Click to expand...

I'd like to see the legal text of that law. I've never heard of an exposed firearm secured in a holster as being reckless. You probably know as well as I do that an Indiana License to Carry does not specify how a firearm is to be carried. And as far as I know, anything not specifically prohibited, is permitted.


BTW, I loved Freehold.
 
Open or concealed carry is legal In Indiana.

Back your statement up because I did not know until I did research. I trust my sources on this. The state preemption is contested with local laws in the gary / lake co areas.
I have looked in 100s of places for any reason open carry is not legal.
http://www.in.gov/isp/firearms/Firearms_Laws_03.pdf
This website works for everyone much better when facts are used. Before you claim how wrong something stated here actualy is you might do the research. Ask a lawyer or Prosecuter. If you are an Indiana LEO maybe a question to a senior in your dept or co/city counterpart would be in order.
Ask an ISP for the fact.
I was trying to relate what is current in Indiana. This thread is about Kansas. Do you realise how rude mucking this thread up is?
 
Responses so far: Open carry is illegal in Lenexa.

This is the text of a letter I got from the Overland Park police:

Dear Mr. Smith

On April 23, 2004, your letter was received in the office of the Chief of Poice. Your letter asked, “Is the open carry of a holstered firearm illegal in Overland Park?†The answer is: It is not a violation of the carry a concealed weapon law, but it could easily violate the Disorderly Conduct Ordinance.

You may view the Disorderly Conduct Ordinance by going to out Web Sire opkansas.oreg, click on Law, click on Municipal Code and click on Municipal Code Live Version, use the search box and type in Disorderly Conduct. You can look at any ordinance the same way by typing in a word that is associated with your interest.

It is certainly reasonable to believe that if a person with a holstered firearm was in public in Overland Park the police would most likely be called. It is advisable not to carry a weapon ("not to carry a weapon" was in bold-face type in the letter) in this city even in a holster that is in plain view.

If you would like to discuss this further, please contact me by phone or email. My telephone number is 913-327-6937 and my email is [email protected]

Sincerely,
(SIG)
James J. Weaver
Executive Officer
Police Administration
 
Well, the Overland Park web site has this to say about disorderly conduct:

11.28.040 Disorderly conduct.

"Disorderly conduct" is, with knowledge or probable cause to believe that such acts will alarm, anger or tend to provoke an assault or other breach of peace:

A. Engaging in brawling or fighting; or
B. Using obscene or abusive language; or
C. Engaging in noisy conduct which results in disturbing an assembly, meeting or procession not unlawful in its character; or
D. Engaging in conduct which results in harassment of another whose action is not unlawful in its character.

(History: KSA 21-4104; Ord. POC-625 §52, 72; POC-598 §47; PO-84 §14 & 31)
Click to expand...
My guess is that they'd try to charge you under point D, reasoning that your open carry is harassing the sheep, and that you committed the act of open carry with knowledge or probable cause to believe that your open carry would "alarm".
 
Seems to me that the letter from Mr. James J. Weaver qualifies as disorderly conduct under item D. It is not unlawful to open carry, Mr. Weaver is harassing you about it.
 
My email to Jim Weaver: -----Original Message-----

Jim,

I got your reply to my letter inquiring about the legality of open carry of a holstered firearm.

I've got a screen print of the ordinance about disorderly conduct in front of me & I don't understand how the peaceful exercise of legal behavior is going to "easily violate the Disorderly Conduct Ordinance".

Bob Smith

His response: Mr. Bob Smith,

From past experience citizens in Overland Park would fear a person who would be in public with a firearm and contact us to investigate the person. Officer(s) who would respond to such a citizen's call for service would approach an armed person in the most cautious manner using their training regarding an armed person.

Jim Weaver
Police Administration

Should I suggest that both the citizens and law enforcement officers need to be aware that the law permits the peaceful open carry of a firearm in Overland Park?
 
Should I suggest that both the citizens and law enforcement officers need to be aware that the law permits the peaceful open carry of a firearm in Overland Park?
Click to expand...
I would ask if there is any other lawful behavior you might engage in that could get you seen as a threat from officers, you do want to be fully informed.

- Gabe
 
"Disorderly conduct" is, with knowledge or probable cause to believe that such acts will alarm, anger or tend to provoke an assault or other breach of peace:

A. Engaging in brawling or fighting; or
B. Using obscene or abusive language; or
C. Engaging in noisy conduct which results in disturbing an assembly, meeting or procession not unlawful in its character; or
D. Engaging in conduct which results in harassment of another whose action is not unlawful in its character.

----
If this is the full text of the ordinance, you might be able to argue inclusio unius est exclusio alterus - that the list of conduct in A through D represents the ONLY list of conduct that can be classified as disorderly conduct. You can only be charged under this if these particular acts listed will alarm, anger, or provoke an assault or other breach of the peace.

Calling the cops on someone carrying openly would be a violation of "D" - because that call would result in the harassment of someone whose action (carrying openly) is not unlawful.
 
From past experience citizens in Overland Park would fear a person who would be in public with a firearm and contact us to investigate the person. Officer(s) who would respond to such a citizen's call for service would approach an armed person in the most cautious manner using their training regarding an armed person.

The only person engaging in disorderly conduct here would be the police officer doing a felony stop on someone who's obeying the law.

Notice he didn't answer your question as to how carrying openly would constitute disorderly conduct, just that you're going to be drawn upon if you try it?
 
Please be advised that Mr. Weaver's advice about unconcealed carry in Overland Park was incorrect. It was correct under state law, but failed to take into account a city ordinance, § 11.60.010 A 5 that makes it a crime to carry unconcealed in Overland Park except when on your own land or place of business.
 
open carry IS legal in Indiana as long as you have a permit. When I got my permit I specifically asked the Chief of Police about it and he said that because the license in Indiana is a "Handgun Permit", that both concealed and open carry are allowed. He did mention that cops could try to nail you with disturbing the peace, but that it was legally allowed.
 
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