Open site groups at 100 yards?

[JohnKSa]

Scopes improve visibility, reduce the requirements for visual acuity, eliminate the need to deal with multiple planes of focus and eliminate sight-radius concerns.

With sufficient sight-radius, good target visibility, good sights and a shooter with good visual acuity, the scope won't provide a significant advantage. Maybe none at all.

 

[CraigC]

True...the target itself plays major role.

Agreed and one that most shooters don't consider. The key is consistency and you need a target matched to your sights. One that you can consistently hold the same sight picture shot after shot. Which is why I use a 3" black square, rather than anything round, as my 25yd pistol target. It's perfectly bracketed against most front sights.

 

[R.W.Dale]

+2 on using a target matched to the front sight. I've found that a national match front post fits in a paper plate just perfect. I get my best results if I ignore how the front sight is centered in the aperture and just concentrate on what's going on with the target around the front sight post. At times this method has really paid off for me.

 

[_N4Z_]

With my M39 Mosins I like a 5-3/4" black circle on cardboard. Settle the top of the front sight blade at 6 o'clock, focus on front sight, steady squeeze of trigger. At 100 yards that black circle is about the same width as my blade.
Sometimes when the load is right, the action screws happy, the operator is on, and the planets are aligned, great things happen.

I've managed a few sub 2 inch 10 shot groups in "as issued" competition, no scopes allowed.

Here's one of my better results.




Now if I could just produce results like this all of the time.... But that would be boring now wouldn't it?

 

[Ridgerunner665]

Anytime open sights are mentioned the discussion quickly turns to eyesight (or the lack thereof)

20/20 eyesight isn't as important as most people think. For one thing, when aiming through open sights if the target is in sharp focus...you are doing it wrong. The only thing that should be in sharp focus is the front sight.

There is a guy over on MarlinOwners forum (Eli Chaps) that has explained this better than I can...I don't have his way with words but he is a fan of open sights and has explained their use in great detail.

Eli's threads...a good read
http://www.marlinowners.com/forums/index.php/topic,60482.0.html
http://www.marlinowners.com/forums/index.php/topic,64673.0.html


I cannot speak for bifocals...that may be a deal breaker for open sights, I don't know...never had the pleasure of wearing them. (I do wear glasses though...nearsighted)

Every time I post this pic it stirs discussion...Jerry Sharrett even joined THR just to send me a PM about it a couple months ago (turns out he lives near me)


There is not, and never has been, a scope on this rifle...I don't believe in scopes on lever actions. It wears a Skinner receiver mounted peep...

 

[chrome_austex]

With quality open sights, my favorite rifle, and a good sling, ~2 moa is a good group for me. My scoped groups are about the same.

For reference, Appleseed instructors will try to get you to shoot ~4 moa or better (with a sling).

-j

 

[chrome_austex]

Glock19Fan,

I've had much better results with at least my hand between the rifle and a hard rest. Something about the rifle sitting directly on a a hard rest doesn't work for me.

I think the forces between the rifle and the rest are just too sharp w/o some sort of sandbag or flesh buffer.

 

[HB]

I can get 1 to 1.5 inch groups at 100 slung prone with an AR-15 or Anschutz 1907

 

[Orlando]

To me 3 shots isnt a accurate example of a group. Fire 5 or more and see what you get.
M1A,Iron Sights, With surplus ammo 100yds


Kimber 82 ,Iron Sights 100yds 1 5/8 group

 

[CZguy]

Wow, you guys are better shots than me.

I'm having difficulty seeing well at 100 yards anymore, but here's one I shot with a M1 at 50 yards. (54 HRA, with a LMR barrel).

 

[TexasPatriot.308]

practice, practice,practice with what you shoot.. none of us that came out of basic training years ago shot any good til some good instruction and lots or rounds downrange...

 

[Jubjub]

This is about as good as I can do, on a cloudy bright day, from a bench, with an aperture on my glasses to sharpen up the sights. M38 Swede, S&B ammo.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Every once in awhile I can pull off a decent iron sight group



Retro AR 100yds a1 sights benched

 

[CZguy]

krochus,

If you were shooting at the writing on that paper plate...........you missed.

 

[longdayjake]

Here are two groups I managed to get at 200 yards with my M1A. One right after another. This was prone off of sandbags.

 

[Cosmoline]

I used to be able to shoot 1" groups with good quality open sights like the CZ 550. But these days my eyes are just getting too old to shoot much beyond 75 yards with notch and post tangents. Can't see the notch anymore when I focus on the front sight! So I waver around too much trying to find it. I've switched over to the Mojos for my M39 and things have improved a lot. This Sunday I managed a nice 2" four shot group at 100, and with more practice I should be able to tighten it back up to wear it should be (about 1 1/2" with that rifle and load).

The REAL trick is doing it off hand!

 

[heeler]

I picked up a very clean Remington Mohawk 600 in .308 around five years ago and decided to see how well I could do on the 100 and 200 yard range with the factory equipped open sights.
These are some amazingly accurate little carbines and come with an 18.5 inch barrel and weigh six pounds.
Now because of my age I had to put on my non prescription reading glasses to get a good look at the front sight but I was able to put a three shot group in a five inch circle and kept the three shot group at 200 yards in a ten inch circle.
Of course this was on sand bags.
Back in the days of my 20's I killed several deer at ranges from 50-120 yards using open sights on my Mossberg 810 A in 30-06.
Although I will be the first to say that when game hunting I think it best to use a scope for better shot placement on a living animal that's capable of feeling pain.