Opinions on a home defense shotgun for a lady

[Drjones]

Hi all.

A lady I'm seeing is interested in a shotgun for her home. She is rather small, so she will probably require a "youth" sized gun, and, depending how recoil sensitive she is, I may steer her towards a 20 ga.

Some questions:

- What do you recommend overall for a HD weapon for a lady? I know that the best advice is to find what fits the shooter, which leads to my next question:

- What long guns do the women of THR (and wives of THR men) keep for HD?

- Would you suggest a pump or semi?

- Based on what I've learned here, there is not a huge difference balistically speaking between a 12 and 20 ga. Is this true?

As always, any other information and advice is welcome.

Thanks!

 

[sm]

Drjones

One of the best kept secrets is a 1100 20 ga.
The other is a 870 pump i n 20 ga. The EXpress is a good value.

Youth models are fine for petite folks. One can always get a youth stock, often a gunsmith will have one laying around he took off one for replacing with a syn. If not contact Boyds.

Sometimes old skeet guns, even the fixed SK or IC choked bbls are for sale at the skeet range...check the bullentin board.

Great thing about youth stocks - anyone can use them, from the teenager, mom, to dad...20 ga will work. #3 buck is fine and what is avail for buckshot for a 20 bore. A hunting load of 1oz #4 will ruin anyone's day.

The light target loads [ if gonna save for reloading by someone else is good] or least expensive dove/ quail loads to learn the basics is recommemded to learn on.

 

[craig]

i got my wife a mossberg mod. 500 20 gauge. she put a small recoil pad on it and she can handle it just fine. it's a 6 shot w/18.5 bbl. mod. 50422 i think. the only problem is she likes it a little too much. the ammo bill:banghead: .

 

[LAR-15]

For recoil sensitive folks try the 28 gauge.

 

[mnrivrat]

I pulled the articale below off the web someplace. It's reference is applicable to your question and just happens to follow my opinion as well.

quote: "20 Gauge - The 20 is an excellent self-defense caliber, particularly for those who dislike the recoil of the 12 gauge. I recommend the 20 gauge over the more popular 12 for home defense. Choose the 20 gauge 3" shell Federal "Classic" #2 buckshot (F207-2-5PK) with 18 pellets, or the Winchester "Double XX" Magnum #3 with 24 pellets (X203C3B). If your gun cannot accept 3" shells choose the Remington #3 with 20 pellets (SP20BK5PK-3). All of these loads provide definitive short-range stopping power. I specifically recommend the 20 gauge for women and recoil-sensitive men who dislike the blast and recoil of the 12 gauge. "Delivering roughly the ballistic force of two .44 Magnum rounds at once," comments the knowledgeable Ayoob, the 20 "delivers 75% of the lead for only 50-60% of the recoil". Many police departments have found their officers shoot much more accurately in realistic training exercises with the lighter-kicking but still potent 20 gauge. If you are new to shotgunning and considering getting one for self-defense I strongly urge you to buy the reliable and reasonably-priced "Mossberg 500 Special Purpose" 18.5" barrel 20 gauge pump shotgun (catalog #50451). This tried-and-true workhorse is the standard shotgun of the U.S. Armed Forces and costs a little over $200. You'll be much happier with the lighter-kicking 20 gauge than the 12 gauge version used by the military, and - most importantly - you'll shoot the 20 more accurately and rapidly. For an in-depth look at the 20-versus-12 gauge issue I recommend all shotgun owners (and potential shotgun owners) read 'Stressfire II: Advanced Combat Shotgun' by Massad Ayoob. Perhaps I am beginning to sound like a broken record on the theme of Ayoob's books, but once you've read them you'll understand why I recommend them so highly (and repeatedly). Note: Ayoob dislikes the 20 gauge Remington 870 pump shotgun and recommends you choose the Mossberg 500 in 20 gauge for general self-defense and home-defense use. So do I. For ultra-close range home defense birdshot will do the trick. Choose any #4, BB or larger high brass lead hunting load, and have the balance of the magazine filled with #3 buck in case the birdshot doesn't put them down fast enough. Avoid slug use in 20 gauge; you are better off defending yourself with buckshot. If you must use slugs, pick the Dynamit/Nobel or Federal "Classic" (F203-RS) rifled slugs. Using slugs requires careful aiming and rifle sights: few 20 gauge shotguns have the latter. "

 

[Dave McCracken]

Some good advice here, let me add a little.....

Shotguns are wonderful defensive tools, when used by shotgunners. The lady in question is not a shotgunner. Yet.....

Let her try out a few shotguns using light loads in a controlled environment like a skeet range,have fun, and go from there.

The 20 has more than enough punch. Even the 28 gauge packs more whump than proven stoppers like the 44 Mag and 45 ACP.

Disagreeing with Ayoob, I think the 20 gauge 870 handles like an M-1 carbine and serves well as a HD tool. Note the YE is a semi-hard kicker with oz loads.

HTH....

 

[ksnecktieman]

What you have to do is balance four things, weight, recoil, payload, and expense.
Weight, A 20 ga will be lighter than a 12. That means easier to deploy, but the recoil will be more intense.
The recoil can be varied by changing the payload of the shell you are shooting. If you buy a 20 to reduce recoil, and then buy magnum loads to feed it, you have defeated your purpose. A shotgun that weighs five and a half pounds, firing a load of one and a quarter ounces will recoil the same in either guage (viciously, IMHO).
If you feel a need for a heavy magnum load, you have a need for a heavy, recoil absorbing shotgun. (12 ga at 7.5 or more pounds?)
You should be able to buy a mossberg, or an 870 remington pump for about 225$. In either 12 or 20 guage you can buy hunting ammo at walmart for under five dollars a box of 25. Magnum and specialty ammo adds cost really fast.

I think that is the important facts for your selection, now for my opinions. In most houses there is no place that you will be able to engage a target at more than thirty feet. At thirty feet your shot will all be in a circle the size of a dinner plate or less. 7/8s ounce of any size shot from a 20 guage should deal with any threat not wearing body armor, and if he is wearing armor, an arm or a head is still vulnerable and effectively targeted. ANY reliable pump is fine, and 20 ga is sufficient. ( Also she can have fun with it, because it is light enough and gentle enough to carry and shoot a lot, for trap or hunting.)

 

[El Tejon]

Dr., I've had the experience of teaching 3 now female LEOs how to shoot, well, at least how to handle firearms. It is imperative that they get trigger time with whatever weapon it is. Have to crawl, walk, run.

I learned the hard way (thanks to the Learned Elders of TFL) that you should start with a gas operated 20 and work your way slowly into the 12. Must remove their fear of the gun so that they can focus on the physical part.

The question is not about hardware, but software.

 

[jptsr1]

I am sort of a non conformist when it comes to home defense weapons. I believe that they should be stocked with the most powerful cartridge in whatever caliber they hold. For instance when I take my wife to the range she shoots .38s out of my GP141 all day. She is very comfortable with the gun and has gotten pretty good with it. When the same gun is in the night stand it is loaded with .357. I don’t think it’s likely that she is gonna get into a gunfight with an intruder. It’s more likely that she will get off one shot or maybe 2 so I want her to have the best chance of actually stopping the guy.

Same thing goes for our shotgun. She shoots a 12 Gauge just fine. When we are at the range shooting clays she uses the regular bird shot. At home the 870 stands ready and loaded with 3inch magnum shells in either bird or buck. Point is she won’t be shooting and then looking for cover and thinking about a follow-up shot. In a home invasion situation I think it’s more likely she will get one shot. Id have your buddy warm up for a while using a 20 and then id eventually move her up to a low powered 12 of some sort.

J.

 

[MrMurphy]

I had to set up a female friend with a firearm. Granted, she lives in the boonies so this may differ from your experience and a budget was involved. At the time I was cash strapped, so i acquired a singleshot NEF 12ga shotgun. Loaded with birdshot, she went through several boxes until she hit the target fine and wasn't afraid of it. Then I loaded up five rounds of Hornady TAP low recoil buckshot and she shot those. She had no problem with it. I taught her basic tactics and architecture, and while she may only have one shot, she'll make it count.


For someone who can afford it, the 20ga Mossberg 500 and a Bantam/Youth stock.


Also, you may consider the Keltec Sub-2000 in 9mm or .40, which has low recoil, good controllability, and is essentially a semi-auto only SMG, handles like an Uzi (very well) and is small enough for a woman to handle well. With 10+ rounds, you can lay down some serious home defense fire.

 

[birdv]

My vote:
If the gun is just for home defense, cut an old stagecoach double barrel. If anything that should wake up the neighbors and scare the pants off the bad guy.

 

[sm]

I have something I wrote in regard to Women & Guns . I will edit and post later. I just rec'd my laptop back and have been using someone else's laptop this past week. I have it on one of three USB Flashdrives, or floppy, or CD, maybe a mini CD...just have to find it, and edit out the handgun and rifle parts.

El Tejon has one gun IIRC I really like ,he uses to teach with - the Beretta 303 in 20ga is a great gun!!

 

[Drjones]

Thanks for all the replies so far.

Lots of great food for thought.