Optic for saiga

[Jericho_223]

Hey everybody! well i really want to evaluate the accuracy of my new saiga 223. problem is, i'm nearsighted, so it's hard for me to even SEE the target at 100 yards. so i've been thinking that maybe i should put an optic on it, probably using the side mount. i'd like to keep the costs down for now, ideally not more than a couple hundred. not sure if i want a full blown scope, and ACOG-type, or a red dot, but i'm thinking it's got to at least have 4x magnification. any suggestions? thanks!

 

[ball3006]

Try these guys. I have a first generation on my Romak with a red dot and it is just fine for me. chris3

Forgot the site... http://texasweaponsystems.com/id1.html

 

[SN13]

Jericho,

I too, am nearsighted.

I'd suggest the following:

http://www.cdnninvestments.com/aksiramoqude.html

Then add any scope or red dot you want.

I have one of these that has survived 12ga, 20ga, .308, 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 saigas.

I've mounted 3-9x40 Nikon Prostaffs and Burris Fastfire holo sights to it.

It is the most cost effective way to mount an optic to a saiga.

Here it is on my 20ga.


Here is the same mount on my x39 a few years ago (my first of many saigas)



~SN13

 

[JustinJ]

I've got a POSP 4X on my arsenal ak74 that was an incredible value. You should be able to find one within your budget. You will likely need to replace the mount though to make it attach securely to your saiga. Kalinka optics has them at good prices.

In my experience all the low end, cheap side rail mounts are junk that either break or flex too much to hold a zero.

 

[SN13]

I've got a POSP 4X on my arsenal ak74 that was an incredible value. You should be able to find one within your budget. You will likely need to replace the mount though to make it attach securely to your saiga. Kalinka optics has them at good prices.

In my experience all the low end, cheap side rail mounts are junk that either break or flex too much to hold a zero.

In my experience, I've seen some more expensive Eastern block rail mounts literally break apart while mounting them to the gun. The UTG I linked has been installed/taken off of multiple guns more than 100 times and still holds a zero.

I have 2 POSP scopes. 1 in 4x on my 7.62x39. and 1 in 6x on my .308. Both are decent scopes for the price i payed. BUT are harder to mount correctly than the UTG i linked. AND both have very rough windage/elevation adjustments. Each click moves the reticle ALOT.

You can see both below:



These scopes are also located to the left of the receiver by a good amount. If you're left handed, avoid them. The UTG mounts almost directly above the center.

Here is a photo of the Red-dot on the UTG on my 5.45x39




Purchase whatever you want. I'm just giving you the wisdom of my personal experiences. The UTG has held up to thousands of rounds of .308, 7.62x39, 5.45x39, 20ga, and 12ga. (I only own ONE mount) and has been swapped between guns many times. It is a better quality than many Eastern Bloc railed side-mounts and it puts the optic almost dead center.

If I were buying another rail for an AK, i'd get the same UTG I have. It is the best bang for the buck.

~SN

One more thing. At $200 each for a 4x24 or 6x42 POSP, you'd still have $170 for a scope and red dot with the UTG. A decent 3-9x40 Nikon Prostaff will run you $100. Just saying.

 

[Jericho_223]

thanks to everyone for answering! @SN1E, that mount is pretty much what i was thinking of using, and that link you posted also has a ton of pretty affordable optics too, so thanks! i guess this is the only problem with buying a new rifle, buying all the goodies for it!

 

[wnycollector]

I have a BP-02 mount and an inexpensive Mueller 2-7 multi shot scope on my Saiga in 5.45x39. The BP-02 is made in Belarus for the AK family of rifles. You can find them at Kalinka, East Wave or ebay.

 

[SN13]

The BP-02 Belarus is the mount I watched break apart while someone was putting it back on his rifle. The metal piece that clamps just broke in half and it became a paper weight.

 

[amd6547]

I have also been looking for a rail mount for my 5.45 Saiga.
In the past, I had a Russian made POSP scope and mount that was fantastic...now, they seem to be priced much higher than they were when I bought mine.
Even the BP02 mount is going for $60.
So, I have one of the UTG mounts on the way....$26 with free shipping off Amazon.
I'm going to start with an aimpoint clone red dot I have already for now...but I am looking at several low powered variables...1-4 or 2-7 powered.
I shot a pretty tight 10 shot group at 100 yards using the iron sights on my first range trip with this Saiga and surplus 7n6 ammo. I can't wait to see what it will do with a scope and the hornady Vmax 5.45 I just bought.

 

[JustinJ]

It is quite easy to overtighten a BP-02 mount which could cause one to break. They actually need less torque than many realize. The front stop on the side rail is what actually keeps. On the other hand though there are chinese knock off of BP-02 mounts that i have seen break.

 

[wnycollector]

They actually need less torque than many realize.

+1 on that. If you follow the installation/tightening instructions here http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/manual/KOAKClampAdjustment.pdf you should be OK.

 

[amd6547]

Well, I would have gone for the BP02, but the price was steep. I read a lot of user reviews on the UTG mount, and they were nearly uniformly positive...astoundingly so.
I have a feeling that middlemen are really building up the price on Russian optics...to the point where I won't buy them.
When I bought the POSP I used to have three years ago, it was about $125, as I recall.
The same scope now is $250. At $125, the POSP was a great scope. For $250, there are certainly better.

 

[JustinJ]

"Well, I would have gone for the BP02, but the price was steep. I read a lot of user reviews on the UTG mount, and they were nearly uniformly positive...astoundingly so."

I had one of the UTG mounts that was tightened with 3 allen screws instead of the throw lever. Aside from that it was identical. The biggest problem i had was it would flex too readily causing zero to shift.

"The same scope now is $250. At $125, the POSP was a great scope. For $250, there are certainly better."

Which POSP? Sometimes you can find them used for good prices as well. I picked up my 4X POSP for $100 at a gun show. I had to change out the side rail mount though to mate it to my Arsenal AKs. But even at $250 i'd argue they are a great value. They have great glass and nice features even at $250. I don't know of a better fixed power scope plus mount at a better price.

 

[SN13]

JustinJ

I know you are adamant about the POSP. I have the 4x you speak of and the 6x 1000yrd version. I enjoy them both.

POSP can only mount one scope.

Rail can mount many scopes.

POSP has ROUGH adjustments

$100 Nikon has 1/4 MOA Adjustments.

POSP is shifted to the left.

Rail is almost center.

I like my POSP. Both of them. but I got them used for $140 for the 6x and $100 for the 4x. I'd never buy them at the $200 price tag Kalinka fetches these days. Just too many good options out there to mount cheaply.

I've never experienced flexing that loses zero on my UTG Quick Detach.

You can see it attached to my .308 Saiga here:



If it will survive .308 with a 3-9x40 Nikon Prostaff on it, it will surely survive 7.62x39 with a red-dot.

I used the setup to shoot this:

 

[amd6547]

I have seen several cheaper POSP's, but they were Romanian...even those were $149.
If I had lots of cash, I would have the IP78 Kashtan scope, which is specific to the AK74 and the 5.45...a fantastic scope, but $500!
I really think a low powered variable like 1.5-4 would be optimal for my 5.45 shooting.

 

[JustinJ]

SN13, you are correct about the POSP's adjustments. I do however tend to think the Soviet use of this scope was more of in a DMR role with out much use of the turrets. I think they tend to use the reticle's features to account for drop and wind. The only $100Nikons i know of are simple hunting scopes with limited military application. And to be honest I have a Nikon prostaff whose glass is less clear than my POSP. My biggest complaint of the POSP is that its almost impossible to get a decent cheeck weld without a raised comb or pad on the stock due to how high the scope sits.

The UTG i had that flexed was years ago and not quick disconnect so probably they have improved.

 

[SN13]

JustinJ,

I have noticed that my POSP glass is surprisingly clear on my 6x... the 4x isn't as good but could be because of the thinner tube.

I agree that you can use the built in reticle to adjust and don't need to use the clicks, but my 7.62x39 with 4x seems to shoot right between 2 adjustments. The groups are a little to the right so I click right, then teh group is to the left slightly.

It's not a huge deal as Clay pigeons at 100yards still die every time, but the fact that I can't get the ^ right dead center, annoys me slightly.

 

[amd6547]

Well, I received my UTG rail mount from Amazon today...the day AFTER I went to the range, of course.
Seems like a good mount. It slid right on my Saiga, no binding of anything. The lever locked it right down with no adjustment, and when locked on, the mount seems very tight.
I have an aimpoint clone...one of the fakes complete with logo. I have used it on several different rifles, including my CETME, a rifle which is known to destroy cheap scopes...the fakepoint took that with no problem.
I mounted that to my Saiga, and it seems like a terrific combination...I am still planning on getting a low power variable though.
Before I ordered this UTG mount, I attended a local gun show. I saw several dealers selling the UTG mount...they were all trying to get $45 for them....Amazon for $26 and free shipping with no tax sure beats that.
If you are going to order one of these, make sure you get the genuine UTG. There are clones around.