Options for a 20yo NY'er looking to work with firearms
- Thread starter TMiller556
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aarondhgraham
Member
I'm reposting bacusae my first post was asinine,,,
I had originally said not to work in a field you love,,,
Because that sucks the enjoyment out of it.
I should not have said that,,,
At least not as a hard and fast rule.
Many people (especially business owners) do just that,,,
Just because it didn't work out for me,,,
Doesn't mean it won't work for you.
I destroyed my love of photography,,,
By trying to make a living doing it.
I loved to take images of landscapes and nudes,,,
So I figured it was only logical to be a professional photographer.
Photographing weddings, portraits, and soccer teams sucked all the joy out of photography,,,
I should have followed my first instinct and became a business accountant,,,
That would have supported me and a photography hobby just fine.
But then there are guys like Jerry Miceluk,,,
Guns are his passion and he turned it into a lucrative business.
He did it (his own words) by being "the first on the range and the last to leave every day",,,
His gun-smithing business gave him the income to practice every day,,,
He turned his passion into a lucrative career.
You should be able to do the same.
But first you need to define exactly what you want to do.
You say you want to "work with firearms",,,
That's a very broad statement.
Sell them?
Build them?
Repair them?
Design them?
All of the above?
Some of the above?
My new advice is to start researching all of the possible firearm careers,,,
Then contact each and every U. S. manufacturer about careers,,,
Notice I'm saying "career" instead of the word job.
Find out what jobs exist and what is necessary to obtain one of them.
Ask them about training for their careers,,,
And ask them where to obtain it.
Then go to school or take an entry level position or whatever,,,
Just do your homework so you aren't wasting your time and effort.
If Master-Blaster firearms company says they hire people with a certain industry certification,,,
Find out where you can study for that certification and go there.
Opportunities abound in this still great country,,,
But they don't float into your lap,,,
You have to track them down.
Make whatever sacrifices you must,,,
Move to wherever you must,,,
Take all necessary action.
It can be done,,,
But you have to actively pursue it.
Do you want it strongly enough to do these things?
Aarond
.
I had originally said not to work in a field you love,,,
Because that sucks the enjoyment out of it.
I should not have said that,,,
At least not as a hard and fast rule.
Many people (especially business owners) do just that,,,
Just because it didn't work out for me,,,
Doesn't mean it won't work for you.
I destroyed my love of photography,,,
By trying to make a living doing it.
I loved to take images of landscapes and nudes,,,
So I figured it was only logical to be a professional photographer.
Photographing weddings, portraits, and soccer teams sucked all the joy out of photography,,,
I should have followed my first instinct and became a business accountant,,,
That would have supported me and a photography hobby just fine.
But then there are guys like Jerry Miceluk,,,
Guns are his passion and he turned it into a lucrative business.
He did it (his own words) by being "the first on the range and the last to leave every day",,,
His gun-smithing business gave him the income to practice every day,,,
He turned his passion into a lucrative career.
You should be able to do the same.
But first you need to define exactly what you want to do.
You say you want to "work with firearms",,,
That's a very broad statement.
Sell them?
Build them?
Repair them?
Design them?
All of the above?
Some of the above?
My new advice is to start researching all of the possible firearm careers,,,
Then contact each and every U. S. manufacturer about careers,,,
Notice I'm saying "career" instead of the word job.
Find out what jobs exist and what is necessary to obtain one of them.
Ask them about training for their careers,,,
And ask them where to obtain it.
Then go to school or take an entry level position or whatever,,,
Just do your homework so you aren't wasting your time and effort.
If Master-Blaster firearms company says they hire people with a certain industry certification,,,
Find out where you can study for that certification and go there.
Opportunities abound in this still great country,,,
But they don't float into your lap,,,
You have to track them down.
Make whatever sacrifices you must,,,
Move to wherever you must,,,
Take all necessary action.
It can be done,,,
But you have to actively pursue it.
Do you want it strongly enough to do these things?
Aarond
.
Thermactor
member
- Joined
- Mar 13, 2008
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- 992
I always knew that junk was useless! Algebra and trig, definitely need to know. Calculus, useless crap.
source: same field as Gearhead, not as much experience.
I don’t want to drag the comments too far off-topic but I think Calculus was much more useful to an Engineer, especially one with a postgraduate degree, in the days prior to relatively inexpensive and easy to use analysis software. I graduated the same year the first IBM PC was sold, the availability of cheap and powerful computers on every desk has transformed Design Engineering.
My Fluid Dynamics professor had left Aerospace in the purge during the mid ‘70s and made the career change to education, he would begin each chapter in the textbook with a lecture or two on the mathematical concepts relating to the chapter because at that time a ME with a postgraduate degree was expected to understand those concepts and be able to use them to model actual physical problems using those mathematical concepts. Then he would step back and teach the rest of us the physical concepts of the subject that we needed to understand as Engineers with only our 4 year degree. Universities still have a responsibility to prepare a student for postgraduate studies even though most graduates with an Engineering degree never pursue a postgraduate technical degree. As it is now, I can sit at my computer and run software that will predict the stress levels inside a complex mechanical part in under an hour or simulate highly transient hypersonic shocks in compressible gases in a few days. The underlying code in that software is written by the Ph.D who actually does use calculus and differential equations on a regular basis just so guys like us can sit at our desks and interpret their results.
Community college counselors are salespeople for the community college first and foremost. To pretend otherwise is foolish.
Community colleges are a tremendous value - you can get an education there that will serve you well for a lifetime. To do so, the student must exert the effort to research what will get them to their goal. If you want to be a LEO, you need a certified POST Academy, not a AA in Criminal Justice. If you want to be an oilfield Project Manager, you need CAD classes, not general education requirements. If you want to get a BA, you need general education classes that will prepare you for transfer to a 4-year college or university.
MANY advisors at community colleges will try to get everyone into AA or certificate programs, regardless of what employers are looking for, and everyone else in GE programs that never end. I did my POST academy at a CC. My son only needed two classes in CAD at the same CC to get hired as a CAD draftsman, and four years experience to become a Project Manager. My wife had more credits than she could transfer to a CSU with, and her salesperson was signing her up for more at the CC.
Been there, done that, have a Master's in Education. I know what I'm talking about. The advice he needs to seek is from folks that can hire him, not salespeople.
TMiller556
Member
Sorry to bump but I just wanted to ask a question without starting a new thread.
In the future, what does it take to own a range? Of course you need a lot of money to even get anything going, but how realistic does the idea itself sound.
In the future, what does it take to own a range? Of course you need a lot of money to even get anything going, but how realistic does the idea itself sound.
Your question is a bit unclear. Are you talking a for-profit enterprise, open to the public, members-only, indoor, outdoor, pistol. rifle, shotgun (trap, skeet, sporting clays?), basic facility, clubhouse, gun shop? Location?
TMiller556
Member
Yeah sorry about the vagueness. What I was thinking about was an indoor, public range that offers all rifles, shotguns, and handgun rentals. Possibly New England.
I know that even that is a bit vague, but it's just an idea. What I'm uncertain about is how to offer something that's in demand and that stands out from its competition. I wouldn't want it to be another typical range.. it'd be hard to market it.
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Even harder to make a profit. Both of the local indoor ranges are now owned by the same company. He got his start by buying the range equipment off the first indoor range in town - at their bankruptcy sale. He had an existing retail gun shop inside his family's oil tool business, and built a large steel building across the street. If his gun business had not thrived there, he could easily rent it as industrial/commercial, so he had a Plan B - as well as family financing.
It became the largest gun shop in town, and the only indoor range for about 20 years. Then another oilfield service family offspring opened a small gun shop in a strip mall next to a grocery store, testing how much discontent there was with the other shops. They were competitive enough to decide to lease another steel warehouse building ( about four miles from the established one) and spend a big pile of money on a 25-yard, climate-controlled, 9 bay indoor range with attached retail gun shop.
They did pretty well, until the Banic hit. When shortages hit, they didn't have the cash and foresight to lay in a huge inventory. They chose not to jack up prices (Bless their hearts!) and were soon left with nothing but payroll. The established guy bought them out, cheap. He now has both open - we'll see how that works out.
Indoor ranges, by their nature, are very limited. The take up a large amount of space, require lots of filtered airflow to meet environmental requirements, and can be surprisingly costly to buy and maintain. People shoot the equipment, and when some knucklehead clips the target wire or pulley or holder, you lose income until you get it fixed - and have to shut down the range to do so. Everybody wants to come in after 5 or on weekends, but you have to staff the range every minute it is open. Insurance is a pretty penny, too. Just when you get it going well, there's an ammo shortage.....
Then there's location. Zoning can be an issue, but cost is more of one. If you put it in town, so it's easily accessible to your clients, it's very expensive. Put it out where land is affordable, and people won't drive to you - or will realize they can find a place to shoot outdoors cheaper.
If I won the lottery and netted (after taxes) more than $30 million, I'd probably take $2 million and build a first-class indoor range/gun shop/gunsmithing center. I'd do transfers cheap, support the shooting sports organizations, have classes for hunters/NRA/CCW/Scouts, sponsor high-school shooting teams and host matches. I would enjoy it no end, if I didn't have to live off the income. I sure wouldn't borrow money to do it, though.
It became the largest gun shop in town, and the only indoor range for about 20 years. Then another oilfield service family offspring opened a small gun shop in a strip mall next to a grocery store, testing how much discontent there was with the other shops. They were competitive enough to decide to lease another steel warehouse building ( about four miles from the established one) and spend a big pile of money on a 25-yard, climate-controlled, 9 bay indoor range with attached retail gun shop.
They did pretty well, until the Banic hit. When shortages hit, they didn't have the cash and foresight to lay in a huge inventory. They chose not to jack up prices (Bless their hearts!) and were soon left with nothing but payroll. The established guy bought them out, cheap. He now has both open - we'll see how that works out.
Indoor ranges, by their nature, are very limited. The take up a large amount of space, require lots of filtered airflow to meet environmental requirements, and can be surprisingly costly to buy and maintain. People shoot the equipment, and when some knucklehead clips the target wire or pulley or holder, you lose income until you get it fixed - and have to shut down the range to do so. Everybody wants to come in after 5 or on weekends, but you have to staff the range every minute it is open. Insurance is a pretty penny, too. Just when you get it going well, there's an ammo shortage.....
Then there's location. Zoning can be an issue, but cost is more of one. If you put it in town, so it's easily accessible to your clients, it's very expensive. Put it out where land is affordable, and people won't drive to you - or will realize they can find a place to shoot outdoors cheaper.
If I won the lottery and netted (after taxes) more than $30 million, I'd probably take $2 million and build a first-class indoor range/gun shop/gunsmithing center. I'd do transfers cheap, support the shooting sports organizations, have classes for hunters/NRA/CCW/Scouts, sponsor high-school shooting teams and host matches. I would enjoy it no end, if I didn't have to live off the income. I sure wouldn't borrow money to do it, though.
oneounceload
member
According to the guys that own an indoor range where I live, their state of the art air handling system with permits, equipment and installation ran close to $1,000,000 alone. They also have a retail shop and classroom space, offer CWP classes, etc. You will need something that makes folks want to come to your place over someplace else - be it services, a better environment, etc.
tark
Member
Do you like ARs? Join the army on condition that you get 45B20 as your MOS. That is Small Arms Repairman, or at least it was 45 years ago. Military experience is a valuable asset in todays world. As a SAR you will see a lot of work on AR platforms....and there are a lot of AR manufactures out there when you get out.
I live twenty miles from Rock River and its owner, Chuck Larson, is a casual friend. We meet often enough to remember one another anyway. I'm pretty sure Chuck likes military experience, and business is booming, pretty much everywhere in the AR world.
I worked in the industry for 21 years making custom 1911s. You won't get rich, at least not working for someone else, but it can be a satisfying career. I didn't get rich, but I got comfortable, and I am content.
I live twenty miles from Rock River and its owner, Chuck Larson, is a casual friend. We meet often enough to remember one another anyway. I'm pretty sure Chuck likes military experience, and business is booming, pretty much everywhere in the AR world.
I worked in the industry for 21 years making custom 1911s. You won't get rich, at least not working for someone else, but it can be a satisfying career. I didn't get rich, but I got comfortable, and I am content.
barnbwt
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To be a movie star, you may need to leave rural Arkansas; to be a gun...anything, you may need to leave New York. Them's the breaks...
Military is a great career choice and all, but gunnery is a poor reason to join itself. That's a heck of a commitment that takes a lot of options off the table immediately; certainty/clarity is something you want before promising years to anything/anyone.
TCB
Military is a great career choice and all, but gunnery is a poor reason to join itself. That's a heck of a commitment that takes a lot of options off the table immediately; certainty/clarity is something you want before promising years to anything/anyone.
TCB
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