Pdw?!!! A different breed.

[PoserHoser]

Well I know many despise them ,but I'm looking for opinions on a tax free pdw (no sbr,sbs,aow). I know a full stock is better and I have multiple full stock firearms. This is a niche weapon for close quarters. I'm looking for reviews from people who've used them. Pgo shotgun or high capacity pistol such as Draco Ak pistol or other larger caliber compact firearms. Really appreciate your opinions and reviews. Thanks

 

[highorder]

The only stock less weapon I have positive experience with is the MP5K.

I've had less positive experiences with AR pistols, AK folders, and the least favored, PGO shotgun.

You need to be in really tight quarters for a youth 20ga pump to stop making sense. In those quarters, a full sized pistol is the better choice.

What unique space are you defending?

 

[PoserHoser]

What unique space are you defending?

Trucks, heavy equipment , and a small camper. Have multiple pistol caliber handguns but feel they're underpowered for this application .

 

[Deus Machina]

The best I've heard on this subject it to attach a single-point sling to the rear of an AK pistol or something, adjust it to appropriate length, and you can then push the gun forward with it while firing to create a pseudo-stock.

Really, these sorts of things don't do the best job in either role. I'm another vote that you'd be best served by an 18" shotgun with a child or bantam stock, a bullpup-style rifle, or your choice of rifle with an adjustable stock shoved the shortest you can stand it.

 

[MistWolf]

PDWs have buttstocks. The P90 is a good example of this type of firearm

View attachment 670919

 

[Sam1911]

A "PDW" is a short carbine usually firing some relatively diminutive round that's a compromise between a submachine gun (pistol cartridge) and an assault rifle (intermediate rifle cartridge).

There aren't a whole lot of them around. Wiki lists the following:

ČZW-438 – 4.38x30mm Libra
Colt MARS – 5.56x30mm MARS
FN P90 – 5.7x28mm
Heckler & Koch MP7 – 4.6x30mm
Knight's Armament Company PDW – 6x35mm KAC
Magpul PDR – 5.56x45mm NATO
PP-2000 – 9x19mm 7N21 +P+, 9x19mm 7N31 +P+
QCW-05 – 5.8x21mm
Saab Bofors Dynamics CBJ-MS – 6.5x25 CBJ-MS
ST Kinetics CPW – 4.6x30mm, 5.7x28mm, 9x19mm[5]
VBR-Belgium PDW – 7.92x24mm
Modern Sub Machine Carbine – 5.56×30mm MINSAS

I think every one has a stock of some sort. That greatly improves your chances of hitting anything quickly.

Some of us have suggested that the M1 and M2 carbines were really the first "PDWs", as the .30 M1 Carbine round seems to fit the criteria and they were diminutive, compact, defensive weapon for rear-echelon troops, drivers, and others who weren't relying on a rifle to do their daily job.

The AKS-74U is also sometimes said to be one, though it really qualifies more as an abbreviated assault rifle.

If you're just looking for a PGO shotgun or Draco pistol, those are pretty well-known items to most of us and have been discussed a million times. What more specific info do you need on them?

 

[RevolvingGarbage]

You could go with the original PDW, the M1 Carbine. No NFA paperwork for a standard version, and 30 rounders are available.

 

[Mp7]

a Tec9 comes to mind.

Mag is long enuff to get a 2nd grip.
And for close quarter social work ....

Well, it`s like a MP5K
(Built by Apes)

 

[Sapper771]

Masterpiece Arms MAC clones. They can be had for around the cost of a used Glock. There are a lot of modifications and accessories avaikable. The two I had were reliable and accurate enough for serious purposes.

I would mention Kel-Tec PLR-16........but you dont want to touch that thing off in tight quarters.

 

[Soapy5]

a bullpup of your choice with a 16" barrel (or 14.5" + pinned and welded muzzle device). as short as any sbr, yet no tax stamp and you dont lose an insane amount of muzzle velocity. plus you still have a stock. well worth any bullpup-specific issues you might have to deal with

 

[Apple a Day]

You can get some really large mag's for Glocks (33- rounders for 9mm) which seem to be reliable. That would be the easiest, least expensive route.
I've got a Henry mare's leg. It's awkward to shoot standing for long. While I like the idea of a magnum pistol caliber out of a 13" bbl. its low capacity and slow reload time don't make it optimal. The .22 LR is fun and I might consider a .22 magnum just right but larger than that is too cumbersome for what it is.

 

[Al Thompson]

Buddy of mine has a SBR. No way in hades would I grab one for defensive purposes. Way, way too loud.

As for a PGO shotgun, go with a 20 gauge. 12s are too slow, shot to shot as the recoil is stout.

 

[MachIVshooter]

A "PDW" is a short carbine usually firing some relatively diminutive round that's a compromise between a submachine gun (pistol cartridge) and an assault rifle (intermediate rifle cartridge)

I don't think we need to apply such a strict definition here, though.

To me, a PDW offers more than a handgun, but it's primary purpose by design is defensive rather than offensive, meaning that it's not designed to "reach out and touch someone".

I'd say such weapons as pistol ARs and AKs definitely qualify. I would consider my PLR-16 a PDW. Though these weapons are legally classified as handguns, we all know that they really aren't pistols.

 

[Sam1911]

Ok, setting aside the "words mean things" argument...

The point I was trying to make there is that the folks who have designed true PDWs, and things which border on being a PDW, put stocks on them. They are serious guns for serious purposes and thus need every advantage for hitting attacking threats as fast and accurately as possible.

A Draco AK pistol is an interesting thing to play with. But I'd rather shoot a true handgun at a threat -- even though the round isn't as powerful as a 7.62 or 5.56 -- because I know I'll hit what I'm aiming at, and very quickly. That matters FAR more than whether the round hit with X,XXX FPE.

Having run AK and AR "pistols" as well as PGO shotguns against a timer in scenario-based competition and practice, I know what I'd be giving up for the questionable benefit of going stockless. A folding stock is a good compromise. Going stockless is a bad compromise.

 

[mr.trooper]

My experience with PGO shotguns is better than some, but still not spectacular. With 15 or 20 shots practice, I was able to reliable hit water jugs at 10 yards, probably 5 or 7 shots. Accuracy beyond 10 yards was abismal. The varriation in angle is just too severe to pick up quickly - any small varriation in your muzzle hold will throw your shot off by a mile.

My experience with an AK pistol is that you can make aimed shots out to 25 or 30 yards, but for most of the shooting (from the hip or chest) they are no more accurate than a PGO shotgun.

If I were you, I would register one of your pistols as an SBR, and put one of those detachable stocks on it. Cheaper and more effective than a stockless rifle or shotgun.

 

[MtnCreek]

Note on PGO shotguns: IMO, having a pistol grip forearm makes recoil much more controllable than a standard forearm.

 

[PoserHoser]

If you're just looking for a PGO shotgun or Draco pistol, those are pretty well-known items to most of us and have been discussed a million times. What more specific info do you need on them?

Mainly was looking for other guns around their same size.

 

[Ian]

Broomhandle Mauser!

 

[mljdeckard]

I concur with #7.

 

[AethelstanAegen]

Broomhandle Mauser!

A Schnellfeuer might be just the ticket. That made my day. Too funny.

 

[PoserHoser]

I have a M1 carbine, benelli snt, and an ar 15.

 

[HoosierQ]

I have a M1 carbine, benelli snt, and an ar 15.

The M1 Carbine is an outstanding PDW. So too would be an AR-15 with the 16.75" barrel (or whatever the M4-gery's have, in keeping with the tax-free specification) and the telescoping stock fully forward.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Enforcer carbine?

That would give you an 11 inch 30 carbine with a 15 or 30 round mag. Loud as space shuttle launch and about the same sized muzzle blast. You already have mags and know how to take it apart.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbOUSdFNohk

I found 4 for sale on Gunbroker.

 

[PoserHoser]

^^^ very interesting indeed.

 

[Dr.Rob]

A friend of mine that swore he met an FBI agent that kept one in his car. Said it was good for busting up cinderblocks (all that he ever got to shoot with one).

I'd rather have one of those than an AR pistol, just because it's different.

Universal made these for 20 some years, then Iver Johnson did for a few more, then another company did. They must have sold a bunch of them to keep them in the catalog.