Pentagon's Super Sniper Program

[Zak Smith]

3) The path of the laser beam and the path of the bullet at 1+ mile are very very different, accordingly the wind at 5 ft and the peak of the ballistic path might be very different

If you can do everything but this, all you need to do is sweep the beam approx 1 degree.

 

[atek3]

thats true, but it's still another degree of complexity...

 

[brentn]

how in the hell do you compensate for wind thats 300 meters away from you but 300 meters from the target? I don't do long distance shooting (yet) so I don't have any experience but how is a scope supposed to know what wind is like from the shooter all the way to the target? Wind changes from where you stand and 100 meters I would think...

 

[Zak Smith]

With technology...

 

[atek3]

brentn, the lidar doppler is not like a laser rangefinder. A laser range finder measures distance by calculating the time it takes for the beam to reflect off the target, that's relatively easy. The Lidar doppler is much more complicated. When the laser bounces off a dust particle between you and the target, the frequency of the light is ever so slightly changed, by analyzing that change in frequency, the speed of the dust particle can be estimated. By firing a rapid pulse, the speed of dust particles at one meter intervals can be calculated. Then using a complicated piece of ballistics software, the effect of all these "wind slices" can be summed up to get the windage correction for the shot.

clear as mud?

atek3

 

[HorseSoldier]

but given homogeneous conditions, wind at the shooter has more effect on the bullet than wind at the shootee.

Other way around. As the bullet loses speed and energy, wind has more effect on it, so winds at the target are a bigger concern than winds at the firing point.

so in MOST conditions, basing your call of your location is better than nothing

I'd agree that a wind call at your location is better than no wind call at all. But, given the choice between a mechanical wind call at the firing point, and a spotter's estimation of wind at the target, the preference is for the latter.

 

[taliv]

wind does have more effect as the bullet loses speed, BUT the difference between MV and velocity at the target is not nearly so great as the difference between wind changing the path of the bullet near the muzzle vs near the target.

think about how far off the target you'd be if wind changes the path of your bullet half a degree after it leaves the muzzle and then the bullet travels 950 yrds on its new course

now think about how far off the target you'd be if wind changes the path of your bullet a whole degree (generous, to compensate for the slower velocity) when it only has 50 yrds left to go.

 

[brentn]

atek, thats actually crystal clear! interesting technology there, sounds promising!

 

[atek3]

http://www.darpa.mil/STO/solicitations/oneshot/index.html

actually reading through the RFP and the accompaning powerpoint presentations, lidar is done, SIAC, GE, raytheon, and lockheed martin, seem to be exploring more "wierd" methods like "Intensity Scintillation Correlation Technique" which i don't pretend to get.

Unfortunately the proposed solutions are all classified, so we won't know what "the solution" is for a while.

atek3

 

[mpmarty]

BSBS (Basic Sniper BS) Shoot as soon after first light as possible.

 

[atek3]

BSBS (Basic Sniper BS) Shoot as soon after first light as possible.

non sequitur?

 

[Blueduck]

Another problem of course is that at 1000+ yards even with fast moving rounds flight time will become an issue. A gust can come up or drop off after the trigger is pulled, but before the bullet reaches it's target. I think 1,500 yard 100% hit rates are still WAY off.

Still neat technology, hope it works out, love to to see our troops with an advantage of a any sort

 

[MASTEROFMALICE]

I remember qualifying at the 500 yard line when stationed at Kaneohe Bay. The wind at the 500 yard line would be blowing full value left to right, and at the target it would be blowing full value right to left. To top it off, the wind at the 300 yard line would be blowing at half value or zero value.

That range was weird but there was ALWAYS wind.