Period optics on classic rifles

[Howland937]

I must admit that I have a soft spot for old Redfield scopes. I bought two at a recent gunshow. They were classic 2x-7x & a 3x-9x. Both fairly clear & clean. The 2x-7x has a fine crosshairs & the 3x-9x has a fine dot reticle. I bought both for $50. Both have already been shipped off to Iron Sight to be refurbished & duplex reticles installed. Still looking for an old Redfield 4x-12x.

I also have an affinity for the old Redfield scopes. Only ones I have currently in use are this one
On an old 513T I picked up recently. I'm trying to track down some period correct 1" rings for the 3/8" dovetail. Scope is a 3x-9x Wideview (TV view).
Also have a 4x32 on the TC Classic I put up for the kid. Not period correct in any way, but the fine crosshairs make it a nice little set-up.

 

[Offfhand]

I kind of get a kick out of the old scopes with recoil springs.

I enjoy shooting them too, especially vintage target/varmint scopes like this massive 15X Unertl Ultra Varmint. There was a time when target and varmint type rifles like this early Ruger #One Varmint barreled .22/250 came equipped with mounting blocks for these wonderful old scopes. But they became obsolete with the advent of higher-X hunting type scopes. They were expensive then, and even moreso now if you can find one.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

^^^
"Where does he get those wonderful toys..?"

 

[Nature Boy]

^^^
"Where does he get those wonderful toys..?"

Wouldn’t you just love to wander around in @Offfhand ’s gun room(s) for a day?

I offered to send him my adoption papers but it would have be odd having to explain his new 59 year old son to the kinfolk at the holidays.

 

[SwampWolf]

How bout This?

To be kind, I'm no fan of "See-Thru" rings on any rifle.

 

[SwampWolf]

1950's Remington 722B

Nice rifle. Custom (not factory) checkering job?

 

[Hugger-4641]

To be kind, I'm no fan of "See-Thru" rings on any rifle.

To be kind,, that's because you don't know how to shoot with them. You're not the first to say that. That gun has killed well over 100 deer in the 38 years I've been hunting with it, few of those were less than 100yds and those that were mostly shot using the irons.

 

[SwampWolf]

I know how to shoot with them, I just don't like having to stretch my neck off the stock to look through the scope. If my shooting was done mostly with irons, I'd either shed the scope or, if I was worried about the scope failing or fogging, I'd use a pivot style mount/ring set-up like those made by Weaver or Pachmayr. But that's just me; each to their own.

 

[tark]

I've got an old Savage 23D in 22 Hornet. Mounted is a period correct Weaver model 344 which works splendidly, within its limitations.

 

[BigBlue 94]

First one skirts the rules...
An original SinglePoint OEG on a home built GAU-5A/A replica. First fielded in 1970.

Next is a Redfield Wideview 2-7x on an early Ruger 10/22 with a shaw sporter barrel and refinished original walnut stock. I even took the time that Ruger didnt to fit the metal butt plate to the stock properly.

Closing the show is a 1916 Gewher 98, from J.P. Sauer, sporterized at least 50 years ago with a 30-06 barrel and a Fajen stock. Unknown side mount quick detach scope mount with a Pecar Berlin 3-7x scope. Redfield receiver mounted peep sight as well.

I also have an old Weaver C4, but it needs some rust removed and a bit of oxpho blue touchup. Would do well on an old single shot 22 or something.

 

[22250Rem]

Back in the day a lot of Savage 23D 22 Hornets got scoped from what I've read about that era. After all; in the pre- WW2 years they were a very common varmint rifle and the 22 Hornet is considered to be the pioneer of that entire ballistic genre that we now call varmint cartridges. This 23D has been seen on this web site before but this thread topic demands a replay. This one is wearing the original scope that was mounted to it when the rifle was new sometime in the mid to latter 1930's. It got replaced with a K-6 Weaver about 1966 and when I, ( the 3rd owner), acquired the gun in 1998 I was fortunate to get the original optics and mounts in a box that came with the rifle. Put all the original stuff back on the gun a few years later. It's an externally adjusted, 3/4" tube affair made by the former Wollensak Optical Co. of Rochester NY. Still works good for a scope of that era, and you have to remind yourself that we've all become a bit spoiled by the all the advances in optical technology since the 1930's. Once upon a time this was a state of the art varmint rifle and although the Hornet cartridge has its limitations compared to the bigger, newer, 22 centerfires that came after it, it is still a superb little varmint round. Which; as Tark opined; "works splendidly, within its limitations". Varmint hunters were some of the earliest to embrace optics and they accounted for a lot of scope sales before WW2 interrupted things for a while. .. ... ... ... ...

 

[Offfhand]

Nice rifle. Custom (not factory) checkering job?

Thanks for compliment about that old time 722B, which is all factory original. The "B" grade 722's came with better wood, hand checkering and sling swivels. While we're on the subject, here's another 722B, in .222 Rem. with a vintage Lyman Super Targetspot.

 

[Random 8]

That would be very cool to have done, Doubt I could afford it but for a special rifle would be worth it.

I got ahold of him by e-mail, and unfortunately he no longer works at the sporting optics plant that allowed him to do side work. He's moved on to microscopes and fiber-optics. It was a good system, it only cost me 1 non-serviceable El-Paso and about $100 US shipping. I wish the pictures he sent me weren't locked on a dead computer. He had some amazing European sporters and Safari rifles made up with his refurbed optics and his brother's gunsmithing. He liked the El-Paso Weavers and a few makes of 1950s and 60's German scopes for rebuilds on classic rifles with long bridges. Modern scopes were too short and flimsy he said, and he could never get enough Weaver K-tubes overseas.

 

[Dave DeLaurant]

Just for grins, here's some period literature on period optics:



So far I've just skimmed through Truman Henson's 1950 DIY book. My local library was discarding it, and it looked way to interesting to pass up.

Back when Sports Afield did gun annuals (1953 in this case), their optics chapter included some really specific dimensional data:

 

[eastbank]

two of my old style unertl scopes on vintage .22 rifles.

 

[PzGren]

I have a couple dozen vintage scopes, mostly German and Austrian.
Hensoldts on Anschutz 1423s






S&B
\





Geco on a 1532

Triflex 3-12x52. Long research convinced me that it was one of the many names S&B used for orders from distributors, like Hubertus.

 

[tark]

Back in the day a lot of Savage 23D 22 Hornets got scoped from what I've read about that era. After all; in the pre- WW2 years they were a very common varmint rifle and the 22 Hornet is considered to be the pioneer of that entire ballistic genre that we now call varmint cartridges. This 23D has been seen on this web site before but this thread topic demands a replay. This one is wearing the original scope that was mounted to it when the rifle was new sometime in the mid to latter 1930's. It got replaced with a K-6 Weaver about 1966 and when I, ( the 3rd owner), acquired the gun in 1998 I was fortunate to get the original optics and mounts in a box that came with the rifle. Put all the original stuff back on the gun a few years later. It's an externally adjusted, 3/4" tube affair made by the former Wollensak Optical Co. of Rochester NY. Still works good for a scope of that era, and you have to remind yourself that we've all become a bit spoiled by the all the advances in optical technology since the 1930's. Once upon a time this was a state of the art varmint rifle and although the Hornet cartridge has its limitations compared to the bigger, newer, 22 centerfires that came after it, it is still a superb little varmint round. Which; as Tark opined; "works splendidly, within its limitations". Varmint hunters were some of the earliest to embrace optics and they accounted for a lot of scope sales before WW2 interrupted things for a while. ..View attachment 1062952...View attachment 1062955...View attachment 1062956...View attachment 1062957...

That's a really nice 23D 22250REM. Very nice wood. I get 1-1/2" groups at 100 with mine, curious as to your accuracy . I use PPU factory 45 gr. ammo in mine, my handloads cannot better the PPU ammo, so I quit trying.

 

[22250Rem]

Thanks for the compliment. Best accuracy I ever got was about an inch; maybe 3/4" at 100 yds. on a good day. That was with handloads that I spent a lot of time developing and they were only marginally better than factory ammo. Not worth me buying factory ammo when handloads are cheaper. Never hot rodded the handloads either, as I once read that 23D's don't do well on a steady diet of hot loads.

 

[PzGren]

Since we have started talking groups, I had told my youngest son that we'd go shooting and when he came and was ready I asked which pistols I should take. He timidly told me that he felt that he needed to brush up his rifle skills and asked what I would recommend.
Easy answer for me; Anschutz 1423 with a 2 3/4 magnification Hensoldt. A challenge at 100 meters, about 110 yards.



He did well. He is now rifle certified with DPD and has to requalify every month with an AR. I am proud to have passed the torch on.

 

[someguy2800]

I’ve tried to get into truely vintage scopes but I’ve been disappointed more than a few times by optical quality, tracking, and reticle alignment so I’ve given up on that. I do insist on finding gloss scopes to put on all my vintage polished blued rifles though. I have a pretty good collection of 80’s and 90’s era Bushnell banner and throphy BDC’s going.

 

[Offfhand]

Another step back in memory is this early 1950's SAKO .222 Rem with Mannlicher stock and an era-matching Lyman 10X Wolverine. Lyman's American made Wolverine scopes appeared in the late 1930's and had unusual 26mm main tube diameter. Which made them a smidgen of an inch too big to fit in standard 1" mounting rings, causing considerable confusion and aggravation amongst shooters and accessory dealers.

 

[highlander 5]

Don't know if the rifle I have qualifies Shiloh Sharps Long Range Express with a Malcolm style scope.
Everytume I have it at the range it attracts attention. Wish I could post a pic.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Old Redfield Junior 4X on my Romanian M69


El Paso Weaver K4 on my .243 '99.

Both these rifles need a fair amount of eye relief so the low-powered fixed scopes are perfect for them.

 

[tark]

Never hot rodded the handloads either, as I once read that 23D's don't do well on a steady diet of hot loads.

Sounds like you have read Bolt Action Rifles by Frank DeHaas! Lol. I've also heard that from other sources. I did a crude hardness test on the locking lug on the bottom of my bolt, and the root of the bolt handle. A file would bite into both, but only with difficulty. And it did dull the file. Those surfaces are hardened, at least on my rifle. Can't say for sure about the receiver, but I don't shoot the gun that much. I'm comfortable with a light diet of factory ammo.

 

[Rubone]

Fixed 2.5X Bushnell Banner with tip-off Weaver rings on a 336 Marlin in .35 Remington.