Picking up expended ordanance

[c.latrans]

And....Arizona_Mike......I have a mother....but thanks. Mods please close this thread, it was posted simply to share a fun experience among shooters, not to apease trolls....but if you, Mike feel the need to share your vast knowledge, I spelled "appease" this way to offer more fodder for your obviously spare time........

 

[rcmodel]

Nobody knew what it was, but we felt safe with it because it didn't have any kind of fuse or arming mechanism.

This is an unfused Hotchkiss 2 pounder armor perching round from WWI.

Impact with a ships steel hull set it off!



It floated around peoples homes and flea markets for 50-60 years until I decided to buy it and shoot it with a 30-06 from 100 yards away.

Turned out it was still full of HE, and it flew 200 yards in the air like a spinning pin-wheel burning out after the 30-06 round hit it!!

You could not even see the AP tip thread joint where it was screwed together after filling, until I shot it and the pressure almost blew the threads out.

rc

 

[c.latrans]

AZ Mike...my apologies...went off half cocked so to speak. Hope this appeases your intellectual superiority.....catch that one too?

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Seriously I was not picking on you and not even directing the post at you personally.

I don't nit pick spelling as I myself an a horrible speller and am a fast but not accurate touch-typer. It is very common for these words to be mistaken for one another or even not understood to be different words, not simply misspelled or mistyped. As I insinuated, professional journalists confuse these words all the time.

I apologize if you took it that way but that was not my intent.

Mike

 

[goon]

And....Arizona_Mike......I have a mother....but thanks. Mods please close this thread, it was posted simply to share a fun experience among shooters, not to apease trolls....but if you, Mike feel the need to share your vast knowledge, I spelled "appease" this way to offer more fodder for your obviously spare time........

I'm glad you did post them. Always been a history nut and there have been lots of finds locally. There used to be a farm a couple miles away with a field out on the old floodplain of the West Branch of the Susquehanna. They found so many points there from working that field... but I've never found any myself.
Good finds.

 

[Trent]

Old base fuzed shells can appear as solid bodies with a ring at the base - all the "nifty stuff" is hidden away in the body.

M534A1 base fuze used by the US army in 105mm guns (circa WWII...):



Were common once upon a time. Still are in certain munitions.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

A Civil War cannon "ball" found on land is highly likely to be an explosive shell rather than a solid shot. (Solid cannon ball good for poking holes in ship hulls, explosive shells good for disrupting infantry or cavalry charges.)

I have nothing but respect for EOD guys, they play with some bad news stuff.

A few years ago, the local PD EOD received the report that a landlord found half a case of dynamite stored under a rented trailer. I believe it was the commercial nitroglycerine based dynamite, abandoned and left outdoors over the winter. Bad news. Those guys deserve kudos for dealing with stuff like that.

I had good reason to accept that the 3.5" expended dummy rocket my uncle gave to me and my brother was inert; the same item found at a firing range, or flea market, I would be suspicious of.

But on the opening post, my uncles used to find flint arrowheads almost every time they plowed their fields for corn.

 

[230RN]

Nobody seemed to mention spent depleted uranium cored projectiles. Are they all that dangerous?

I don't know. That's why I'm asking.

Terry

 

[witchhunter]

C. latrans, I was calling in northern Nevada several years ago, I used a rock blind by a spring that was obviously made by human hands MUCH previous to my finding it... I found several old casings, .38-55, .25 Stevens, .32-40, .50-70 mostly the .38-55's I figured some old timer probably with a single shot took home venison regularly as it looked like a great ambush spot for thirsty deer....

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Nobody seemed to mention spent depleted uranium cored projectiles. Are they all that dangerous?

I don't know. That's why I'm asking.

Terry

No, they have less radioactivity than natural uranium ore. DU is used as counter weights and trim weights in civilian aviation and as medical radiation shielding. Until recently DU was used in porcelain products including false teeth. DU was 10% by weight of a popular enamel manufactured in France until 2000. The Alpha and Beta emissions from DU won't even penetrate one sheet of paper and the gamma emissions are very low.

Aside from radioactivity, Uranium is poisonous for chemical reasons. The impact of DU shells on armor creates both DU powder and vapors which carry some health risk although the amount of risk is debated. The radioactivity risk is likely greater for uranium inside the body then encountered in metal form outside the body.

I would probably not spend much time in an area impacted by DU projectiles as the uranium tends to burn on impact and uranium oxides are water soluble and would not eat or drink until washing by body and clothing. I would not pick up any non-intact projectiles.

Mike

 

[Radar3006]

Just do a search on youtube for metal detecting battlefields ..A lot of people make good money selling WW ll relics

 

[rhinoh]

As a child we lived on base at Quantico in the mid-60's. A friend and I found a case of 7.62 blanks we drug home.
We poked the wads out and emptied many to get the gunpowder trying to make small bombs.
Fortunately at 12 and with no internet we were ignorant about how to do this exactly. We did make many flash fires though!
Still makes we wonder what our dads, both Marine officers, would have done if they had ever caught us..maybe now that dad is 83 I would be safe to tell him about it

 

[buckstrucks]

On one of the last patrols when I was in the CG our MPA(Engineering Warrant officer) found a bofors 40mm casing in the harbor at Adak Island. I wonder what ship shot that round, and at what to this day.

 

[plateshooter]

I was a US Army EOD specialist from 1968 to 1971. I was assigned to the EOD unit at Ft Riley KS during part of my time. We used to work with ATF out of Kansas City. About once a month we had to go to the USPS postal hub in Kansas City to pick up ordnance that was being mailed back from Viet Nam. People were shipping live grenades, B40 rockets, blasting caps and other stuff that would be caught by the ATF. We would pick it up and destroy it back at the base. We would also work clearing house fires etc that had ordnance in them for the fire and police departments in 4 states. I was amazed at what some people had in their houses.

I am only saying this to advise that there is a lot of dangerous ordnance around and unless you are 100% positive that the device is inert, (1/4" hole drilled through it so you can see it is empty), I would suggest not handling it, and call someone who is getting paid to dispose of it safely.

 

[230RN]

^

" (1/4" hole drilled through it so you can see it is empty)"

Is that good advice for the non-professional? What if they drilled into the primary explosive (detonator)?

Terry

 

[desidog]

How about some concertina wire and casings from WW1?



This is a Turkish trench position overlooking ANZAC cove at Gallipoli. The cedar wood they used for emplacements doesn't rot, and the wire was galvanized.

 

[plateshooter]

I wouldn't be drilling into any ordnance I did not know was empty. That used to be the way that inert items were done and shown to be safe to handle.

 

[Trent]

Best way to 'drill a hole' in ordinance is exactly how RC showed.

From a few hundred yards away, with a highpower rifle.

Heat and friction from a drill can set off certain explosives.

Some of the explosives they used in WWII weren't exactly stable. While most fillers were Comp-B, the primer, detonator, and booster compounds were *significantly* more sensitive. A lot of boosters were straight RDX. Primer compounds were about the same as we use, highly sensitive to impact, although heavily shielded. The detonators were potent but not enough to set off the main charge, which is why there is a booster charge in most fuses.

RC's navy shell just relied on kinetic impact to set off the charge.

Others were a lot more complex.

Problem is, if you drill through them in the wrong spot, and hit the detonator or booster charge instead of the main charge... "boom".

Even if you miss those and get to the main charge emptied, the fuse will still be intact.. which, having the detonator and the booster charge, is plenty potent enough to remove an arm, or worse, in most shells. Of course, getting the main charge out, even if you drilled in to it, would be somewhat tricky and dangerous. It's poured in and solidifies inside the casing. Removal isn't exactly something you want to do in your kitchen (despite what you see in movies).

Not something to toy around with.

Older civil war era shells were simply filled with black powder, which is friction sensitive. Drill in to that and it'll go off. Hell, DROP it hard enough, it'll go off.

But would be fun to shoot with a 50 cal.

 

[limpingbear]

When I was growing up, I used to visit my relatives in Utah for a couple weeks during the summer. Well my aunt and uncle had a few large projectiles as porch ornaments. I think they were 105mm projectiles. Every now and then a city code inspector would come by the house and look at them. I remember tipping one over and seeing that it was just the projectile casing as the inside was hollow. Neat to look at but heavy....

 

[plateshooter]

Where did some of you guys get the idea that you would drill through a piece of ordnance that was not empty? The idea is to empty the ordnance, then drill through it to show that it is empty. When I was in that business, anything with out that hole was considered a live round. That is best left to experts. Messing around with that stuff can get you killed.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

Inert ordnance sold as curios or military keepsakes at Army/Navy surplus stores have holes drilled in them by the processors to show that they are inert.

...unless you are 100% positive that the device is inert, (1/4" hole drilled through it so you can see it is empty),...

To me the poster is suggesting you look for (not drill) the hole.

 

[gpjoe]

plateshooter - I guess you have to spell it out for some folks:

All plateshooter was saying was that the only way to be sure a round is hamless is if it ALREADY has a hole drilled in/through it, otherwise assume the round is live and don't touch it. He was NOT advocating that anyone drill into a round.

Better?

Edit: Carl beat me to it.

 

[plateshooter]

Thanks guys, I would hate to see a fellow "High Roader" take a wound or worse due to a misunderstanding.

 

[doc2rn]

Biggest thing I ever found was a civil war cannon ball while walking by railroad tracks outside of Topeka Kansas.

 

[230RN]

"I am only saying this to advise that there is a lot of dangerous ordnance around and unless you are 100% positive that the device is inert, (1/4" hole drilled through it so you can see it is empty), I would suggest not handling it, and call someone who is getting paid to dispose of it safely. "

Boy, that sure could have been phrased a little better. Sorry for my misinterpretation.

Terry