Pocket .32 help needed

[jwalker497]

I was thinking of a pcoket gun and the only 2 I could find in the size that I want are the Guardian .32/.380 and the Seecamp .32/.380.

For me size is the biggest issue and the smallest of these 4 options is the seecamps but the .380 is too expensive, so that's out. And the guardian .380 is too heavy so that's out. So I guess I am left with the .32's.

Can anyone post a comparison of a Guardian .32 and and a seecamp .32?? Based on the specs, it seems they are pretty close. I know the guardian is a bit heavier and a tad longer but they seem pretty close with the guardian being a lil bit heavier/longer.

I was hoping someone here owns both these or has a pic of these 2 models side to side. That would be really helpful in helping me decide since I probably will never handle these before getting one. Also, I;ve seen some pics where 1 gun is superimposed over another gun over a larger one to help assess the size difference, if someone could do that, that would also be very helpful.

Also, What's the price difference between these 2 .32s go for on the street?
how does the recoil between guns of this size in .32 compare? I do have a P3AT and don't have an issue with it, and I've read the seecamp is pretty harsh but was curious?

Is the .32 sufficient to carry as a lone gun for self defense when u cant carry anything else or is .380 significantly better in this case. I guess in other words, w/o a big caliber debate, in this size gun, is there a noticeable difference between a .32 and a .380?



Sorry for the long post and thanks to anyone can help!

 

[mavracer]

I guess in other words, w/o a big caliber debate, in this size gun, is there a noticeable difference between a .32 and a .380?

if you use domestic 32 ammo yes,If you use fiocchi or sellier & bellot not so much.
and cant vouch for the guardian but my seecamp 32 has been flawless.

 

[Robert Hairless]

Although I've no firsthand experience with a Seecamp .380, a most reliable source has told me that the difference in recoil from its .32 version is substantial.

My own Seecamp .32 has been in service since about 1987, I believe, and continues to perform reliably. Although it was designed to perform only with Winchester Silvertips I've experimented with many others and found that it works well with them all except, I believe, UMC. The overall length of that cartridge is too long for the magazine.

The way I think about this kind of handgun is that it's both the one gun to carry when I can't carry a gun and it's exclusively a bad breath range, last gasp, he's-on-top-of-me-and-going-to-kill-me self-defense firearm. Neither extreme accuracy nor what we like to call "stopping power" are my concerns. Ultimate concealability and reliability are. So for me the caliber of this size gun doesn't make much difference.

This is the handgun I carry when I'm required to dress so that I can't carry anything more substantial in size or caliber. I once used a tiny .22 caliber Smith & Wesson 61 for that purpose but became uncomfortable when I was unable to get additional factory magazines for it quite some time ago. Otherwise I'd probably have continued to use it.

These are not handguns to be fired often. Many people mind the recoil. I don't. I've found that I can do a reasonably tight rapidfire group with the Seecamp .32 at 7 yards, which I consider to be far in excess of what I expect or need from it. I'll practice with mine by shooting a magazine full or two every year or two, mainly so my hand remembers the experience.

I know nothing about the Guardian and don't know its street price. The Seecamp is pricey. I'm happy with mine.

 

[mainmech48]

The Seecamps and Guardians are blow-back; the Keltecs are locked- breech. Blow-backs always seem to deliver a harsher recoil impulse to me.

IIRC, the Seecamps used to be marked with something like: ".32 Win. Silvertip Only". Don't know if it's still the case. Can't say about either of the .380 versions, as I've never actually handled one.

I bought my P32 because it had the locked-breech (meaning a much broader selection in load options to me), and was smaller, lighter, flatter and less expensive than any of the other options in the caliber then available. It was also slimmer, more powerfull and more reliable than the Beretta M21 .22 RF it replaced as my 'always on me' carry.

As you say that you want the smallest package you can get, you have a P3AT that you've had no issues with, and the P32 remains smaller, lighter, slimmer and much less expensive than the others, I'm curious about why it has to be a Seecamp or Guardian instead.

 

[jwalker497]

"I'm curious about why it has to be a Seecamp or Guardian instead."

It's my understanding the P32 is not much smaller than the P3AT and the seecamp is almost 1 inch smaller than the P3AT.

 

[Rex B]

I agree, looks like the man needs a Kel-Tec. Or a Ruger LCP.

As much as I like the idea of a well-made gun in all-stainless, for the size and money it's hard to beat a Kel-Tec. They won't win any beauty contests, but they work.

 

[camper]

Why exactly is the 380 Guardian "too heavy?" Pocket carry mine most of the time and don't even know it's there.

 

[romma]

keltec! Awesome .32... I load mine with Dynamit Nobel... Hot ammo!

 

[deputy tom]

I own a Seecamp .32 and a keltec p-32.I used to own a Guardian .32.I love the Seecamp,wished I hadn't sold the Guardian and had to go thru four other p-32's before I got one that is 100 % reliable like the Seecamp is and Guardian was.The only thing in the p-32's favor is it's light weight,otherwise I'd trade it for another Guardian.YMMV.tom.

 

[jwalker497]

Thanks for the feedback but I already have a P3AT and yes it fits the pocket niche nicely (I love the gun and not getting rid of it) but I like small sized guns and want something even smaller. The P32 is only a fraction smaller than the P3AT, whereas the guardian and seecamp, especially seecamp, are significantly smaller, albeit heavier.

I still would like to see some comparison pics if anyone has any!!

I guess I have 2 questions that keep resurfacing.

1. If a person was looking for a pocket gun and was considering the Guardian and Seecamp models (ignoring a specific caliber), aside from Price, why would anyone choose the guardian over the seecamp?? seems like Seecamps win in every category over the guardians, except for price in the .380 models. But the .32s are soo close in price therefore the guardian may lose in every category there.

2. If a person was in the market for a pocket gun and was considering the seecamps only, aside from price, why would anyone choose the .32 over the .380 since they are exactly the same dimensions?? None of these pistols are range pistols and are going to be for defensive carry, therefore, wouldn't you want any extra advantage in stopping power even if it maybe minimal??

 

[bannockburn]

jwalker497

Did you check out Bobos pocket auto comparison chart? It's the fourth Sticky down from the top of Handguns: Autoloaders page.

 

[usp9]

2. If a person was in the market for a pocket gun and was considering the seecamps only, aside from price, why would anyone choose the .32 over the .380 since they are exactly the same dimensions?? None of these pistols are range pistols and are going to be for defensive carry, therefore, wouldn't you want any extra advantage in stopping power even if it maybe minimal??

One would choose a .32 over a .380 for the following reasons;
1) Price
2) Availability. The .380 is hard to come by, the wait is long, whereas a .32 can be had in short order.
3) Recoil of the .380 is hard on older, weaker hands. A .32 isn't fairly easy to shoot in comparison.

Other than that there isn't a good reason, theoretically, to opt for a .32 over a .380 Seecamp

 

[deercop]

In my "pocket pistol" history, I started with a NAA Guardian .32. After several trips back to NAA for FTF/FTE/sights dramatically off, they replaced the entire gun. The replacement gun had the same issues. It got traded for a NAA .22 Mag, which I still have.

Then, I stumbled across a NIB Seecamp .32 at a local store, shortly after my divorce, so I actually had money to spend. I still have it and carry it daily.

Then, I bought a Kel Tec P32. Nice enough gun, reliable, accurate, etc. But, it just didn't seem to be the "quality" of the Seecamp, and it was just about too big for my rear pocket. Also, got to thinking about my 200 lbs on top of a polymer frame for several hours a day. Anyway, it went on down the road.

Then, I got a Kel Tec P3AT. Reliable, accurate, but ouch, it actually hurt my knuckle by banging against the triggerguard in recoil. It went on down the road.

Now I am expecting delivery of my 2nd (spare) Seecamp .32. Should be here in the next couple of days.

I guess my point is, I'm partial to the Seecamp .32.

 

[deercop]

FYI, I ordered my spare Seecamp from http://www.migunslingers.com/ for $385 plus $20 shipping.

 

[jwalker497]

I really would like a seecamp .380 but the price of $800 seems a bit much for this type of pistol. Very hard to justify when the .32 can be had for half!!

So my thinking is just how much defensive power would I be giving up if I went with the seecamp .32 instead of the seecamp .380???? I looked at the ballistics stuff and I just cant tell. Some people say there is no noticeable difference and other say there is. soo on that I remain confused.

Then I wonder maybe the.32s lighter recoil and ability to get more shots off quicker and more accurately offer an advantage of it's own - that makes the decision a wash almost?? I do not hold too much stock in those stopping power numbers because it is after all based on 1 shot and If I am going to pull the trigger, I most likely will pull it a few times, so hows that factor into the equation?? 2 inaccurate shots with a .380 or 3 accurate shots with a .32, how do you compare that?

Regardless it seems the Guardian's are out for me. Although I think they are cool, the .380 doesn't compete with the seecamp .380 in terms of size and weight - the .380 kills it in every category. As for the .32s, the seecamps again are lighter and smaller, prettier in my opinion and are less than $50 more??? Again, why buy the guardian??

The only advantage the guardian has over the seecamp is I would prefer a side mag release button over a heel release but that's not enough to base a decision on. Size is the most important factor.

my decision comes down to - Am I willing to splurge for the .380?? Probably not. Would I feel comfortable with s smaller .32 bullet and quicker follow-up shots?? I just don't know yet and would love to hear your thoughts. Thanks!

 

[deercop]

The only advantage the guardian has over the seecamp is I would prefer a side mag release button over a heel release

Major NEGATIVE factor for me.

I cannot realistically envision a situation where a speed reload would be performed on a pistol in this category.

Also, far more important to me, even in a quality pocket holster, the side button was activated on a regular basis when I had my Guardians. I found myself constantly checking to see if the mag had popped out slightly, making it a single shot. Never ever has that happened with my Seecamp, and I've been carrying it daily for 5 years.

 

[usp9]

I second deercop's comments. The mag release on the Seecamp, as well as many other pocket guns, is where it is for a reason. The button mag release IMHO is a design flaw in certain pocket guns such as Keltec and NAA. It is there for marketing reasons, not practicality.

 

[jcd15]

I have a naa 32 auto .
Very easy to carry and i think I have had 1 fte in over 2000 rounds at the range.
I carry my guardian in a galco iwb deep cover or on my ankle.
This gun is good for what I need it for close 5 yards or less empty 7 round quickly.Never had a problem with the gold dot ammo I use while carrying.

 

[jwalker497]

It seems that the more I read about the .32 as a realistic pocket gun solution, I see more people carrying a .32acp. I am actually suprised by this as I always considered the .32acp to be sub-standard in terms of a defensive caliber.

For me this is good news and something I never thought about is reinforcing my urge to get one, quicker and more accurate follow up shots. That just makes sense to me.

 

[PaulBk]

I think you'll find that the popularity of mouse guns directly proportional to the rise in shall issue states. They are simply an excellent option for those of us who don't feel particularly threatened, but still want to carry a very concealable SD weapon.

I currently live, work, and play in a very safe environment. Many times a .32/.380 is all I feel the need to carry. When I lived a couple of miles from south-central L.A, a .50 wouldn't have made me feel comfortable.

-Paul

BTW- In addition to the points already raised, most .32's get an extra cartridge relative to the same .380 models

 

[mgregg85]

The only pocket .32 that I would recommend would be the sp101 in .327 magnum, hope you've got big pockets for that piece though.

Other than that, the P32 seems to be the way to go, or man up and carry the P3AT.

 

[flyby]

with over 1k+ rds and not a single ftf/fte ..is very light and is hard to imagine needing anything smaller