Positive ending CCW story involving female outside of the home in Chicago

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Aim1

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For those that say women shouldn’t CCW because they will be over-powered and their weapon will be used against them.


Suspect was also armed with a pistol which he aimed at the victim. She was able to draw and shoot the suspect once in the neck.


This incident also happened outside of the home which is important because many claim the 2nd Amendments doesn’t apply outside of the home.

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https://www.foxnews.com/us/woman-wi...ould-be-robber-at-chicago-bus-stop-police-say
 
There was a story here in the Houston Chronicle yesterday (I will try and find it) about a store owner who pulled a gun to threaten a robber...who took it away and killed the store owner with it. Kudos to the lady in Chicago.

From Houston Chronicle January 8, 2019

Salon manager killed with own gun

A manager at a Greenspoint area salon was shot to death with his own gun early Sunday during a robbery, police said.

The manager, identified by the medical examiner as Kodjo Yabi, was collecting money for a small concert at the salon in the 17500 block of Imperial Valley Drive just after midnight when he was shot.

Yabi, 29, was protecting the business and had a gun, according to police. The suspect took that gun from him and shot him once. He fled with the weapon and cash, police said.
 
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Glad to hear it. On Chicago's far South Side police presence is sparse and often actively harmful even when present. I’m happy she was able to defend herself and I hope she does not face too much hassle and expense from the legal system over this.
 
The woman, who suffered minor injuries during the incident, is not expected to face charges.
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I wonder if there was an assault (fists, feet, elbows or pistol whipped etc) that wasn't reported.

How did she get injured otherwise? Fell while running away?
 
Laavion Goings

Previous charges - Booking Charge:
720 ILCS 570/402(A)(1)(A)

Possession of a Controlled Substance
  • Up to Class 1 Felony
  • Up to 50 years in prison
  • Fines up to $250,000
https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/19-year-old-shot-fernwood-concealed-carry-holder-identified/

Goings pleaded guilty Nov. 1 to possession of methamphetamine, Cook County court records showed. He had initially also faced six counts of aggravated battery to a peace officer in connection with the same case, but the charges were later dropped by prosecutors.

The charges stemmed from his arrest in June, when Goings was charged with possession of a controlled substance and attacking a police officer in the Englewood neighborhood on the South Side.

He was taken into custody after being identified as the target of a search warrant about 6:50 p.m. on June 7, 2018 in the 5900 block of South Elizabeth Street, on charges of felony possession of a controlled substance, Chicago police said.

During the arrest, Goings allegedly pushed a police officer. He then caused damage to a CPD vehicle while being taken in for processing, police said.
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The woman, however, was prepared. She pulled out her own weapon and shot Goings in the neck before fleeing the area to seek help.
Police found Goings about a block away. He was taken to a hospital where he later died.

In the neck! That was good thinking. That is a deadly spot to shoot.
 
jmace57 said:
There was a story here in the Houston Chronicle yesterday (I will try and find it) about a store owner who pulled a gun to threaten a robber...who took it away and killed the store owner with it. Kudos to the lady in Chicago.
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Almost EVERY failed self-defense situation of which I've heard involved hesitation or a lack of seriousness on the part of the victim.

You don't use a gun for "threats".

Shoot or don't pull it at all.
 
Good Ol' Boy said:
That is absolutely NOT the approach to take for SD.

While there is the issue of unlawfully brandishing, if the threat ceases to exist once the weapon is drawn there is no reason to shoot.
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I think what he's saying is more along the lines of don't hesitate.

Some people believe that when they draw that the assailant will be scared off and that this will be enough to end the encounter.

If so, that's great. However it's not a good idea to count on that.
 
Good Ol' Boy said:
That is absolutely NOT the approach to take for SD.

While there is the issue of unlawfully brandishing, if the threat ceases to exist once the weapon is drawn there is no reason to shoot.
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If I present the firearm, the threat probably won't have TIME to reconsider.

When my firearm has been pointed at the threat, the time for talk has already passed. I've already decided to shoot. The only delay is in aligning the sights on the threat and squeezing the trigger. That doesn't give the threat much time to a) decide to stop being a threat, b) make that concretely apparent to me. More importantly, it doesn't give him much time to harm me.

As I said, damned near every failed self-defense situation I've ever heard of involved hesitation, bargaining, posturing, etc. I'm not going to risk my life to protect that of someone who's made the conscious decision to make himself an immediate and credible threat to that life.

Some decisions are unrecoverable errors, like Aeroflot pilots letting their kids take the controls of the airliner or being an immediate and credible threat to my life and limb.
 
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Browning said:
I think what he's saying is more along the lines of don't hesitate.

Some people believe that when they draw that the assailant will be scared off and that this will be enough to end the encounter.

If so, that's great. However it's not a good idea to count on that.
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Correct.

Your assailant has already made his decision. Make yours and act on it resolutely and without trepidation. Your assailant may have no idea what he's doing from one second to the next. Don't assume that you can read his mind better than he can.
 
Good Ol' Boy said:
That is absolutely NOT the approach to take for SD.

While there is the issue of unlawfully brandishing, if the threat ceases to exist once the weapon is drawn there is no reason to shoot.
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Neither do you think of it as a magical talisman that is going to instantly cause a bad actor to reform and start singing Christmas Carols. If the guy had his weapon pulled and had it taken away from him it's clear he forgot to pull the trigger enough times - if at all.

As for the OP, it's a heartwarming story but I have the feeling by the time Cook county's 'justice system' is finished she will find it would have been cheaper and the rape less degrading to just let the crog do what he wanted without resistance.
 
Sorry, we don't have good data on how many crimes were deterred by the brandishing of a gun "get the heck away from me I have a gun" or "get out of my house I have a gun".

In my opinion I think it's probably a lot.
 
Kaybee said:
Sorry, we don't have good data on how many crimes were deterred by the brandishing of a gun "get the heck away from me I have a gun" or "get out of my house I have a gun".

In my opinion I think it's probably a lot.
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According to the NRA it's the thousands per year!
 
Good for her!

She must have been packing a 44 magnum... because we all know that a single round of .380 could never kill a person.... but seriously I wonder what she was carrying?
 
Deanimator said:
If I present the firearm, the threat probably won't have TIME to reconsider. . .
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Well said!

I don't owe some cretin who chose to threaten me a fair chance to change plans on the basis of new information. If he can stop presenting a threat, and make that adequately apparent to me, before the hammer falls, well and good. If not, welcome to the real world.

I'm not carrying this gun to be noticed, and I'm certainly not going to intentionally delay using it for the purpose of letting a threat notice it and adapt his plan.
 
Deanimator said:
If I present the firearm, the threat probably won't have TIME to reconsider.

When my firearm has been pointed at the threat, the time for talk has already passed. I've already decided to shoot. The only delay is in aligning the sights on the threat and squeezing the trigger. That doesn't give the threat much time to a) decide to stop being a threat, b) make that concretely apparent to me. More importantly, it doesn't give him much time to harm me.

As I said, damned near every failed self-defense situation I've ever heard of involved hesitation, bargaining, posturing, etc. I'm not going to risk my life to protect that of someone who's made the conscious decision to make himself an immediate and credible threat to that life.

Some decisions are unrecoverable errors, like Aeroflot pilots letting their kids take the controls of the airliner or being an immediate and credible threat to my life and limb.
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That's always been my thought as well: if I'm drawing my gun it's only because I'm convinced I'm going to die if I don't. The threat probably doesn't have time to signal a change in intent between the time I reach for the gun and the time the first shot is fired. I doubt I'm any sort of quick draw champion but I imagine that time interval is a fairly short one.
 
Elkins45 said:
That's always been my thought as well: if I'm drawing my gun it's only because I'm convinced I'm going to die if I don't. The threat probably doesn't have time to signal a change in intent between the time I reach for the gun and the time the first shot is fired. I doubt I'm any sort of quick draw champion but I imagine that time interval is a fairly short one.
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Plus he's got to react to it in an ABSOLUTELY unambiguous way, either by dropping his gun and raising his hands, or running like hell away from me. I doubt [in his likely addled state] that he's going to have time to process the situation and react appropriately before he gets shot.
 
Elkins45 said:
That's always been my thought as well: if I'm drawing my gun it's only because I'm convinced I'm going to die if I don't. The threat probably doesn't have time to signal a change in intent between the time I reach for the gun and the time the first shot is fired. I doubt I'm any sort of quick draw champion but I imagine that time interval is a fairly short one.
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Deanimator said:
Plus he's got to react to it in an ABSOLUTELY unambiguous way, either by dropping his gun and raising his hands, or running like hell away from me. I doubt [in his likely addled state] that he's going to have time to process the situation and react appropriately before he gets shot.
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Thats a lot to communicate in one to two seconds. Average draw and fire times from my family, friends and myself seems to run the spectrum from a friend who can do screaming sub 1 second one rd hits from appendix, to practiced shooters doing anything from 1.3 to 2ish concealed IWB depending on age, physical health, experience and training, garment & holster type (parka, jacket, t-shirt, leather holster, kydex holster etc) and whether they're warmed up or not (you should be counting your first tries as more realistic).

The shooter also has to recognize that they no longer represent a threat to their life while their adrenaline is going. Short of literally dropping their gun and running away with their hands in plain sight I'm not sure how they'd do that. Even then, I'm not sure that everyone would believe it once they're already to the point where they're drawing and intent on ending a threat to their life and potentially the lives of their family with gunfire.

Seems like a tall order. Better to not be a criminal preying on others to begin with.
 
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The trick is to prevent excess adrenaline from flowing. This could potentially save your life and lives of others.
 
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