Pre-1899 antiques, the gift for Californians!

[cpileri]

Well, that's the question anyway:

Is it legal to give/trade/transfer/take posession of a pre-1899 antique (and not otherwise NFA classified) cartridge arm in California?

On a related note, any Californians ordered and received any of those antique mausers or martini-henry's that are around?

If anyone knows the reference to the CA law that deals with antiques, please post it.

Thanks in advance!
C-

 

[cpileri]

hey check this out!

From the CA DOJ website:http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs.htm#top

5. Can I give a firearm to my adult child? Can he/she give it back to me later?
Yes, as long as the adult child receiving the firearm is not in a prohibited category and the firearm is a legal firearm to possess, the transfer of a firearm between a parent and child or a grandparent and grandchild is exempt from the dealer transfer requirement. However, if the firearm is a handgun, you must submit an Report of Operation of Law or Intra-Familial Handgun Transaction and $19 fee to the DOJ within 30 days. Assault weapons may not be transferred in this fashion. See Penal Code section 12285, subdivision (b).

(PC section 12076(c))

6. Can I give a firearm to my spouse? Can he/she give it back to me later?
Yes, as long as the person receiving the firearm is not in a prohibited category and the firearm is not an assault weapon, the transfer of a firearm between a husband and wife is exempt from the requirement to use a licensed dealer to perform the transfer. However, if the firearm is a handgun, the recipient must submit an Report of Operation of Law or Intra-Familial Handgun Transaction and $19 fee to the DOJ within 30 days.

(PC sections 12076(f), 12078(i))

14. I want to sell a gun to another person, i.e., a private party transfer. Am I required to conduct the transaction through a licensed California firearms dealer?
Yes. Firearm sales must be conducted through a fully licensed California firearms dealer. Failure to do so is a violation of California law. The buyer (and seller, in the event that the buyer is denied), must meet the normal firearm purchase and delivery requirements. "Antique firearms," as defined in Section 921(a)(16) of Title 18 of the United States Code, and curio or relic rifles/shotguns, defined in Section 178.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations that are over 50 years old, are exempt from this requirement.

But...
From the NRA CA page:
(2) antique firearms, which are defined as: any firearm not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or centerfire ammunition and manufactured in or before 1898 (including any matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap or similar type of ignition system or replica thereof, whether actually manufactured before 1898) and also any firearm manufactured in or before 1898 using fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the U.S. and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade;

So, those turks and Martini's fire cartridge rounds- and maybe not very common, but the ammo is available and some is even made in the US. Kinda muddies the water...

C-

 

[EOD Guy]

But...
From the NRA CA page:
(2) antique firearms, which are defined as: any firearm not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or centerfire ammunition and manufactured in or before 1898 (including any matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap or similar type of ignition system or replica thereof, whether actually manufactured before 1898) and also any firearm manufactured in or before 1898 using fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the U.S. and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade;

The NRA page is screwed up. That is an incorrect quote of California law. The definition given is from Section 479.11 of 27CFR and applies to firearms regulated under the National Firearms Act. California uses the definition in 27CFR 478.11 which is as follows:

TITLE 27--ALCOHOL, TOBACCO PRODUCTS, AND FIREARMS

CHAPTER II--BUREAU OF ALCOHOL, TOBACCO, FIREARMS, AND EXPLOSIVES,
DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE

PART 478_COMMERCE IN FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION--Table of Contents

Subpart B_Definitions

Sec. 478.11 Meaning of terms.


When used in this part and in forms prescribed under this part,
where not otherwise distinctly expressed or manifestly incompatible with
the intent thereof, terms shall have the meanings ascribed in this
section. Words in the plural form shall include the singular, and vice
versa, and words importing the masculine gender shall include the
feminine. The terms ``includes'' and ``including'' do not exclude other
things not enumerated which are in the same general class or are
otherwise within the scope thereof.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a
matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition
system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any
firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica
(1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional
centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional
centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the
United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary
channels of commercial trade.


Notice that the limitation on fixed ammunition only applies to replicas of antique firearms.

 

[Beethoven]

My dealer told me that a firearm qualifies for C&R status if it was manufactured before 1950 or so.

Dunno if C&R is different from Antique.

 

[EOD Guy]

C&R is different from antique. A firearm is classified as a C&R if it is on the C&R list published by BATF or it was manufactured more than 50 years ago. Antique firearms are those manufactured in or before 1898.