Precision Air Rifles - Where and what to buy?

[Peter M. Eick]

I was into air rifles back in the 80's and have several Beeman rifles. I understand that Beeman today has no relation to the Beeman I knew and looking at what is available they have available they don't seem to be dealing with the precision target rifles like I bought from them before.

So, I am looking for a nice quality rifle to play with on my ranch. I have an HW30 so I am looking for an upgrade. My Beeman 400 is still with me so I will continue to shoot it but I want more power. I really don't want to get into pre-charged as I like the concept and ease of a spring piston gun.

I was thinking about a Beeman R1 or R2 or something similar.

So any advice on where to buy and what to buy to someone who has been out of it for 30 years?

 

[Armor Snail]

Pyramid Air

 

[Pete D.]

Air

Pyramyd Air....of course.
You did not mention a budget. You did mention precision.
For top of the line air guns check Champions Choice.
Olympic/world championship quality.
Pete

 

[fpgt72]

There are a few others Airguns of Arizona are the only other on line "large volume" outfits I have personally done business with that would have what you are looking for.

Archer, Flying Dragon and a few others do the Chinese airguns and a few others, but for the most part are not going to have what you are looking for.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

I don't really have a budget in mind. If it cost me a thousand or so I would not care that much. I view this a long term investment in something I will shoot a lot. I want something precision with enough power to have fun with.

Since I have already done the precision target rifle route in my beeman 400 that I have shot now nearly 35 years next month.



I am interested in a real precision gun with a scope (eyes aren't that good anymore), that I can plink, hunt, informal target shoot and generally have a lot of fun with on the ranch.

So Pyramyd Air. Got it.

So I was thinking about a Beeman R1 or maybe an Diana or RWS 45 Sidelever like my 400? What are your thoughts on those two or what other ones should I consider?

I should add that I really don't want to mess with the precharged. Springers have treated me well and I still enjoy them.

Also what is the current take on caliber? Go for 177 to match my other guns or is 22 a better choice today?

To bad you can't find an HW55CM. I always regretted not buying one of those and a FWB300 back in the day.

 

[Louca]

Hi Peter,

You've got some nice equipment there. I also have the HW30S and an RWS (Diana) 75 T01 for precision target work. If you have .177 cal now, you might want to look into .22 for plinking where you might want just a little more energy delivered. I got a PCP gun and my only regret is I wished I would have gone .22 cal with that.

Lou

 

[Chevota]

Another vote for Airguns of Arizona. They have many of the guns Beeman rebranded and sold for more $, so you're getting that quality and paying less. Well, more since the 80's due to inflation, but less because the Beeman markup is gone.
The Beeman R1 is the Weihrauch HW80, the RX is the HW90. Heavy guns tho, and harder to cock. Much different than the HW30, fyi... Also, springers of that size prefer 22cal, 177 causes them to lose power, and they aren't all that powerful for their weight/cocking effort as it is. Better power than the 30, just not comparable to cheaper guns like a Benjamin Trail XL which is lighter, easier to cock, and makes more power.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

Thanks. I have sort of honed in on a 22 R1 or HW80. I like my HW and realize that the R1 is closer to an M1 Garand then my HW30 but what the heck. It is for the fun of it out at the ranch.

Now the game is to decide if a Diana/RWS 54 sidelever is a better choice than an R1?

Thanks for the advice on 22 vs 177. I had concluded about the same thing as I was reading over older posts.

 

[JohnKSa]

I'd take a look at Air Arms offerings before you make a purchase decision. They make some nice rifles and have models in under lever, breakbarrel and PCP configurations. The TX200 MKIII has developed a pretty impressive reputation in Field Target Springer Class.

 

[Chevota]

I would not even consider the Diana as an option if you have the coin for the HW. I've never had a 54, but I did own a 52 which was a disappointment and flat out dangerous, I will never own a side or under lever again. I have a couple 350's (a T05 and T06) which are better quality, but they're no HW. I'd say Diana is in between a Generic $100 Crosman and an HW. I took some pictures of my T06 350 if you want to see some of the typical flaws. The HW will be a work of art, and you can still soup them up. A guy just wrote me about his and he claims 26+ftlbs from his HW80 in .22 after some work. I think 22ftlbs is probably more the norm out of the box. chevota at hotmail if you want the pix and/or details about mods.

 

[Pete D.]

Precision

Precision....
In your budget. Hammerli AR20

$970.00

Not in your budget. Feinwerbau 800X

$3100.00

One needs to buy an airtank or, my recommendation for these rifles, a triple stage HP air pump. A few minutes fills both of the cylinders that come with the rifles and give more than a match worth of shooting.
Pete

 

[fpgt72]

Thanks. I have sort of honed in on a 22 R1 or HW80. I like my HW and realize that the R1 is closer to an M1 Garand then my HW30 but what the heck. It is for the fun of it out at the ranch.

Now the game is to decide if a Diana/RWS 54 sidelever is a better choice than an R1?

Thanks for the advice on 22 vs 177. I had concluded about the same thing as I was reading over older posts.

There are very few guns I wish I never got rid of but the RWS 54 is one of them, but it is one heavy bastage.

The 45 is basically the same deal without the "anti recoil" stuff they have built into it. Both really good guns....I do miss it, and now as I am shooting 3lb rifles from a rest why not shoot a 10lb rifle from one. I was an idiot to sell it, if you buy one you will not be sorry.

As to PCP, You likely know the gun is/can be the most inexpensive part of the equation to put air into one of these things. Unless you like to channel your inner 12yr old and love that bicycle pump you better be ready to drop at least another $1000 to put air into the gun, more if you want to actually do it yourself.

PCP is fantastic technology, but for me it is not quite there yet, get a compressor under $500 and I will be a fanboi, till then I will give them a huge pass, they offer nothing to me.

 

[Pete D.]

Air$

I don't want to hijack this informative thread by turning it into a discussion about what is the best air source. Neither do I want anyone to be misled...

As to PCP, You likely know the gun is/can be the most inexpensive part of the equation to put air into one of these things. Unless you like to channel your inner 12yr old and love that bicycle pump you better be ready to drop at least another $1000 to put air into the gun, more if you want to actually do it yourself.

A grand? No.
And the air pump......Yes, a triple stage HP air pump ($199-$239) is required....at least. Could I spend a grand? Yes. Is it necessary? Not at all. The cylinders that come with match air rifles are easy to pump.....compared to some of the larger cylinders on sporting air guns. And .177s sip air. A Cylinder full will be good for 170-300 shots. An extra would obviously double that.
Pumping...it just ain't that hard to do.

No doubt there are some fine springers available.....the bottom line, as far as precision shooting is concerned, is that no serious competitor in air rifle or air pistol uses a spring gun. (I am talking about position shooting. Certainly there are other types of match shooting.)
The FWB model 65 is a classic match quality air pistol.....accurate, durable, reliable......I have not seen one at a match in years. Why? Because having to cock the thing 60 times in a match gets in the way of precise shooting and air rifle/pistol matches are games of 10s.
Remember...the OP asked about precision. Not one of the manufacturers of top shelf airguns offers a spring gun in that roll, not Hammerli, Steyr, Morini, Feinwerkbau, Walther, Anschutz.
Pete

 

[fpgt72]

I don't want to hijack this informative thread by turning it into a discussion about what is the best air source. Neither do I want anyone to be misled...

A grand? No.
And the air pump......Yes, a triple stage HP air pump ($199-$239) is required....at least. Could I spend a grand? Yes. Is it necessary? Not at all. The cylinders that come with match air rifles are easy to pump.....compared to some of the larger cylinders on sporting air guns. And .177s sip air. A Cylinder full will be good for 170-300 shots. An extra would obviously double that.
Pumping...it just ain't that hard to do.

No doubt there are some fine springers available.....the bottom line, as far as precision shooting is concerned, is that no serious competitor in air rifle or air pistol uses a spring gun. (I am talking about position shooting. Certainly there are other types of match shooting.)
The FWB model 65 is a classic match quality air pistol.....accurate, durable, reliable......I have not seen one at a match in years. Why? Because having to cock the thing 60 times in a match gets in the way of precise shooting and air rifle/pistol matches are games of 10s.
Remember...the OP asked about precision. Not one of the manufacturers of top shelf airguns offers a spring gun in that roll, not Hammerli, Steyr, Morini, Feinwerkbau, Walther, Anschutz.
Pete

Please provide the link to the sub $300 pump....unless you are talking about a bicycle pump. If that is the case not all of us want to channel that inner 12yr old child to fill the gun. Shoebox is about the most inexpensive way to put air into these guns that someone in his 50's (me) with medical issues wants to deal with.

If you want to pass on that you can tote around a scuba tank HEAVY and have it filled, pretty cheap around here less then a $20 for each fill. But it gets old, and when the most close shop is over 30min one way away that gets old real quick.

If you do not want that heavy scuba tank you can always go for a carbon fiber tank (KA CHING) but it might just save you that hernia operation. Getting a CF tank of any size is going to cost you $700 and that is just the tank, lets not forget the hoses and what not to get it all hooked up.

Yes you can do it for under $1000, will you want to...only you can say....if you love really hard to pump bicycle pumps or have a child you can make do it you might be able to get air into the thing for less of a pain in the butt. If not it will get old quick, speaking from personal experience.

Only you can answer the question if you want to be pumping more then shooting....guess it depends on what you are pumping, but a bicycle pump...no thank you.

Go to PA's site look at the options, give them a call, see what it takes to put air in a tank so you have more than 20 shots per fill. Personally I know of no one that really enjoys PCP that uses that idiot manual pump...why it sucks that's why, and after about 5 trips hauling that huge suba tank you are going to be looking at different ways there.

Rest assured if you stay in airgunning and you stay with PCP you will.....WILL have more then $1000 in just getting air into the thing. Even if that is just a large CF tank you take to the dive shop to have filled.

 

[Pete D.]

fpgt: I don't want to argue with you about the airgun game. You know a lot of stuff about shooting these things. But then I read about "more pumping than shooting" and about "20 shots per fill" and I wonder about your sources.
You insist on referring to a triple stage hpa air pump as a bicycle pump.
It ain't a bicycle pump (but you know that). Hard to pump? Hard...Easy....relative terms. I do not find pumping particularly taxing even at my age.

All of the manufacturers to whom I referred state that the air cylinder on the gun in question gets...at a minimum.....175 shots. Some get 300. Certainly not 20.
Yes...the other options are expensive but one does not have to go that route.
Pete
Have a happy Thanksgiving.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

I gave up on the pcp route when I realized my eyes were not "competitive" any more. I played the precision air rifle game when I was a kid with my Beeman 400. I competed but that was a long time ago and technology has moved passed me.

When I look at the PCP route and getting tanks and the like vs. a nice simple springer, I will stay with the springer. This is supposed to be just something fun to blast with on the ranch off the back porch and maybe do a bit of hunting. Not get into the arms race again on accuracy. Besides, I was never be more accurate than my Beeman 400 so at what point does getting even more precision matter to me?



Anyway, the dead is done.

I chose a 177 R1 from Pyramyd. I ordered it this morning. The 22 R1 is a special order of 8 weeks give or take. I looked at the 20 cal version but there were only 8 or 10 types of pellets available for 20 cal. So I went 177 since I have other 177's and had far more pellets and targets from the old days then I remembered. I think I have about 20,000 pellets from the mid 80's depending on how many tins are un-opened. I am sure I even have more stuff laying about.

I was pleased that I found my toolkit for my 400, the sight insert package and the spare snubbers I ordered for the sidecocker arm.

Edited to add, I found a copy of the Beeman R1 book that was autographed for a not bad price. It is on the way also.

 

[Pete D.]

Enjoy. Keep'em in the x-ring.

Pete

 

[Whip Lash]

You should look into RWS air rifles. They are German engineered and built with a lifetime guarantee. I have a RWS Model 48 which is a side cock spring action rifle. Mine is .177 caliber but RWS also offers it in .22 caliber. My .177 is advertised to shoot at 1100 feet per second. I have no chronograph to check that out but 1 cock and the lead really flies. It is a heavy but accurate rife. Pyramid Air should have several RWS models that you might like and in various affordable prices. Good luck.

 

[fpgt72]

fpgt: I don't want to argue with you about the airgun game. You know a lot of stuff about shooting these things. But then I read about "more pumping than shooting" and about "20 shots per fill" and I wonder about your sources.
You insist on referring to a triple stage hpa air pump as a bicycle pump.
It ain't a bicycle pump (but you know that). Hard to pump? Hard...Easy....relative terms. I do not find pumping particularly taxing even at my age.

All of the manufacturers to whom I referred state that the air cylinder on the gun in question gets...at a minimum.....175 shots. Some get 300. Certainly not 20.
Yes...the other options are expensive but one does not have to go that route.
Pete
Have a happy Thanksgiving.

Enjoy....so you tell me I fill the rifle up to 4000psi then I take the rifle and off I go for 200 shots.

PURE BS, but you know that as well.

Not saying that PCP is good or bad, just get the real facts and ain't no gun holding enough air for 200 shots.

As to the OP And I am glad you actually knew what it would take to start from scratch with PCP, and went with something that would allow you the fun you are looking for.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

I looked at the RWS's which I believe are made by Dianawerk? I like my Diana's that I have but I was not too thrilled with the new RWS/Diana products. Little things bothered me like plastic triggers and a lack of finish. I like keeping my air guns looking really nice and things like plastic triggers is a put off to me. I know they are not needed and not a structural piece so it was more than adequate, but still, I would prefer aluminum or steel.

I am a traditionalist at heart. I like the wood and steel for fine rifles and so I went with the R1. Maybe someday I will be able to see or handle an RWS/Diana 54/48 or similar and I will buy one then but for now, I will stay with the brand I know.

By the way, I ordered the rifle and a copy of the R1 book yesterday. Both have already shipped today. Talk about quick turn around!

 

[fpgt72]

PA is a great outfit to deal with. Did you do the 10 for $10 deal. I figure for an extra $10 it is worth it to me for the pain of having to send it back if something is messed up....just cheap insurance IMHO.

I have also done the service with the Archer QB air guns I have gotten from them as well. Again, just worth it to not have to bother with shipping it back if something is messed up.

 

[JohnKSa]

Enjoy....so you tell me I fill the rifle up to 4000psi then I take the rifle and off I go for 200 shots.

PURE BS, but you know that as well.

Pyramyd air tested the 800X FT and found it needed a refill after 120 shots. However, Pete D.'s post references the 800X, not the 800X FT. The 800X uses the same tank & pressure as the 800X FT but shoots about 300fps slower than the 800X FT. 200 shots per fill would certainly be within the realm of possibility.

The Hammerli AR20, the other airgun referenced in Pete D.'s post, is rated at 350 shots per fill.

Match PCP air rifles use very little air per shot.

Not saying that PCP is good or bad, just get the real facts...

My thoughts precisely.

 

[Pete D.]

Air

John: Thank you for taking the time to verify what I had written.
I do not BS anyone. Just like I never mention filling a 3kpsi air rifle to 4kpsi with a 3kpsi pump.
Pere

 

[WNTFW]

Pete,
Thanks for the comments. I have always had good info from you.
Please keep up the good work.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

FPgt72,

Yes you get the 10/10 deal when you order the special scope setup. I called and asked if I should do the 20/20 deal and have them sight it in, but they said no, they do that on the R1s anyway so the 10/10 is good enough.

Fedex tried to deliver it yesterday. They will drop it off tomorrow. I paid the exter fee for adult signature only since I did not want it left on the door stop.