Precision long-range shooting popularity surge?

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Honestly I think what your seeing is the beginning of the next firearm fad.

Back before the current AR/M4gery fad started remember how we were beat over the head with all things m1911? These things are cyclical. The AR thing still has some steam left but I fully predict heavy rifles in major calibers with big optics to steadily become more and more in the forefront as time goes by.

It'll start when a certain level of enthusiasm is reached by shooters, then the manufacturers will start to come onboard then finally the media will start to beat the drum and away we go!!!


I would like to get into it simply because 0-300 is not a challenge anymore for me, unfortunately we don't have a venue here.
 
Over the last 8 years, the number of long-range matches that are something other than NRA Long-Range has increased dramatically. Publicity of these matches has increased, in part due to a bunch of articles that have referred to them. Internet forums have helped this rise, with places like SnipersHide being a focal point for match announcements, etc. Some of these matches have been featured on TV shows.

If we look back to 8 years ago, there were several relatively obscure custom rifle shops that build M24 or M40 rifle "clones" for exorbitant amounts of money, and sometimes they wouldn't shoot great anyway. Now, we have a bunch of regional and national custom rifle builders that build a higher volume of great rifles that perform without all the esoteric military-copy hype.
 
i wouldn't really call it a fad, or associate what i've seen with any sort of negative connotations, but the fact that it's gaining in popularity is what's making me think we're reaching a critical mass in my area that would support matches. Fortunately, I have two ranges near me that are 1000 yrds that have hosted NRA matches for longer than I've been alive. But I specifically think "F-class" and "F-TR" don't really meet the desires of most of the shooters in my area, though they are enjoyable and highly competitive.

So again, the purpose of this thread is an attempt to understand what kind of organized events would new shooters like to see. What would they like to do with those expensive rifles they've been buying?
 
Well, maybe they will stick with civilian types and won't sporterize or permanently alter any decent milsurp rifles.
No serious competitor uses a milsurp rifle.

Personally I like the allure of UKN Distance shooting. I am not saying that known distance is easy. I just find the added difficulty of UKD to be appealing. I am not a huge fan of fast, fast, fast... I'd like to see less emphasis on time and more on shot placement, though that is tough to do on steel. Shooting from a bench is not appealing to me either. I like shooting from "field" positions. Though I have never shot a long range match I'd love to if I had the money for the initial set up.
 
I'd very much like to think that what we're seeing is a growth in the popularity of practically-oriented competitive shooting.

Sports like Bullseye and High Power are waning* while games like USPSA and 3Gun are on the rise. Attendance at national-level matches are up**, new matches are coming online, and more people are interested in exploring their skills and abilities with a rifle under field conditions.

I'm an unabashed AR fan, and so are many 3gun shooters, but it doesn't take much to realize that those guns really begin to hit their practical abilities at around 500-600 yards, and that pushing a rifle to distances beyond that, with smaller targets, is a great challenge and a lot of fun.




*Something that is kind of a bummer, to be honest.

**The folks at NRA Whittington Center said that the turnout for this year's Rocky Mountain 3 Gun match was the highest attendance they've ever had for a match of any sort.
 
taliv, keeping folks interested in anything these days for more than 2 minutes is going to be tough. Sadly, many shooters simply don't want to put in the hard work that it takes to be good at many aspects of long-range shooting. Many will show up with the idea that they're just there to shoot. They won't help set anything up or break anything down. We see this attitude of instant gratification all the time on this forum with novice reloaders. Many of them don't bother to read any manuals or do any research. They inundate the forum with numerous questions in the hope that they'll be spoon fed years of knowledge in 10 minutes just so they can boast to their friends or other THR members how they can crank out 300 rounds an hour. This attitude is becoming ubiquitous to use one of Zak's favorite words. If you want to put together some form of organized shooting match, you'd better plan on plenty of instant gratification with minimal effort or else your attendance will drop lower than whale ****!! Just my $0.02 based on first hand experience.

:)
 
well, i started a 3gun match last year, so i know what to expect regarding help setting up.

still, i'm hopeful after an event, some percentage will become instantly addicted and work to make it better for everybody
 
taliv said:
still, i'm hopeful after an event, some percentage will become instantly addicted and work to make it better for everybody

In my experience this is a VERY small percentage because most people are lazy or self-absorbed and simply don't want to put the work in. As Zak has mentioned, and as anyone that runs a match knows, it's HARD work, and finding conscientious, hard-working, like-minded individuals is tough. This is the biggest problem to setting up and mainting any form of regular shooting match. 1% will end up doing all the work for the other 99%!! Our club is a CLUB, not a business, so it pisses me off when shooters show up, pay the match fee and then expect to be catered to. This is fine and expected for a business, but for a club ... I think not. I'm shooting tomorrow, Friday and Saturday, but will be running the pits on Sunday. I don't get paid to do that, I do it because I enjoy shooting and I appreciate the oportunity that the military has given us. I also want others to have a good match and that means that someone has to make a sacrifice.

:)
 
maybe you should move to The South :) around here, 2 or 3 people help set up and everybody tears down after the matches.

still, i'd like to keep the thread focused on what kind of events people want
 
Matches like the Sporting Rifle Match (SRM) at NRAWC are much different to set up than 3Gun or USPSA matches. The only reason the SRM is viable as a monthly match is that the only setup we have to do each month is to re-erect about 8 targets (we simply knock some of them down after the match so they aren't visible from the road) and paint all about 70 targets white so everything is fresh. The stages don't change month to month and we can leave the targets out in the terrain.

Setting up new LR rifle stages in the field is very time and labor intensive, usually involving hiking where vehicles cannot go carrying heavy targets and stands, with radios and a spotter or two at the proposed shoot location. This is why setup for the Steel Safari is a big deal, considering we never want to repeat a stage exactly the same from the year before.
 
that's more a function of your terrain though. Around here, I can still drive to every place i want to put a steel target.
 
taliv said:
Around here, I can still drive to every place i want to put a steel target.

OK ... so back to your specific situation ... what limitations do you have? How much space is available to you, do you have to shoot in one direction only, is this a 1000 yard square range, how about terrain, safety, etc? Surely, these considerations are going to play a major role in determining the type of shooting you can offer to people. What have you come up with so far?

All this talk of practical shooting reminds me of the practical shotgun matches we used to run in England back in the early to mid '80s. The Government shut us down after a couple of years since they were convinced that we were putting together a militia of sorts. The president/founder of the club was a millionaire called Ray Edmondson who owned Hunter Plastics. His name was on a government watch list for years. It was great fun though, and we did come cool stuff such as shooting from moving vehicles, and simple assault courses where you'd hand your shotgun off to a marshal and pick it up on the other side. We even had stages using old barns and cowsheds ... a CQB of sorts. All of the targets were steel plates and basically everyone had Remington semi-auto shotguns with pistol grips. It was easy to run these matches since shotguns don't have the range concerns of centerfire rifles so all we needed was to pay off a farmer with some land for a long weekend.

:)
 
I'll weigh in because i've been trying for 6 years or more to start shooting the Mid-/Long Range matches offered at the two closest ranges to me.

While i have not "recently purchased my first precision rifle" (my current 700 SPS-V is #3) Overall I consider myself a rank amature at most if not all aspects of this type of shooting. (<= remember this point. I have an oppinion, but even I don't know if it's worth anything)

what i am currently interested in is F-Class, F-(T/R) to be more exact. this is mainly because that is what is readily available in my area (F-T/R because i'm more comfortable with it's slightly more narrow gear requirements). If other match types were available, and i felt up to the challenges both technical and physical presented by them. I would gladly participate in other types of mid to long range shooting.

If you don't mind i'll quote some of the questions in the Original Post and go through answering each as pertains to me

for instance, do you want to be on a timer, but only shoot from a comfy prone position? or do you want to shoot from trees, creek beds, stairwells and standing but not be rushed?
I know this doesn't help but, actually both types of shoot appeal to me in different ways. shooting something like F-class, at a known distance, from an established, stable, "standardized" firing line/point, fairly constrained time limits would seem to almost be a necessity to keep things moving along.

If on the other hand the match required me to establish my own firing point within a set area using only the enviroment and what i had on my own back, then range and engage a target at UKD. Well i'd still beleive a time limit to be a good thing, but it of course would need to be quite a bit more generous.:)


do you want to shoot large paper or steel targets? or eggs and tennis balls?

Bias toward paper for KD type matches, steel for the "Challenge" type matches.
eggs, tennis balls, etc.. while they maybe cool to shoot/watch, many such things create an additional "mess" that those organizing and running the match can and mostly should spare themselves from. want a small or odd target for a match? see if you can get the shop to make something from any bits left over from making your main steel targets

how many rounds would you want to shoot per match?

a single day? on something similar to F-class 100rds and that wold be stretching it. I think there is a reason that most matches i've seen stop at 66rds (3 firing periods of 20rds+2sighters), not only is that about what you can fit in time wise before it's time for your shooters to pack up and head home/get a meal. But for the average joe, out of shape American, 66rds is probably going to be his limit without feeling beat up.

Also 100rds per day of shooting is probably the upper limit of what someone "testing the waters" is going to be willing to handload. much less be willing to BUY if they're not yet handloading.


would you still come if it were rifleman format? (i.e. no sighters, no alibis)

Yes, but on this particular point i'm probably not representative of the majority of "new guys".

what about team/individual? would you be willing to work with someone?

I'll take it either way. though I'll admit i'm not at this time at a point in my own abilities where i'd feel comfortable being on a team, b/c i know i'd be a drag on the other guy.

Don't know if it's been mentioned here or elsewhere but one interesting Idea that I came across sometime back was the idea of a prone "Varmint Silhouette" match, smaller targets ( Prairie Dog, crow, Coyote, not sure of 4th critter type and at least in the case of the matc i heard discussed, at greater ranges than standard NRA silhouette.

Ok that's enough of my probably useless rambling. good luck whatever you decide to try and get going.:)
 
I'd like to resurrect this thread and ask a bit more specifically about interest in a

Long range 3gun (precision rifle, carbine, handgun) match:
format would be 2 man team with team score. probably 5-7 stages, 1 day.
Some targets would be designated as (must be neutralized by) handgun targets, some rifle and some shooter discretion.
Targets would be arms length to over 1000 yrds, with at least 3 stages having targets beyond 600 yrds. Primarily steel, with some IPSC cardboard and a little tannerite.

Load-out would be team discretion. i.e. team members could elect to both use carbine/handgun or one could use rifle/handgun and the other carbine/handgun, etc.

Cost would prob be at least $60.
 
That was a one-shot deal in 2006. In 2007, we ran the Camp Guernsey Invitational Multi-Gun (individual, pistol, carbine, long-range rifle) instead. Then in 2008, I took over the Steel Safari.
 
Shooting matches in the style of the Steel Safari is the sort of shooting I've been looking for since I learned I could shoot a rifle decently back in high school. I didn't know it then, of course, but I've always preferred hitting a target accurately at range over the current crop of popular sports such as USPSA/ 3 Gun, etc.
I'd like to shoot under a time limit, but I hate shooting for time where everything is fast-fast-fast. For reference, I shoot IHMSA where there's a 2 minute limit for each string of 5 targets.
Since I already shoot a KD steel sport, I'd like to shoot an UKD steel sport. I do get bored shooting purely for groups, so even my paper shooting varies a bit, like the rimfire tactical challenge targets from SnipersHide.
The idea of hiking about in terrain and shooting from odd positions is appealing, though I've never gotten a chance to try it.
I don't even own a centerfire rifle currently, so a little off the target audience, but my ultimate goal is to get the gear and skills to participate in that style of shooting.
 
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