Private sale across state lines (MD, WV)

[rocknine]

i am a legal resident of maryland but attend west virginia university and spend most of my time in west virginia. I would like to buy a handgun and have seen a few for sale localy that i am interested in. Is it legal for a resident of west virginia to sell me a handgun?

Thanks,
Brad

 

[wdlsguy]

Do you reside in WV part of the year / week and in MD part of the year / week? If so, see "State of residence" in 27 CFR 478.11.

http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_06/27cfr478_06.html

 

[bouis]

I'd say you're probably good to go -- but if by some chance your residency becomes an issue, don't open with, "I'm a legal resident of Maryland."

 

[rocknine]

Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and maintains
a home in State X and a home in State
Y. A resides in State X except for weekends
or the summer months of the year and in
State Y for the weekends or the summer
months of the year. During the time that A
actually resides in State X, A is a resident of
State X, and during the time that A actually
resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

this is a quote from the above link. (thanks for that website by the way)

i live in an apartment off campus and spend more than 3 months at a time w/o corssing the maryland line. I am in maryland a total of 3 months out of the year. But my appartment is in my mothers name but it is my mailing address. How can i prove for a gun sale that i am a resident of west virginia for part of the year when i have a maryland drivers licence?

 

[rocknine]

does this mean i can purchase from a dealer?

 

[bouis]

How can you prove it? Say, "I live here." It doesn't matter whose name the apartment is in or anything like that.

 

[Just_a_dude_with_a_gun]

where ever your driver's license is issued, or own or rent property year round,
you should be able to purchase through a dealer. Shops fall back to the ATF's
discretion.

Just change where your license is issued, from Maryland to W.Va, and get a carry permit for West Va.

 

[rocknine]

haha ok that will work for the private sales. what about at a dealer? when i show them my drivers licence to do the background check they might not want to sell me a handgun.

 

[Just_a_dude_with_a_gun]

They will not sell you a gun if they want to keep their FFL license.

If 'face to face' private sales are legal in W.Va, that appears to be your only legal path towards purchasing a pistol.

I'm not sure if W.VA requires forms to be filled out AND filed with local/state Law enforcement regarding face to face purchases. If this is the case, you may find that a private party will refuse to sell you the pistol.

 

[wdlsguy]

You could always get a WV driver's license, seeing as you spend 9 months per year there.

 

[rocknine]

i would get a wv licence but i'll be living in maryland year round when i graduate in a year.

wva does not register handguns so there wont but much/any paperwork.

 

[PinnedAndRecessed]

Check me on this one, but if you reside in MD it's a violation of federal law for you to purchase a handgun in WV.

Call the ATF to find out.

 

[only1asterisk]

If you live in West Virginia now, all you have to do is take yourself to the DMV with you MD license and whatever other proof of residency that they require and get yourself a West Virginia drivers license. Become a official resident of WV instead of a de facto resident and don't worry about finding a loophole. If you want to be a Maryland resident next May, that's fine, the process is cheap and easy to reverse.

David

 

[only1asterisk]

Oh, and come shoot with myself and some of the other Mo'town THR people.

David

 

[American_Pit_Bull]

FYI

Although private transfers of handguns in WV do not need to go through a FFL; the seller can only legally sell the handgun to a resident of WV.

If he sells to you and you get pulled over with the gun and the LEOs want to pursue the firearms origin, you may be in for a long night trying to interpret the language of The Gun Control Act to them.

If you do not have a WV drivers license, I would definitely advise you not to purchase any firearms in FTF transactions in WV, in which you would rely on "grey area" interpretations of the law.

 

[rocknine]

this is starting to sound bad. i think i'm gonna take the handgun safety course when i go home for thanksgiving this week then shop around maybe find a gun i want and buy it and then by the time i'm back home again for winter break in 3 weeks i'll be able to pick it up.

 

[raxafarian]

atf residency

from the ATF website:

(B11) What constitutes residency in a State? [Back]

The State of residence is the State in which an individual is present; the individual also must have an intention of making a home in that State. A member of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. If a member of the Armed Forces maintains a home in one State and the member’s permanent duty station is in a nearby State to which he or she commutes each day, then the member has two States of residence and may purchase a firearm in either the State where the duty station is located or the State where the home is maintained. An alien who is legally in the United States is considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in that State and has resided in that State continuously for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale of the firearm. See also Item 5, “Sales to Aliens in the United States,” in the General Information section of this publication.

[18 U.S.C. 921(b), 922(a) (3), and 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.11]

(B12) May a person (who is not an alien) who resides in one State and owns property in another State purchase a handgun in either State? [Back]

If a person maintains a home in 2 States and resides in both States for certain periods of the year, he or she may, during the period of time the person actually resides in a particular State, purchase a handgun in that State. However, simply owning property in another State does not qualify the person to purchase a handgun in that State.

[27 CFR 478.11]

also from a ruling on the atf website: http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/rulings.pdf

27 CFR 178.11: MEANING OF TERMS
An out-of-State college student may establish residence in a State by residing
and maintaining a home in a college dormitory or in a location off-campus
during the school term.
ATF Rul. 80-21
"State of residence" is defined by regulation in 27 CFR 178.11 as the
State in which an individual regularly resides or maintains a home. The
regulation also provides an example of an individual who maintains a home in
State X and a home in State Y. The individual regularly resides in State X
except for the summer months and in State Y for the summer months of the year.
The regulation states that during the time the individual actually resides in
State X he is a resident of State X, and during the time he actually resides
in State Y he is a resident of State Y.
Applying the above example to out-of -State college students it is held,
that during the time the students actually reside in a college dormitory or at
Page 18
an off -campus location they are considered residents of the State where the
dormitory or off-campus home is located. During the time out-of -State college
students actually reside in their home State they are considered residents of
their home State.
[ATFB 1980 -4 25]

 

[PinnedAndRecessed]

this is starting to sound bad.

You have no idea how bad it could get.

If you get caught illegally purchasing a firearm, you may lose all of your rights to own a gun. Any gun.

 

[raxafarian]

This is starting to sound bad

Why? If he's in school and not on summer break or taking a semester off...he's a resident of that state.

I quoted laws above so you can research it and not have to guess.

 

[raxafarian]

proving your address

i live in an apartment off campus and spend more than 3 months at a time w/o corssing the maryland line. I am in maryland a total of 3 months out of the year. But my appartment is in my mothers name but it is my mailing address. How can i prove for a gun sale that i am a resident of west virginia for part of the year when i have a maryland drivers licence?

School ID or something from the school showing you are enrolled fulltime.

Electric bill, cable bill, phone bill showing your name and address.

If those are all in your mother's name...does WV have a state id you can get?


Any local gunshops near you? Go talk to the owner and explain the situation. Take copies of the ATF ruling that specifies student residency.


The law seems pretty clear cut that this is allowed.

...Applying the above example to out-of -State college students it is held,
that during the time the students actually reside in a college dormitory or at
an off -campus location they are considered residents of the State where the
dormitory or off-campus home is located. During the time out-of -State college
students actually reside in their home State they are considered residents of
their home State.

 

[Ohen Cepel]

Use this opportunity to flee Maryland! Change everything you can to WV, make yourself legal there and then you have no issues.

Or, buy in MD and pay their higher prices and put up with all the MD BS.

Choice is clear for me (I'm counting the days till I can flee MD )

I wouldn't push the law and it sounds like what you're trying is wrong to me (I'm not a legal expert though). I'm sure a prosecutor wouldn't have a hard time smoking you if your only connection to WV is school. That counts for almost nothing when it comes to residency since so many people go to school out of state.

Drivers liscence, paying taxes, car reg., voting, those things will count and make you legal. Going to school is a temporary proposition and doesn't count for much unless you show intent to make that state your home.

I wouldn't risk it. Either leave MD or put up with the BS. It's rare that you can be "legal" in 2 states and I don't see school meeting that reqiurement.

 

[rocknine]

i would leave maryland but one of the reasons i am buying a handgun instead of another rifle is because my mom is not a gun lover to say the least. what she doesnt know wont hurt her but if she knew i was buying another gun she would find a way to make me sell it in a hurry. the hand gun is easy to put some where that she wont find it. i dont think my folks would like me becoming a wv resident for "no reason".